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He will be called "Nazarene"...

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
The irony is that it wasn't called "Nazareth" during Jesus' time . . ..

. . . Would you be so kind as to let the historians and the printers of the New Testament know so they can rewrite history and the New Testament to better reflect your idiosyncratic understanding? :)



John
 
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Dimi95

Прaвославие!
The irony is that it wasn't called "Nazareth" during Jesus' time, so my guess is that it was changed in the scriptures to that somewhat later.
Metis , you are wrong here , let me at least explain why do i say this

Archaeologists have been excavating first-century Nazareth since the mid-2000's.
The town of Nazareth (and not just the title 'of Nazareth') is named in all four gospels. The synoptic gospels were written before the death od Peter and Paul. Considering that the Messiah was expected to come from Bethlehem in the country of Judea, it makes absolutely no sense to claim that the early Church, within the next years of the crucifixion, fabricated an entire home town for Jesus and then placed it in the wrong country. It makes even less sense that the gospel of John would go out of its way to note that Nazareth had a less than stellar reputation among the Judeans. And it makes even less sense that the early Church would try to sell all of this to actual Galileans within the next years of when the events supposedly took place.

The town of Nazareth is mentioned by Origen and Julius Africanus in the second century. A fourth century Jewish inscription mentions that the town of Nazareth existed in the early second century, around the time of the Bar Kokhba revolt. The fourth century historian Eusebius, who lived within fifty miles of Nazareth, mentions it in his Ecclesiastical History.

it really doesn't matter that there's no mention of Nazareth dating from before the third century, because archaeological studies of the area show that not only was it there, but it had been there for at least five hundred years before the time of Jesus. In fact there's evidence of some sort of settlement in the area going back well into the stone age.

And if we take that analogy , I can also prove Julius Ceasar didn't exist. It might sound crazy, but if you ignore all the references to Julius Ceasar written before the third century, then, amazingly, there are no references to Julius Ceasar before the third century! None whatsoever!
Apart from those there are, obviously, but they are clearly made up, because if he really existed there would be references to him,apart from those ones. So it is a conspiracy...

We don't make conclusions like that.

There are references to Nazareth in the first century.
There are references to Nazareth in the second century.
There are references to Nazareth in the third century.
There are no references to Nazareth before the first century because it was a place of no importance where nothing ever happened.But it was there, it is checked. And once somebody important was born there it got mentioned repeatedly thereafter.

There is absolutely no historical problem with the existence of Nazareth and no reason to suppose Jesus wasn't from there.

An excavation of a first century home in… take a guess...

nazareth.jpg
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
. . . Would you be so kind as to let the historians and the printers of the New Testament know that so that they can rewrite history and the New Testament to better reflect your idiosyncratic understanding? :)



John

No, I got my information from BAR, so what's your source for denying they might be right?
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Metis , you are wrong here , let me at least explain why do i say this

Archaeologists have been excavating first-century Nazareth since the mid-2000's.
The town of Nazareth (and not just the title 'of Nazareth') is named in all four gospels. The synoptic gospels were written before the death od Peter and Paul. Considering that the Messiah was expected to come from Bethlehem in the country of Judea, it makes absolutely no sense to claim that the early Church, within the next years of the crucifixion, fabricated an entire home town for Jesus and then placed it in the wrong country. It makes even less sense that the gospel of John would go out of its way to note that Nazareth had a less than stellar reputation among the Judeans. And it makes even less sense that the early Church would try to sell all of this to actual Galileans within the next years of when the events supposedly took place.

The town of Nazareth is mentioned by Origen and Julius Africanus in the second century. A fourth century Jewish inscription mentions that the town of Nazareth existed in the early second century, around the time of the Bar Kokhba revolt. The fourth century historian Eusebius, who lived within fifty miles of Nazareth, mentions it in his Ecclesiastical History.

it really doesn't matter that there's no mention of Nazareth dating from before the third century, because archaeological studies of the area show that not only was it there, but it had been there for at least five hundred years before the time of Jesus. In fact there's evidence of some sort of settlement in the area going back well into the stone age.

And if we take that analogy , I can also prove Julius Ceasar didn't exist. It might sound crazy, but if you ignore all the references to Julius Ceasar written before the third century, then, amazingly, there are no references to Julius Ceasar before the third century! None whatsoever!
Apart from those there are, obviously, but they are clearly made up, because if he really existed there would be references to him,apart from those ones. So it is a conspiracy...

We don't make conclusions like that.

There are references to Nazareth in the first century.
There are references to Nazareth in the second century.
There are references to Nazareth in the third century.
There are no references to Nazareth before the first century because it was a place of no importance where nothing ever happened.But it was there, it is checked. And once somebody important was born there it got mentioned repeatedly thereafter.

There is absolutely no historical problem with the existence of Nazareth and no reason to suppose Jesus wasn't from there.

An excavation of a first century home in… take a guess...

View attachment 97783
See my post above.

Names sometimes change over the centuries; thus authors of texts would update the names or readers wouldn't know what the scriptural references are to.

"The Old Testament does not reference Nazareth by name in any of its thirty-nine books. Neither does the historian Josephus. There could be several explanations for this..."
 

Dimi95

Прaвославие!
See my post above.

Names sometimes change over the centuries; thus authors of texts would update the names or readers wouldn't know what the scriptural references are to.
Metis,we are now 2024 , this analogy makes no sense to me.
They never used footnotes as they are in the Bible for examples.
They just used the terms appropriete in their time.Some leave explenations , some not.This depends on the individual and has nothing to do with consistency.
Consensus as we have today and in ancient times is not the same.

We make conclusions based on the things we know.

We know that Nazareth is not mentioned in the Old Testament because it was tiny village, located in Galilee (not Judea, where most of the action of the OT takes place), and it was abandoned from the time of the Assyrian conquest (8 BC) to the early Roman period (1 BC).This does not mean that nobody lived there , it means that there were almost no people there.
During the time of Jesus, this village had an all-Jewish population of around 300-500.

Interesting that many scholars are saying that Jesus could not have come from this village because it was so small. Yet that is exactly the reason why Joseph elected to settle there. He was looking for a place where he and his family could disappear 'off the radar' as he feared that there might be another attempt on Jesus' life if he was known to be back in Israel.

"The Old Testament does not reference Nazareth by name in any of its thirty-nine books. Neither does the historian Josephus. There could be several explanations for this..."
Not everything must be referenced by name.

The Gospels do and other sources also.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Metis,we are now 2024 , this analogy makes no sense to me.
They never used footnotes as they are in the Bible for examples.
They just used the terms appropriete in their time.Some leave explenations , some not.This depends on the individual and has nothing to do with consistency.
Consensus as we have today and in ancient times is not the same.

We make conclusions based on the things we know.

We know that Nazareth is not mentioned in the Old Testament because it was tiny village, located in Galilee (not Judea, where most of the action of the OT takes place), and it was abandoned from the time of the Assyrian conquest (8 BC) to the early Roman period (1 BC).This does not mean that nobody lived there , it means that there were almost no people there.
During the time of Jesus, this village had an all-Jewish population of around 300-500.

Interesting that many scholars are saying that Jesus could not have come from this village because it was so small. Yet that is exactly the reason why Joseph elected to settle there. He was looking for a place where he and his family could disappear 'off the radar' as he feared that there might be another attempt on Jesus' life if he was known to be back in Israel.


Not everything must be referenced by name.

The Gospels do and other sources also.
The name of places likely were updated if there was a change or readers of the Bible would be clueless as to what was being referenced. Remember, the NT was written in Koine Greek [and quite possibly originally in Aramaic] hundreds of years before the oldest texts we have.
 
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