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What does this have to do with god?
You cannot prove the statement is true by using science.
Yes, I do see the flaw in this argument.
round and round and round we go.
Perhaps if you stopped being dishonest, you would no longer be accused of being dishonest?
see, here are two blatantly dishonest statements from you.
Technology changing over time is evolution of a sort, but it isn't Darwinian.
Yes it did; however, your source, Evolution Resources From the National Academies, was wrong in saying that evolution was both a theory and a fact, particularly in its title. And being a very reputable source I find this surprising. Usually they're far more careful.
Do you realize what you are asking us to swallow? Your version of events is more fanciful than ours and requires much more gullibility IMO.
Micro evolution is evolution, you agree it is a fact and say that nobody is denying it - well case closed. Micro evolution is a fact as you admit. Micro evolution is evolution.Can we get one thing crystal clear here.....no one is disputing that adaptation (micro-evolution) is a fact. All creatures have the ability to change characteristics within their own genetics to adapt to climate change or food source alterations. None of that is in dispute. What is in dispute is whether it is a stretch to assume that these small changes can somehow leap into the realms of fantasy where science is "assuming" some things by inference, and taking it into the realms of fantasy, where proof becomes a matter of interpreting the findings in the fossil record in favor of their theory.
This is just funny. What is the natural conclusion from this fact? Why does the Vit C factor have to link them like it can only mean one thing? The deductive powers of science are skewed to add up to their own ridiculous conclusions. It can mean more than one thing....just like the pelvis in a whale may be more useful than first thought....not vestigial at all. The creature's natural diet would more than make up for any Vit C deficiency. Both are designed to obtain plenty of Vit C without even being aware that they need it.
No, I 'm sorry...it is not an explanation of facts at all...it is an explanation of how they "think" the facts add up.
If their facts are not facts to begin with, then how is there any certainty to their conclusions? Opinions, even professional ones are only opinions.
I thought this was interesting.....from your link. (It's the same site I quoted before)
"It is time for students of the evolutionary process, especially those who have been misquoted and used by the creationists, to state clearly that evolution is a fact, not theory, and that what is at issue within biology are questions of details of the process and the relative importance of different mechanisms of evolution."
OK, so what do we have here? "Questions about the details of the process and the relative importance of different mechanisms of evolution."
Since the fossil record is far from complete and the mechanisms of evolution are for the most part unknown, how can things be stated as facts?
"It is a fact that the earth with liquid water, is more than 3.6 billion years old."
The Bible does not argue with this, though creationists might. I am not a creationist. I believe in intelligent design but not that God started life and allowed it to evolve mindlessly from single called organisms over millions of years.
"It is a fact that cellular life has been around for at least half of that period and that organized multicellular life is at least 800 million years old."
Cellular life still exists...we are all cellular beings. We are all made from the same raw materials, but humans are vastly superior to any apes in ability and language. Why is it assumed that there must have been ape-like cavemen? Primitive peoples co-exist with modern civilisation even now. What does it prove? The illustrations that are presented in science text books and Internet sources as factual reconstructions, are nothing more than the imaginings of scientists. This is what they "think" the bodies of these creatures looked like. They aren't photographs.
It is a fact that palaeontologist have discovered fossils in the strata but as the comment quoted in my previous posts (in blue) suggested, the strata is not even an infallible indicator of when these creatures existed. When changes to the environment are taken into consideration, upheavals or erosion or floods could have messed up the whole story.
"It is a fact that major life forms now on earth were not at all represented in the past. There were no birds or mammals 250 million years ago."
This also agrees with the Bible. The order of appearance in Genesis is as science asserts.
How did Moses know the order in which living things appeared?
Then six "days" (creative periods of unstated length) in preparing the earth for living creatures. (3-31)
Calling them "days" in no way limits them to 24 hour periods.
Day 1: light; day and night (3-5)
Day 2: expanse (6-8)
Day 3: dry land and vegetation (9-13)
Day 4: heavenly luminaries become visible. (14-19)
Day 5: fish and birds (20-23)
Day 6: land animals and humans (24-31)
"It is a fact that major life forms of the past are no longer living. There used to be dinosaurs and Pithecanthropus, and there are none now."
We have seen many extinctions of creatures that were long gone before man even arrived, so again. What does this prove? Did they have a purpose before we got here and their services were no longer required? Who knows? Science doesn't and neither do we.We simply aren't told.
"It is a fact that all living forms come from previous living forms."
This is true but evolutionist shy away from discussion about it, because they simply cannot explain how life suddenly sprang into existence. It is impossible for science to create life. They can pass it on but all they can really do is guess about how it changed from a single called organism into all the life we see on earth past and present. What they lack in evidence is more than made up for by their imagination.
"Therefore, all present forms of life arose from ancestral forms that were different. Birds arose from nonbirds and humans from nonhumans."
Now we see the sleight of hand in the wording.....from "ancestral forms" to "birds from non-birds and humans from non-humans"......where are these chains of evolving ancestral forms who were not birds and who were not human?
Show them to us....not in illustrated form but in the flesh (or bone or fossil) and show us how science arrived at their conclusions without using speculation and assumption about what "might have" or "could have" taken place.
"No person who pretends to any understanding of the natural world can deny these facts any more than she or he can deny that the earth is round, rotates on its axis, and revolves around the sun."
And you can really compare something that is provable and with something that isn't, and pretend that they are the same?....they are not even in the same ball park.
The earth is a "Goldilocks" planet.....just the right distance from the sun in the right part of our galaxy....it is just the right size and shape and spins at just the right speed at just the right tilt on its axis and it has just the right mixture of gases so that living things can breathe oxygen without fear of lightning a fire and everything exploding? All just random chance of course....nothing designed about any of that.
We have this miracle substance called water that just happens to be vital to all life on earth, yet in its natural state in the oceans it is too salty for land dwelling animals to drink a drop of it. In order for water to be drinkable it has to have the salt removed....by an amazing process called precipitation.....which is just another fluke of nature. No design there either.
Green vegetation is also the stuff of life. Other living things on this planet survive by consuming living plants which serve the purpose feeding everything that eats vegetation, whilst at the same time, grass and trees stabilized the topsoil so that they prevent erosion.
Trees just happen to breathe in what we breathe out and vice versa.....again just an incredibly useful accident of nature.
When death occurs among living organisms, again co-incidentally, creatures in abundance feast on the corpse and absorb its nutrients back into other living things which feed other living things and replenish the planet and life itself itself.....and there we have an amazing symbiotic Eco-system that again just popped up out of nowhere.
You have gone nowhere close to convincing me of the "facts" of evolution, when I contemplate what you guys gloss over as if it's all just part of the fantasy.
And what are "the various forces in molding evolution"? A bunch of clever men, with slippery language making sure that God goes away in the hearts and minds of those who don't see through their agenda.
You can all believe as you wish....but I hope you can see why I can't swallow most of it. The small amount of truth that is offered by science does not mask the vast amount of guesswork that others will blindly accept as "gospel".
Bunyip....micro-evolution is adaptation...nothing more. It is not proof of one form of life evolving into another form of life.
It is evolution. Notice how the second word in 'micro evolution' is 'evolution'? Besodes which macro evolution has also been observed. It is a fact, an observed fact.
What? The modern horse evolved from a small deer like creature.
Their ancestors did.
Of course science has such proof. What point do you think there is in your denying it?
Yeah, but according to this member - god made the laws of physics and so on, so god would be redundant to evolution anyway. So it seems a pointless deception.
They are the best sort.Well, they do say God is an absentee landlord.