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how can you trust a man made trinity?

truthBtold

Member
THE TRINITY*
The imagery of the Pagan Trinity was fresh in the minds of pagan Rome, Greece, and Egypt. After the ex-pagan Constantine became Emperor of Rome, it was a matter of a few more decades before Christianity became the State religion of the entire Roman Empire.
While Constantine was in power, he became concerned over the different images of Jesus, and in 325CE organized a conference in Nicaea to address the issue of unifying a doctrine declaring they needed a single individual creed that stated Jesus was no longer simply the “son” of God, but was also God. The members present were divided over this issue, and not everyone was willing to accept this pagan concept. Christians were taking up swords against one another, killing those who disagreed with their specific
doctrine.Those opposing the ex-pagan Constantine were either killed or disbarred from the conference.**The Nicene Creed was adopted in 325 and finalized at the second Ecumenical Council in 381 (Council of Constantinople) when the idea of the trinity was confirmed. The concept of a trinity was used in Greek philosophy. And since Christianity for the most part rests on Greek heritage, this trinity was worked out and created as a Christian doctrine by three powerful thinkers, Gregorius of Nyssa, Gregorius of Nazianze, and Basilius the Great. In order to emphasize this point that Jesus was also the Creator, Constantine added the Latin term “homoousios”*in describing the relationship between Jesus and God, meaning “of the same substance”, a term that did not exist in any Christian scriptures. In the end Constantine won, Jesus was declared to be “the same substance as the Father”, unique but the same. As the*Nicaea Creed*states:
We believe in one God the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Spirit of the Virgin Mary, and was made man, and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate. He suffered and was buried, and the third day he rose again according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father. And he shall come again with glory to judge both the quick and the dead, whose kingdom shall have no end. And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father and the Son, who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, who spoke by the prophets. And we believe one holy catholic and apostolic Church. We acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins. And we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.
What this is saying is the Father is God, His Son is God, and the Holy Spirit is God; and yet they are not three Gods, but one God". The fact remains that no author in the NEW testament ever advanced the doctrine of the Trinity. It took many years from the time the last gospel was completed for the defenders of the church to promote this alien creed. However, with the mighty sweep of the pen, the pagan Trinity concept took hold. All of this was approved by Emperor Theodosius, the Trinitarian, who declared Christianity the official state religion of the*Roman Empire. OnFebruary 27, 380 (some historian’s say 381) Theodosius commanded everyone to be a Christian and to believe that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one Godhead and equal in majesty. This, of course, was the position of the Nicene Creed. The Council of Nicea made this “Jesus” God by a vote of hands and the manuscripts were continually altered to reflect such theology. An interesting fact is Tertullian was the first writer to use the term “Trinity” because it is nowhere to be found in the NEW testament. Throughout the ancient world, the concept of a trinity was common. That with the Triad of Horus, Osiris and Isis; and in*Babylon*with the Triad of Ishtar, Sin and Shamash. Therefore, the pagan nations understood the concepts of a Trinity and also of earthly women being impregnated by gods and other heavenly spirits. Keep in mind, the Trinity concept developed during the rule of the pagan Emperors Constantine and Theodosius who worshipped the Sun and pagan gods, which were grouped in threes, or triads. Many pictures in Christian art will show the sun disk around the head of Jesus, Mary and many of their Saints. These same sun disks that was known throughout the pagan world. Some religious organizations such as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, The Church of the New Jerusalem and the Jehovah’s Witnesses accept the Christian Scriptures, and many identify themselves emphatically as Christians while at the same time rejecting the Nicene Creed. BUT, as long as these religions do not accept Jesus as the Son of God (God), other Christians regard them as not being truly Christian, and actually a cult. Another interesting fact is the unknown authors who wrote most of the NEW testament didn’t believe*in the Trinity idea:
•*Mark did not believe—10:17-20 & 13:32 •*Matthew did not believe—20:20-23 & 26:39 & 26:53 •*John did not believe—10:30-34 & 14:28 & 17:3 & 20:17
•*Paul did not believe—1 Corinthians 8:4-6 & 11:3 & Colossians 1:15
•*1 Peter did not believe—1:3
•*1 Timothy did not believe—1:2
Christianity’s attempt to replace God with a human figure is considered idolatry in the Hebrew Bible. To worship man-made God or mistaken theology even with the best intentions is the worst possible transgression against the Creator of the world. Idolatry is the worship of false gods and this applies certainly to the “Jesus” of the NEW testament which is mistakenly depicted as a “literal” and “historical” God in Christian theology. Therefore, any Christian-Jews that considered this image of Jesus idolatry was either forced to leave the Council and return to the religion of Judaism, or accept Paul’s concept of Jesus, which Constantine adapted.
Even in 1 Corinthians 11:3 Paul does not depict Jesus as coequal with God. On the contrary, God is of superior rank to Jesus because Paul wrote; “the head of Christ is God.” Paul clearly separates God and Jesus in 1 Timothy 2:5; “For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the "MAN" Christ Jesus.” This places a considerable strain on Trinitarianism.
 

StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
Spaces between the paragraphs would be nice.

Aside from that, what is there to discuss/debate that hasn't been beaten to death?
 

Smart_Guy

...
Premium Member
Hello there TruthBtold.

I know I'm late, but welcome to RF :)

Outhouse and Starry didn't meant any harm. People sometimes say things with the point between the lines.

I do find difficulty in reading the passage.

If the edit option is still on, I'll be grateful if you would kindly add some spaces and separate the paragraphs so I can read and understand better.

Thank you :)
 
Last edited:

truthBtold

Member
Hello there TruthBtold.

I know I'm late, but welcome to RF :)

Outhouse and Starry didn't meant any harm. People sometimes say what things with the point between the lines.

I do find difficulty in reading the passage.

If the edit option is still on, I'll be grateful if you would kindly add some spaces and separate the paragraphs so I can read and understand better.

Thank you :)

See now thats how people should talk to someone.. RESPECT U HAVE!!
 

dawny0826

Mother Heathen
The majority of Christians accept the concept of Godhead: Father, Son & Holy Spirit.

The distinction between those who are Trinitarians and those who are not, is that the Trinitarian interprets the Godhead to be ONE.

Most who are non Trinitarians view the Godhead as one in purpose and essence, but, separate in their identity.

Regardless, the Godhead still presents as Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

I suppose my question for those who have such a problem with the Trinity is, why? If it's not directly relative to your faith walk, what's the big deal?

It boils down to biblical interpretation and interpersonal experiences and perceptions of God. You can't prove or disprove another's understanding.
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
dont just drop verses on this thread without anything with it.. isa 9 and ...what? that just shows lack of knowledge.. but anyways here is a good read that i put together...There is an enormous difficulty with the interpretation that the name Elohim signifies a sort of plurality in the godhead; for if Elohim implies a plurality of persons, how can missionaries explain that the identical word Elohim*in*Tanach*refers to Moses as well? Regarding Moses, the Torah says, The Lord said to Moses, “See, I have made thee a*god/Elohim-*אֶלהִים) to Pharaoh, and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.” (Exodus 7:1 KJV). There is no plurality of persons in Moses. The notion that Moses, who is called*Elohim*in the*Torah, possessed more than one person is silly. Moreover, if the name of God is to signify a plurality in the godhead, why wasn’t the name*Jehovah, which is by far the most frequently used name for God in the Jewish Scriptures, also written in the plural?.the word ELohim possesses a plural intensive syntax and is singular in meaning. In Hebrew, the suffix ים (im), mainly indicates a masculine plural. However with*Elohim*the construction is grammatically singular, (i.e. it governs a singular verb or adjective) when referring to the God of Israel, but grammatically plural*elohim*(i.e. taking a plural verb or adjective) when used of pagan divinities (Psalms 96:5; 97:7). This is self-evident from the fact that the verb “created” בָּרָה (bara) in Genesis 1:1 is in the singular. For example, I am certain that many readers are familiar with the Hebrew word חַיִים (chayim), meaning “life.” Notice that this word contains the identical plural suffix “im,”as in*Elohim, yet it repeatedly means “life”, in the singular, throughout the Bible. Examples are: And Rebekah said to Isaac, “I am weary of my life because of the daughters of Heth; if Jacob takes a wife of the daughters of Heth, like these who are the daughters of the land, what good will my life חַיִים* (chayim) be to me?” (Genesis 27:46) You have granted me*life חַיִים*(chayim) and favor, and Your care has preserved my spirit. (Job 10:12) The name of God,*Elohim, does not in any way imply a plural. In the*(NIV), which is a Christian commentary that can not be construed as friendly to the Jewish faith states in the commentary on Genesis 1:1: God created! The Hebrew noun Elohim*is plural but the verb is singular, a normal usage in the OT when reference is to the one true God. This use of the plural expresses intensification rather than number and has been called the plural of majesty, or of potentiality. Finally, it is important that we explore the crucial message which the name*Elohim*conveys to the Children of Israel. They are exalted descriptions of the God of Israel. The name*Elohim comes from the Hebrew root*el, which means “might” or “power.” i can read this stuff backwards , fowards, and side ways.. im not being mean but if u want u can private message me if u want help on learning the bible , thanks
Huh. Everyone worth their salt knows that the plurality of elohim isn't any kind of argument for the Trinity. You're wasting time with a straw man argument. And the straw man is wearing floppy shoes and a red nose.
 
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