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How can your belief be falsified?

Brickjectivity

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
How so? I am neither cold or violent, and this is how I base my beliefs. It also seems self evidence that beliefs without any evidence whatsoever have resulted in "a cold violent world".
I haven't claimed you to be personally cold or violent, but humanity is both. Your personal experience living in a brief bubble of freedom and wealth does not generalize to the overall experience of the human race. Your beliefs began with reason and were never based on anything else? I have a difficult time imagining how you skipped childhood.



Well I'm not an educated man of course, but it seems to me you can do just that, by definition.

Ignorance
noun
  1. lack of knowledge or information.
Fight ignorance merely with knowledge? This needs a bit more dismal reality. There is so much knowledge and reason available, yet knowledgeable people turn away and do nothing or participate in violence. Some fatten themselves with knowledge that they starve others of. Many with the ability to gain knowledge prefer entertainments and treats. More thinking costs more energy, so by default people don't think more. You have to believe first that evidence is something worth straining for, so evidence based belief is useless without choice based belief first. You choose to believe that evidence is required, but you could choose not to. You could choose to sit upon your duff and to learn nothing, too.

Lets not resort to generic condemnation just yet, I rather I was asking people how their beliefs can be falsified, not commenting on why they think it is ok to hold unfalsifiable beliefs, one step at a time if that makes sense.
In the OP you challenge: "If of course they can't then how can you rationally justify disbelieving other unfalsifiable beliefs...?" To which I replied "Belief from the heart (I explain 'Heart' in the last part of this post) without evidence seems to be what paves the way for people to consider and to use evidence based belief." In other words there is no choice for a human but to make belief based choices without evidence, but we can learn to appreciate evidence. The choice to believe in evidence is itself a leap of faith. It is a world accepting choice, a psychological leap. It is not easy for everyone and takes more effort than your giving credit for, as if it were a simple matter of weighing justifications with semantics.

Well yes, hence my question, if one holds one belief that is unfalsifiable, then there is no criteria to disbelieve other unfalsifiable beliefs, not objectively anyway.

Morality is subjective wouldn't you agree?
Why do you think people must justify beliefs if you believe morality to be subjective? It is suggesting we can live peacefully without any shared morality. If you will agree that common morality is a necessity, then I will agree that it is subjective. A subjective but necessary thing perhaps, and then if it is necessary but subjective how do you choose the correct common morality since it is subjective? Its by belief, however you rule out falsifiable belief as a solution when you declare morality to be subjective. If morality is necessary and subjective then so is belief without evidence and perhaps moreso then falsifiable belief.

Well I think good and evil are subjective of course, so the choice must inevitably be subjective.

No offence but I don't know what you mean here? I use my brain to decide what I accept is true, I understand here that heart is a metaphor for emotion, I try not to base belief on emotion, why on earth would I?
Heart is my metaphor for your inner motivational process, not your logical comparative process. Thinking depends upon feelings, all of the desires, motivations and processes already in progress such as habitual thinking. I'm referring to your urges, your feelings, your imaginations and myriad illogical drives many of which make little sense, many of which must be suppressed and ignored at times. Sometimes these are the raw materials that you cobble together into ideas. Fear is a heart thing. You don't logically fear. You just fear, but fear can be a motivation to make decisions. Its like a raw material. Thus you have your heart versus your logical process a process which depends upon but overrides the heart sometimes. Both are part of your brain I would say. When you decide what to accept as true that is often a much smaller part of you making such a decision. It is your final choice, however there is much more going on underneath. Rationality is like a ship upon an ocean of other things, a ship that can be beset by storms. Even a developed person and a mature person has a powerful set of urges and feelings underlying their most rational thinking. These ought to eventually become sources of strength, but they are by nature also chaotic.
 

Suave

Simulated character
A little out side of my pay grade, but since it is a scientific hypothesis it must be falsifiable right?

The square kilometer array radio telescope construction and decade operational costs amount to nearly 2 billion dollars.

The SKA Project - Public Website (skatelescope.org)

I doubt any nation is willing to spend two trillion dollars for a thousand square kilometer array of radio telescopes capable of detecting ancient light absorbed by neutral hydrogen atoms in order to test string theory.

Scientists Propose Test Of String Theory Based On Neutral Hydrogen Absorption -- ScienceDaily
 

John53

I go leaps and bounds
Premium Member
A little out side of my pay grade, but since it is a scientific hypothesis it must be falsifiable right?

I read pay grade as gay parade. I don't know why you need to know this but here it is anyway.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Exactly lack of belief is quite obviously not a belief, thus it does not need to be falsifiable. How many people have falsified the existence of invisible mermaids?

He may have conflated atheism, which for most is just a lack of belief, with hard atheism, which is a statement that God does not exist. The latter does appear to have a burden of proof. Saying "I do not believe due to a lack of evidence" is only asking for evidence. A more than reasonable position to have.

Many theists try to use a broken Tu Quoque fallacy when they demand evidence from an atheist. They seem to think that a person has to believe something.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
So what I am asking is for people who preach or hold beliefs, how can those beliefs be falsified? If
They can't.

A belief is something that has been proved by the person's mind.

What is done is done.

There might be a million ways that just one of their beliefs can be falsified but I think that then they will rest assured that it doesn't matter because ALL the other ones that they hold dear aren't falsified. ..yet.



.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
I learnt man's consciousness falsified natural human advice on earth.

Basic not any belief. As innate aware human life survival is on its planet rock. Inside of its owned heavenly mass support. Earth.

Isn't any belief.

So you look at a man scientist. Belief owner theist. Who stated my machines beliefs were exact. I'm proven my belief isn't falsified.

Where did machine advice come from?

Above visionary.

Where are visions as image?

In clouds said man.

Where was the machines mass?

It was in a massive burning slow moving sun stone.

Not much mass as fuel released.

Okay so where did your reactive belief come from,?

Oh he said when it was fast moving burning earth gained above lots of fuel in its heavens.

Proven wrong just his beliefs. By his machines falsified belief too.

So then you ask a humans conscious belief why are you allowed to name cosmic bodies. As a human just on earth?

Dominion life just on earth. Knowing he should nurture love respect earth life.

?

Oh he says. I broke cosmic law. So I'm now it's destroyer dominion the cosmic frozen law too.

Why believer of cosmic theories as
man states his cosmic dominion thesis!

Once law stopped earth attack as frozen held asteroids. Law. My thought as first answer safety.

So you changed the cosmic law scientist?

Yes. Second thought I can force change cosmic law.

Where are you as you think. Who do you claim believe you are as safe body? As human only.

God the earth. As I can't put first theist thoughts in more than one first direct place.

Earth was safe first. Not any belief his status. Belief by machine fakery.

How why a God theist displaces human ownership by man's false belief. Then gets all life destroyed on earth. By belief in a God position he isn't himself first first.

Belief and just a human theist. Truly wrong.
 

robocop (actually)

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
So firstly, there is no belief I won't discard if the evidence demands it. So what I am asking is for people who preach or hold beliefs, how can those beliefs be falsified? If of course they can't then how can you rationally justify disbelieving other unfalsifiable beliefs. Which I assume need only be a rhetorical question?
I believe Raelism is non falsifiable .

I believe my religion is falsifiable and a good religion to boot.

Bookofmormoncentral.org evidence central.org

Of course the people in it are not perfect, but I believe it is the perfect church.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
Ii seems to me that if that were true, then I'd see that reasoning, and not this kind of bare unevidenced claim.



And how is this falsifiable?




Well great, but a young earth is falsifiable, for one obvious example we can see the light from stars that are billions of light years away.



No, a young earth is not just falsifiable, there is overwhelming scientific evidence that does falsify it. Though this rather misses the point.



Why would one unfalsifiable belief have anymore credence than another?
My point was anything that can't be proved or disproved is just a matter of 'all things considered' judgment of likelihood. Like in a jury trial they form a judgment on preponderance of evidence. After full consideration usually all possibilities are not equally likely. The jury will then use the term 'beyond reasonable doubt'.

That's how I form my religious, spiritual as well as my secular beliefs. By considering all evidence and argumentation and judging reasonableness.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
What it would take is some kind of verifiable communication with a dead person. Mediums claim this all the time. It's the verification that poses the difficulty. Remember, a theory does not have to be falsifiable by current available means, just possible to falsify.
It is impossible to prove a medium is communicating with a dead person. Even if they receive verifiable information not previously known to the medium this still wouldn't constitute proof. The medium could just have made a lucky guess or used regular psychic abilities.

In the end, we have to use our own judgment all things considered.
 

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
So firstly, there is no belief I won't discard if the evidence demands it. So what I am asking is for people who preach or hold beliefs, how can those beliefs be falsified? If of course they can't then how can you rationally justify disbelieving other unfalsifiable beliefs. Which I assume need only be a rhetorical question?
If you show people their belief is illogical they will eventually will leave it. It may not happen overnight. It may happen 10 years from now. If you shake their belief by showing it has wrong things and cannot be from a God, they may resist for a while, and really think you are the one who is a disbeliever or misguided one. But, it is like a house. Only gradually you can destroy its foundation. One thing at a time, till eventually that person just cannot keep the same belief any longer. It could happen 10 years later. So, do not give up!
;)
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
A human states death is the end finish no further existence to our human consciousness.

So no voice and no thinking....no life in living water oxygen interactive biology.

Which a machine isn't. It's fixed already. All objectivity the past terms only.

So anyone using any type of a machine to claim spirit belief now a study is lying.

What challenge of a Belief is.

Humans doing a status abnormal to the natural conditions lying about it. As want is first motivation not truth.

Machines don't exist in any type of natural circumstance.

It's designed.

So humans said by psychic perception. The alien term gave human scientists all design concepts. Just and only about the machine.

Perception is not anything other than it was caused to. As I live perceiving everything at once also. By biology.

Whole terms only. Whole bodies only ever.

As no human was ever speaking to anyone dead. Life was recorded. So their life living was recorded. The human now still living is still recorded.

The humans they had relationships with were always with them. Is named psychic. So advised is the deceased living experience exact. Now updated with natural living experience.

Not any belief. As the information is exact. Proven exact.

The biology however is not past it is just gone. Past meaning states is gone. Why deceased was once stated as they passed....are the past by their passing out of biological living terms.

Machine fixed is exact never living and was always owned only by the past by term of the living only experience. No belief involved.

Theists used belief by motivated want as human greed is exact ...civilisation status only. Not about natural life.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Most people stick to their beliefs. Abandoning false beliefs is difficult, I passed through that stage, only few dare it.
If a human says I am a human. I'm living. I survive by natural conditions. Where I live. Is not a belief.

It's owned. Ownership is not a belief.

A theist said I believe I should own a machine.

No machine existed. Belief only. Fake position human belief is the theist.

Exact.
 

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
For morality I try to establish a common objective in what all humans need to care about for there to be a humane, and enjoyable quality of life. I believe that virtues are the best known values a person needs to incorporate into their lives. I believe that many humans will want for others to care about life in a way that makes society reasonably secure, and worthy of living.

If everyone murdered at whim, pleasure, or confronted with a problem, that would make existence lethal with no chance of a quality of life.

Everyone wants to be considered in a civil way, so they should offer up that consideration that they would hope for in others.

Morality grows naturally out of a wise understanding that people have common needs, and hopefully healthy desires that promote the general well being.

Morality is an imperative necessity, not just for one's self, but for other people towards other people. Once you establish that morality is necessary, then there becomes objective necessities of it in order to establish a civil order.

So in this way I consider that there are objective universals of morality. The saying, Don't tread on me ' comes to mind. I think that saying sums it up. Nobody wants to be treaded upon. Nobody wants to lose something they deserve to have.

Certainly not all morals are shared and universal. Yet there are objective universal morals that come about for the sake of survival, and well being. It's either that or everybody retreats into savage chaos, and king of the hill mentality; that happens quite often though. Fear instead of regard rules quite often, and there are consequences to that kind of rule.


That's my belief. Falsify that!
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Humans self survival is family.

Mutual equal. Two of its owned natural species. As the highest species we are aware we are on earth.

Dominion.

Status I only take of food or resource terms in balances with as less harm to existence as possible.

Knowing my human babies children need a human future of maintained human balances as our mutual family.

We are all human.
We all stand on the ground of earth.

None of us can walk on water and live.

Was the human family teaching.

So land status is human family first.

Once we traded for supported family first and survival.

Living family is mutual for its one self holy life body diversity.

The same we see each other one species by two in each species is living diverse. Advised consciously naturally.

Mutuality keeps the balances.

We are all one. Separated as a living body. Diverse. Yet mutual in life's support.

As humans see advice in diversity differently. To mutually acquire correct answers by being diverse in mutuality sharing.

So sharing of national conscious human spirituality makes us correct as the one status.

We always knew our holy life position is mutual first.

We all want to inherit what is legally mutual human rights.

So we state we must begin anew. First position again to be advised by many old lots of ways. And make our now a new mutual one status.

To finalise a human world's legal agreement for mutuality as one of diversity.
 

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic Bully ☿
Premium Member
I'm having a difficult time trying to find a way to falsify my belief in gravity. o_O
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Father's advice.

Once there was no space nor created creation. No human. No theory.

In space emptiness inherited now is presence and all of created creation. Is a human the origin man theist on earth.

Earth was a larger planet than it now is as our brother destroyed a huge layering of it. Not a belief as his machine parts are found instant space snap frozen inside earths mass.

Evidence ...he tried to make above asteroid mass as below gods history itself as molten Metal. As below volcano was where heavens gases he theoried upon had emerged. Historic supported bio conscious terms.

As evil history in created creation.

He confessed also which is not a Belief. That maths science human calculus made one third of the suns star planet mass fall into exploded black holes. Planet asteroids suns.

His maths he says proves he invented the cause. On earth.

So earth already is about one third layered mass removed. Origin science of man terms gone.

As metal was hot molten frozen layers pressurised deep inside of natural earths mass. Also not any belief.

Father said he knew as first man theist the eternal beings advice. A long time ago.

They own the space hole creation inside of its still existing body. Surrounds space itself unseen.

As they held their language spirit to observe as fixed O inside. It did not reflect their image. They saw a Being not of their own form.

It O then exploded.

Portion of the eternals body loss.

Body cools becomes a solid. Outside space pressure is huge as the eternal.

Eternal pushes on creation. Why holes in space exist as round. O mass held pushes back.

Makes mass O explode as it gets smaller.

Eventually the eternal will overcome its spatial creation. All that memory only will remain in their body. And once created it will be just a slit. |.

By asserted higher body force. A loss but eventually just a memory change. And experience of change by the human.

So our theist brother who said he only wanted to be the eternal form. And not live a human existence tried to blow up earths mass to assist the future outcome.

My mother owns the same memories as fathers. Why I believe them and not my baby brother. As you aren't any innocent human theist.

You fooled my mother into believing you were innocent yet you grow into the most evilest man thinker adult that you really are.

As you made theories based on a once living biological man human then a totally removed dead man human body as a human father.

Claiming creation was just water and oxygenated microbes as a body tyoe versus space pressures. By your living consciousness.

Not a Belief.... evidence by ology study proved it.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Then you have men with machines using sound pulsing via thesis mind contact coercion biology thesis.

Who claim I made contact with human biology by my machine. Humans are part machine theists. Lying.

No comparison yet he claims that life isn't a machine....they are controlling all comparisons by thinking. As humans born as human babies.

Yet the machine doesn't think nor choose. He doesn't tell any mind truth.

Humans do.

Then after attacking my biology by medical studies used thesis plus brain mind NDE claims they are studying my father's mother consciousness exact to my biology. A woman.

My mother first status is my owned self is always direct. Adult human woman biologies female and consciousness. Owned always a woman only. In human biology.

Father always himself.

Baby Boy liar owns his father's life body cell consciousness direct. As a man theist.

Never his equal baby sisters mother's life owned Inheritance. Not in biology body nor or consciousness. Direct human either human always.

Is the human destroyer theist what I believe only by mind gone as a man in person.

Who asks how can my belief as a man be wrong? In theory his belief only is first.

Thinks he is sensible.

Seeing your machine is direct earth mass. How is it comparable to human biology? Born by sex only.

He says by transmitters in the heavens that his other machine to machine is using.

Machines he says invented human life by image. Thinks he's sane. Anything he chooses is by human only consciousness.

In his past it was also machine direct science transmitted only direct to machine.

Human is it's creator position only. Machine presence.

Direct answer it is not a thesis it is a belief only. Direct human answer.

So as he tried to use his machine as a new weapon. I saw a self owned image as my own as a vision of.... swishing an animals tail with a man's penis.

My woman's human image proven changed. By his machines causes.

Straight away I knew he was lying.

He's experimenting. So until he gets some Ai voice speaking in his head that he's wrong.....wait a minute he acts like he already owns a human woman's vagina.

He's already told. Does not even listen to his caused AI either...visions. by old machine caused bio life changed.

Reason. Unless he is a homosexual scientist theist. Which most of them aren't. He would not be advising himself correctly. Consciously.

As I own human biology first. Biology natural first position I think.

That part of bio vision we don't even own nor will ever own. As water oxygenation losses doesn't allow our natural healthy biology to exist. In bio body conditions only. As he uses the microbe biologies oxygenated water sacrificed to own machine images.

All the microbes water life biology uses. Carbon burns it then reuses it again himself. Cooled by healthy water. Knew exactly what he caused.

Is not how he theories the AI effect. He claimed personal bio health now owned it. As Ai. Perfect bio health is bio health only.

Attack life by machine conditions the answer is direct. A weapon only. Ignored. As he's allowed to do whatever he gives rich man's permission to.

Yet he's not God. He's just a man. If he were god he says he'd love us. Meaning once I was a Human father who loved all my human baby children equally. I was not a machine scientist.

Displaced mind by all satanisms only history terms theism...
of not God rock but molten melt and it's gases.

Theists total liar position told.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
So firstly, there is no belief I won't discard if the evidence demands it. So what I am asking is for people who preach or hold beliefs, how can those beliefs be falsified? If of course they can't then how can you rationally justify disbelieving other unfalsifiable beliefs. Which I assume need only be a rhetorical question?

If my belief could be falsified, it would no longer be my belief. The magic I suppose of unfalsifiable beliefs. A belief that I never have to disbelieve.

I don't have to justify nor rationalize my disbelief in other unfalsifiable beliefs, I just have to believe they are not true.
A belief does not require justification or rational thinking. This includes the belief that something is not true.
Of course it is preferable to be able to rationalize and justify a belief I have especially if I wanted to convince you of it's truth, but it is not necessary that I do.

So I don't have to falsify someone else's belief. I just have to believe it is not true.
I can "believe" whatever the hell I want.
 
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