Homosexuality is NOT a choice!

[Evandr2]

I really think that people just are homosexual, or just are heterosexual. To suggest that the are made is to subtly suggest that they can be made to play for the "right" team again. The fact is that many conservatives don't want them to just "be" homosexual because then they would have to explain how God could create them "that way" if it's a sin. In order for their interpretation of morality to be "right," homosexuals have to be "made" and not "born."

Excellent point sojouner, God would not create a person to be something and then condemn them for it.

There is something that people are not likely to consider about the existence of mankind. That is the likelihood that life does not begin at conception. There is Biblical evidence that we existed before this earthly probation. This earth life is where the strength of who we became in the pre-existence is tested to see if we will keep the commandments of God without the reward of obedience being dangled in front of us. Obedience by righteousness cannot be determined that way.

The purpose of God is to bring about the eternal life and exaltation of mankind. The only way our Heavenly Father can gain eternal increase as God is by our personal growth and ability to become part of His eternal family the way my family continues to grow by my children's children and their children and so on. Some may not like it but eternal family growth requires the intervention of eternal law. Man is not without the woman nor is the woman without the man in the Lord.

Our Heavenly Father wants only the best for us and that includes eternal increase in His realm. We cannot do that is we fail to live the law of eternal companionship between a man and a woman who have proven worthy of the privilege.

I believe that Homosexuality is a choice but where that choice began and then developed may not have been in mortality. It may have begun long before that. The choice is, and always has been, ours. It is obvious that it distresses our Heavenly Father either way for He will have to deny the transgressor the greatest blessing that we can be given. In mortality our tendency toward homosexuality may be very real but failure to properly prepare for this grand mortal phase of our eternal existence does not release a person from the consequences of that failure.

I guess the bottom line is this. Homosexuals are, with few exceptions, good and loving people who have issues that they need to work out with God, not you or I. We should love all people as the brothers and sisters they are but at the same time, never let them loose sight of the fact that we believe their sexual preference is an affront to God and an eternally dangerous path to follow.

here's the point I'm making: We're interested in how homosexual come about, because we need to resolve the moral question. If that were not the case, and our interest was purely scientific, then why are we so interested in how homosexuals come about, and not just as interested in how heterosexuals come about?

We have the right to help decide our social structure and the consequences to disobedience of the laws that guide our society. The better we understand the workings of the human mind the better and more justly we can create guidelines for the betterment and good of the whole societal unit. Heterosexuality between a man and a woman has been established as the norm by both spiritual and temporal philosophies and until that changes, interest in what brings about what is considered abnormal behavior by the majority will receive the attention and investigation of the majority.

Let's leave the spiritual judgments to God and try to keep His commandments. We must respect (and expect respect for) the rights of all to exorcise free agency as they see fit.

Vandr

 

[standing_alone]

What can love between two men achieve, they can father no children, which is the Whole reason of sex, TO HAVE CHILDREN

There is no "whole reason of sex." Sure, procreation is one reason to have sex, but one can also have sex for pleasure and to further bond with their partner.

 

[Evandr2]

I really think that people just are homosexual, or just are heterosexual. To suggest that the are made is to subtly suggest that they can be made to play for the "right" team again. The fact is that many conservatives don't want them to just "be" homosexual because then they would have to explain how God could create them "that way" if it's a sin. In order for their interpretation of morality to be "right," homosexuals have to be "made" and not "born."

Excellent point sojouner, God would not create a person to be something and then condemn them for it.

There is something that people are not likely to consider about the existence of mankind. That is the likelihood that life does not begin at conception. There is Biblical evidence that we existed before this earthly probation. This earth life is where the strength of who we became in the pre-existence is tested to see if we will keep the commandments of God without the reward of obedience being dangled in front of us. Obedience by righteousness cannot be determined that way.

The purpose of God is to bring about the eternal life and exaltation of mankind. The only way our Heavenly Father can gain eternal increase as God is by our personal growth and ability to become part of His eternal family the way my family continues to grow by my children's children and their children and so on. Some may not like it but eternal family growth requires the intervention of eternal law. Man is not without the woman nor is the woman without the man in the Lord.

Our Heavenly Father wants only the best for us and that includes eternal increase in His realm. We cannot do that is we fail to live the law of eternal companionship between a man and a woman who have proven worthy of the privilege.

I believe that Homosexuality is a choice but where that choice began and then developed may not have been in mortality. It may have begun long before that. The choice is, and always has been, ours. It is obvious that it distresses our Heavenly Father either way for He will have to deny the transgressor the greatest blessing that we can be given. In mortality our tendency toward homosexuality may be very real but failure to properly prepare for this grand mortal phase of our eternal existence does not release a person from the consequences of that failure.

I guess the bottom line is this. Homosexuals are, with few exceptions, good and loving people who have issues that they need to work out with God, not you or I. We should love all people as the brothers and sisters they are but at the same time, never let them loose sight of the fact that we believe their sexual preference is an affront to God and an eternally dangerous path to follow.

here's the point I'm making: We're interested in how homosexual come about, because we need to resolve the moral question. If that were not the case, and our interest was purely scientific, then why are we so interested in how homosexuals come about, and not just as interested in how heterosexuals come about?

We have the right to help decide our social structure and the consequences to disobedience of the laws that guide our society. The better we understand the workings of the human mind the better and more justly we can create guidelines for the betterment and good of the whole societal unit. Heterosexuality between a man and a woman has been established as the norm by both spiritual and temporal philosophies and until that changes, interest in what brings about what is considered abnormal behavior by the majority will receive the attention and investigation of the majority.

Let's leave the spiritual judgments to God and try to keep His commandments. We must respect (and expect respect for) the rights of all to exorcise free agency as they see fit.

Vandr

 

[Buttons*]

the world is suffering due to its high populations anyway... whats wrong with the gay community?

my god, people will stop flooding the earth and destroying its beauty, how tragic

 

[standing_alone]

I believe that Homosexuality is a choice but where that choice began and then developed may not have been in mortality.

Believe whatever you wish, but I can assure you that being a homosexual was no choice I made.

 

[Evandr2]

I really think that people just are homosexual, or just are heterosexual. To suggest that the are made is to subtly suggest that they can be made to play for the "right" team again. The fact is that many conservatives don't want them to just "be" homosexual because then they would have to explain how God could create them "that way" if it's a sin. In order for their interpretation of morality to be "right," homosexuals have to be "made" and not "born."

Excellent point sojouner, God would not create a person to be something and then condemn them for it.

There is something that people are not likely to consider about the existence of mankind. That is the likelihood that life does not begin at conception. There is Biblical evidence that we existed before this earthly probation. This earth life is where the strength of who we became in the pre-existence is tested to see if we will keep the commandments of God without the reward of obedience being dangled in front of us. Obedience by righteousness cannot be determined that way.

The purpose of God is to bring about the eternal life and exaltation of mankind. The only way our Heavenly Father can gain eternal increase as God is by our personal growth and ability to become part of His eternal family the way my family continues to grow by my children's children and their children and so on. Some may not like it but eternal family growth requires the intervention of eternal law. Man is not without the woman nor is the woman without the man in the Lord.

Our Heavenly Father wants only the best for us and that includes eternal increase in His realm. We cannot do that is we fail to live the law of eternal companionship between a man and a woman who have proven worthy of the privilege.

I believe that Homosexuality is a choice but where that choice began and then developed may not have been in mortality. It may have begun long before that. The choice is, and always has been, ours. It is obvious that it distresses our Heavenly Father either way for He will have to deny the transgressor the greatest blessing that we can be given. In mortality our tendency toward homosexuality may be very real but failure to properly prepare for this grand mortal phase of our eternal existence does not release a person from the consequences of that failure.

I guess the bottom line is this. Homosexuals are, with few exceptions, good and loving people who have issues that they need to work out with God, not you or I. We should love all people as the brothers and sisters they are but at the same time, never let them loose sight of the fact that we believe their sexual preference is an affront to God and an eternally dangerous path to follow.

here's the point I'm making: We're interested in how homosexual come about, because we need to resolve the moral question. If that were not the case, and our interest was purely scientific, then why are we so interested in how homosexuals come about, and not just as interested in how heterosexuals come about?

We have the right to help decide our social structure and the consequences to disobedience of the laws that guide our society. The better we understand the workings of the human mind the better and more justly we can create guidelines for the betterment and good of the whole societal unit. Heterosexuality between a man and a woman has been established as the norm by both spiritual and temporal philosophies and until that changes, interest in what brings about what is considered abnormal behavior by the majority will receive the attention and investigation of the majority.

Let's leave the spiritual judgments to God and try to keep His commandments. We must respect (and expect respect for) the rights of all to exorcise free agency as they see fit.

Vandr

 

[Booko]

I'm straight and I don't plan on having any children. Does that make me in the wrong too? What if every heterosexual couple didn't want to have children? What would happen? The human race would die out.

You know, it never occured to me, but does this mean the Shakers were evil?

 

[zombieharlot]

There is no "whole reason of sex." Sure, procreation is one reason to have sex, but one can also have sex for pleasure and to further bond with their partner.

Exactly! That's why women have birth control and men get snipped.

 

[standing_alone]

You know, it never occured to me, but does this mean the Shakers were evil?

Oh, them Shakers! *shakes fist*

 

[Evandr2]

this is true. Maybe you could try reading Mr. Garcia's post and deciphering it for me so that I would comprehend the 2 cents he's giving

And to write where people can understand what you're talking about is to get a decent answer

then why did you feel like you had to comment? o.0

Look, I'm generally a respectful, caring, decent (well, okay, not "decent") member of RF. I dont mind when my ideas are criticized. If you want to discuss this further, I'm going to ask you to respect this thread for its intent and PM me with more lessons on how to be kind to others

Thanks![/quote]

You are right, My apologies, in the future I will.:bonk:

 

[Evandr2]

Sorry about the same post appearing three times:slap:

I really do not know how it happened. If you know what I did write me a PM and tell me. Thanks

Vandr

 

[standing_alone]

Sorry about the same post appearing three times:slap:

I really do not know how it happened. If you know what I did write me a PM and tell me. Thanks

Vandr

I think if you go to edit the two extra posts, you should be able to delete them.

 

[Kaikatsu]

(I'm not replying to anyone, or picking a fight... this is just my opinion )

I don't think it matters who a person loves, as long as they actually do love.

I also don't think labels are needed.

Many would say I'm bisexual, but I'm not. I simply don't care about the gender of the one I fall in love with. I don't think it matters either way, and I don't understand how people can say homosexuality is wrong. How can it be wrong? Shouldn't we all just be happy that one of our fellow human beings were able to find love?

I have a lot of homosexual friends, and they're the nicest people I've ever met in my entire life! We're all so close, and the bond of friendship between us all is amazing. I'm so close to one of them that I even call him 'Big brother', even though we're not related.

Anyway, that's simply my opinion. Feel free to disagree, because every person has their own opinions, and just because someone has something to say it doesn't make them right.

I'm sorry if I'm repeating things, but I just wanted to express my opinions.

 

[sojourner]

and until that changes, interest in what brings about what is considered abnormal behavior by the majority will receive the attention and investigation of the majority.

First of all, homosexuality is no longer consedered by the medical and psychological communities to be abnormal.

Second, the "majority" is rarely, if ever, right. Perhaps it's the "majority" that bears our investigation...

 

[Ciscokid]

There's a big difference between your examples and homosexuality. Your examples actually hurt people.

Drinking until you can't work hurts people.

Raping children hurts people.

Violence hurts people.

Stealing hurts people.

Love between two adults hurts nobody.

Tell that to the petite gentlemen in the cooler who shares a bunk with Big Dawg.

 

[sojourner]

Tell that to the petite gentlemen in the cooler who shares a bunk with Big Dawg.

That's not love. It's rape.

 

[muichimotsu]

Indeed. Frankly, it shocks me that any reasonable loving Christian in Christ's love and teachings would say that a certain sexual practice like anal sex is somehow sinful, when frankly, straight couples do much weirder and abnormal things.

Are the Christians also suggesting that Sadomasochism and Bondage, among other sexual deviant practices (deviant meant to be in quotes, btw) are also an affront and sinful to God? Of course, then we seem to have one supporter for the anti-gay side that doesn't seem to realize that their ideas about sex are closer to Catholic than Christian in certain respects. For example, that sex is all about procreation, like the Catholic doesn't care how it feels when you have sex, just as long as you father a child. Oh, wait a minute, what about the guys that God makes infertile, what about them having sex? Is that immoral, even if they have sex with a woman?

And that's what's interesting, is that a lot of religious persecution and oppression is based around what the religious person desginates as the divine mandate about sex. Like God just handed out a pamphlet or a little information video to certain priests "THIS is how sex is supposed to be, tell everybody else, or they burn!" lol, I like to make God a masochist and a sadist a bit too much, it seems.

 

[SoliDeoGloria]

You know, as much as I disagree with the notion that homosexuality is not a choice, I must confess that as a Christan Calvinist, this notion really plays into the notion that if decisions are made due to biological make up, then the only logical conclusion would be that there is no such thing as free will no matter how one tries to make exceptions for it. We may as well call it Secular Calvinism.

I do know some gay people who say they chose to be gay, but the vast majority say they cannot choose or change their sexual orientation, and some subscribe to the "fluid sexuality" idea.

I don't think it's as simple as choice vs. no choice.

I trully appreciate the objective honesty of this statement. Could you please expound what conclusions you have come to on this subject matter?

Sincerely,
SolideoGloria

 

[Malkav's Knight]

The problem we run into now is what is exactly considered homosexuality...The emotion or the action in which you take regarding that emotion.

 

[Jaymes]

I trully appreciate the objective honesty of this statement. Could you please expound what conclusions you have come to on this subject matter?

Just that there are different "types" of homosexuals, I suppose. One born liking members of their same sex, one not born liking members of the same sex but later growing to do so.

Is one more or less homosexual than the other? I wouldn't say so. Some people like green tea the second they drink it, some find it to be an acquired taste. If one person is the former and another is the latter, it doesn't mean that the latter is a terrible person and shouldn't drink green tea or say that they like green tea.