How Do Atheists Handle World Events: Scenario 1 Totalitarianism

[Searching1981]

Religious people and Atheists are both welcome to reply. I'm not kicking anyone out of this thread as is the practice with some people.

Now, we are living in interesting times; these are times that test the soul. Except, how do people handle these times who do not believe in a soul or everlasting life, what is your calculus of decisions and how do you react. Please be authentic and honest, you are anonymous to me and this is just a message board.

So, let us go to Scenario 1: Totalitarianism.

You live in a world where the Media and Government work in concert to control your lives. It's worse than 1984 in that you are not even aware of it. The Media pretends to oppose the Government and the Government pretends to oppose the media but The Media helps get the Government elected and through a series of coordinated Reality TV the Government feeds the Media Ratings.

As this world develops your Health Care is being taken away as are your Rights of Speech, but the Government and Media control this by introducing catastrophic war reasoning, "only a degenerate would speak out against the Media and Government during a time of Crisis."

The Media and Government convince you opposing them aggressively is only something degenerates do, what you need are endless peaceful protests the Media will not Cover and the Government does not care about. In short, you and society are cornered because no one is willing to fight for you unless you fight for yourself.

Over time, there is talk of genocide maybe of the Korean and Japanese people or maybe of the Hispanic people. Then there is talk a great recession as regulation put in place to prevent it are removed and you or others will lose your well-being and retirement as a result.

In short, this is totalitarianism.

How would you handle this crisis as an Atheist?

UPDATE !: More Details

In this society they raise the prices of cigarettes, alcohol and criminalize pot...anything that makes you think and reflect and spend time inwards is deemed bad and either criminal or expensive so only the wealthy can do it. They say it is for your health, but really it is to stop from getting you thinking, talking, congregating.

The movement starts out as a People's movement with the Leader a Wealthy Demagogue. You can't just vote the person out as both political parties are in on it. One party given you bad, unlikeable candidates and the other party selects one Demagogue after the other. Over time this People's movement like Soviet (a movement of People) Russia, China and North Korea just plain rig the elections but because freedom of speech will get you killed no one can discuss it.

Then there are Hacker groups who pretend to be on your side but are all on the side of the Demagogue. As you follow their Twitter you see them tear down any party that is not for totalitarianism all the while appealing to freedom while they undermine it.

How would an Atheist handle this scenario?

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Religious people and Atheists are both welcome to reply. I'm not kicking anyone out of this thread as is the practice with some people.

Now, we are living in interesting times; these are times that test the soul. Except, how do people handle these times who do not believe in a soul or everlasting life, what is your calculus of decisions and how do you react. Please be authentic and honest, you are anonymous to me and this is just a message board.

So, let us go to Scenario 1: Totalitarianism.

You live in a world where the Media and Government work in concert to control your lives. It's worse than 1984 in that you are not even aware of it. The Media pretends to oppose the Government and the Government pretends to oppose the media but The Media helps get the Government elected and through a series of coordinated Reality TV the Government feeds the Media Ratings.

As this world develops your Health Care is being taken away as are your Rights of Speech, but the Government and Media control this by introducing catastrophic war reasoning, "only a degenerate would speak out against the Media and Government during a time of Crisis."

The Media and Government convince you opposing them aggressively is only something degenerates do, what you need are endless peaceful protests the Media will not Cover and the Government does not care about. In short, you and society are cornered because no one is willing to fight for you unless you fight for yourself.

Over time, there is talk of genocide maybe of the Korean and Japanese people or maybe of the Hispanic people. Then there is talk a great recession as regulation put in place to prevent it are removed and you or others will lose your well-being and retirement as a result.

In short, this is totalitarianism.

How would you handle this crisis as an Atheist?

If the situation is "worse than 1984" then your question has the same answer whether you're an atheist or theist - and that answer is "almost certainly eventually conform". That was the whole point of the novel, that in a true totalitarian state, not even your free will and imagination are free from total control, so you've essentially set up a scenario that nobody can meaningfully have an independent handle on if you've already set the bar at "worse than a totalitarian state that already has total control of your thinking".

 

[Skwim]

Religious people and Atheists are both welcome to reply. I'm not kicking anyone out of this thread as is the practice with some people.

FYI, You don't have the power, even if you wanted to.

Now, we are living in interesting times; these are times that test the soul. Except, how do people handle these times who do not believe in a soul or everlasting life, what is your calculus of decisions and how do you react. Please be authentic and honest, you are anonymous to me and this is just a message board.

So, let us go to Scenario 1: Totalitarianism.

You live in a world where the Media and Government work in concert to control your lives. It's worse than 1984 in that you are not even aware of it. The Media pretends to oppose the Government and the Government pretends to oppose the media but The Media helps get the Government elected and through a series of coordinated Reality TV the Government feeds the Media Ratings.

As this world develops your Health Care is being taken away as are your Rights of Speech, but the Government and Media control this by introducing catastrophic war reasoning, "only a degenerate would speak out against the Media and Government during a time of Crisis."

The Media and Government convince you opposing them aggressively is only something degenerates do, what you need are endless peaceful protests the Media will not Cover and the Government does not care about. In short, you and society are cornered because no one is willing to fight for you unless you fight for yourself.

Over time, there is talk of genocide maybe of the Korean and Japanese people or maybe of the Hispanic people. Then there is talk a great recession as regulation put in place to prevent it are removed and you or others will lose your well-being and retirement as a result.

In short, this is totalitarianism.

How would you handle this crisis as an Atheist?

Well, first I'd help push as many religious folk off a cliff as I could so they'd no longer post screwy on-line threads like this anymore. Then I'd join my fellow totalitarian pals in drunken and sexual debauchery to celebrate. Too spent to pull my pants back on or clean up after myself I'd probably crash where I stood and await my man-servant's attempts at reviving me the following morning. Having recovered by late afternoon "tea time" (made from home grown pot no less) I'd get wasted while watching all the surviving religious folk in the street down below picketing their god to save them.

That's what I would do. So, how about yourself. As a Catholic, what would you do?

.

.

 

[Polymath257]

Religious people and Atheists are both welcome to reply. I'm not kicking anyone out of this thread as is the practice with some people.

Now, we are living in interesting times; these are times that test the soul. Except, how do people handle these times who do not believe in a soul or everlasting life, what is your calculus of decisions and how do you react. Please be authentic and honest, you are anonymous to me and this is just a message board.

So, let us go to Scenario 1: Totalitarianism.

You live in a world where the Media and Government work in concert to control your lives. It's worse than 1984 in that you are not even aware of it. The Media pretends to oppose the Government and the Government pretends to oppose the media but The Media helps get the Government elected and through a series of coordinated Reality TV the Government feeds the Media Ratings.

As this world develops your Health Care is being taken away as are your Rights of Speech, but the Government and Media control this by introducing catastrophic war reasoning, "only a degenerate would speak out against the Media and Government during a time of Crisis."

The Media and Government convince you opposing them aggressively is only something degenerates do, what you need are endless peaceful protests the Media will not Cover and the Government does not care about. In short, you and society are cornered because no one is willing to fight for you unless you fight for yourself.

Over time, there is talk of genocide maybe of the Korean and Japanese people or maybe of the Hispanic people. Then there is talk a great recession as regulation put in place to prevent it are removed and you or others will lose your well-being and retirement as a result.

In short, this is totalitarianism.

How would you handle this crisis as an Atheist?

UPDATE !: More Details

In this society they raise the prices of cigarettes, alcohol and criminalize pot...anything that makes you think and reflect and spend time inwards is deemed bad and either criminal or expensive so only the wealthy can do it. They say it is for your health, but really it is to stop from getting you thinking, talking, congregating.

The movement starts out as a People's movement with the Leader a Wealthy Demagogue. You can't just vote the person out as both political parties are in on it. One party given you bad, unlikeable candidates and the other party selects one Demagogue after the other. Over time this People's movement like Soviet (a movement of People) Russia, China and North Korea just plain rig the elections but because freedom of speech will get you killed no one can discuss it.

Then there are Hacker groups who pretend to be on your side but are all on the side of the Demagogue. As you follow their Twitter you see them tear down any party that is not for totalitarianism all the while appealing to freedom while they undermine it.

How would an Atheist handle this scenario?

Why would you think there is a specifically atheist way to handle this scenario? Atheists are like all other people: they can fight for their rights or be intimidated by the powers arrayed against them. But they want their children to be happy, healthy, and free to choose their lives just like everyone else.

So, I would NOT handle these situations 'as an atheist'. I would handle them as a *human*.

 

[Searching1981]

FYI, You don't have the power, even if you wanted to.


Well, first I'd help push as many religious folk off a cliff as I could so they'd no longer post screwy on-line threads like this anymore. Then I'd join my fellow totalitarian pals in drunken and sexual debauchery to celebrate. Too spent to pull my pants back on or clean up after myself I'd probably crash where I stood and await my man-servant's attempts at reviving me the following morning. Having recovered by late afternoon "tea time" (made from home grown pot no less) I'd get wasted while watching all the surviving religious folk in the street down below picketing their god to save them.

That's what I would do. So, how about yourself. As a Catholic, what would you do?

.

.

Hey, I dig everyone's response I'll try to respond to everyone but, but, but it was asked by Skwim what I as a Catholic would do? OK, I'm game.

What I would first do is make myself a target for the government and their sympathizers. I'd do this by posting thought provoking, yet reasonable, points of view on Twitter and various Message Boards, starting my own Tumblr. Some of my views would seem outrageous at first, but over time people would see their truth.

Now, the method to my madness is to spread awareness, but it is also to make myself a target. Just like the Franz Ferdinand Song, "Take me Out," (Franz Ferdinand being the start of the war) "You don't now? I don't know. Take me out,"..."I'm just a cross hair, here waiting for you." Now, the purpose of making myself a target is 1) to test people and their respect of freedom of speech and human life 2) get them to come to me.

All the while I make myself a cross hair, I build a small local revolutionary group in my small town community. This small town revolutionary group is based off of a bigger group called the Blue, Right, Folk or Dogs. I would make myself a scout where I patrol the entrance of the community to see what outsiders are coming in. The only outsiders coming in are totalitarians and their sympathizers incensed with my writing. Instead of me going to them, they come to me. Wonderful method.

There is so much more, but it works rather well when you have God on your side.

 

[sayak83]

Religious people and Atheists are both welcome to reply. I'm not kicking anyone out of this thread as is the practice with some people.

Now, we are living in interesting times; these are times that test the soul. Except, how do people handle these times who do not believe in a soul or everlasting life, what is your calculus of decisions and how do you react. Please be authentic and honest, you are anonymous to me and this is just a message board.

So, let us go to Scenario 1: Totalitarianism.

You live in a world where the Media and Government work in concert to control your lives. It's worse than 1984 in that you are not even aware of it. The Media pretends to oppose the Government and the Government pretends to oppose the media but The Media helps get the Government elected and through a series of coordinated Reality TV the Government feeds the Media Ratings.

As this world develops your Health Care is being taken away as are your Rights of Speech, but the Government and Media control this by introducing catastrophic war reasoning, "only a degenerate would speak out against the Media and Government during a time of Crisis."

The Media and Government convince you opposing them aggressively is only something degenerates do, what you need are endless peaceful protests the Media will not Cover and the Government does not care about. In short, you and society are cornered because no one is willing to fight for you unless you fight for yourself.

Over time, there is talk of genocide maybe of the Korean and Japanese people or maybe of the Hispanic people. Then there is talk a great recession as regulation put in place to prevent it are removed and you or others will lose your well-being and retirement as a result.

In short, this is totalitarianism.

How would you handle this crisis as an Atheist?

UPDATE !: More Details

In this society they raise the prices of cigarettes, alcohol and criminalize pot...anything that makes you think and reflect and spend time inwards is deemed bad and either criminal or expensive so only the wealthy can do it. They say it is for your health, but really it is to stop from getting you thinking, talking, congregating.

The movement starts out as a People's movement with the Leader a Wealthy Demagogue. You can't just vote the person out as both political parties are in on it. One party given you bad, unlikeable candidates and the other party selects one Demagogue after the other. Over time this People's movement like Soviet (a movement of People) Russia, China and North Korea just plain rig the elections but because freedom of speech will get you killed no one can discuss it.

Then there are Hacker groups who pretend to be on your side but are all on the side of the Demagogue. As you follow their Twitter you see them tear down any party that is not for totalitarianism all the while appealing to freedom while they undermine it.

How would an Atheist handle this scenario?

Let me guess, you believe that the current world is like this.?

 

[Searching1981]

If the situation is "worse than 1984" then your question has the same answer whether you're an atheist or theist - and that answer is "almost certainly eventually conform". That was the whole point of the novel, that in a true totalitarian state, not even your free will and imagination are free from total control, so you've essentially set up a scenario that nobody can meaningfully have an independent handle on if you've already set the bar at "worse than a totalitarian state that already has total control of your thinking".

Well, that is a really good point but in my opinion it is a flaw in the book. Remember a book is just a perspective, a sort of experiment with its variables set into place. The question you have to ask yourself is what variables are missing. I haven't read the book in a long time and I, personally, am not a huge fan of the book but it is a good book.

If I remember correctly, I think his name is Winston does make reference to a region of abject poverty outside the system. I cannot remember if the book does anything with that region or it just suggests it. Another variable that could falsely be added to the book is well, literally, Winston escapes in the end. How, you say? He dies. He is now outside the control of the system and in Heaven. So, the ending of the book from a religious perspective could be seen as a happy ending; he is now free and he can one reunite with his soulmate, lover. Meanwhile, the world is pointlessly suffering without him.

Cheers!

 

[Searching1981]

Why would you think there is a specifically atheist way to handle this scenario? Atheists are like all other people: they can fight for their rights or be intimidated by the powers arrayed against them. But they want their children to be happy, healthy, and free to choose their lives just like everyone else.

So, I would NOT handle these situations 'as an atheist'. I would handle them as a *human*.

Thank you sir or maam, now let me clarify I do not demonize atheists. I hope I didn't suggest this was an atheistic type scenario; instead, I mean a scenario started nefariously that is effecting both theists and atheists. Helk, for all I know the government in this scenario has the support of some sincere theists.

Now, I'm going to write something that I hope does not annoy you. The reason I write that is because I wrote it once to a good atheists who was highly annoyed I wrote it, but I mean it for reflection only. This is what I'm writing: as an atheist why have children? If you believe there is no logic in this place wouldn't it be the cruelest thing in the world to insert new life with the burden of this existential struggle only to know there is no happy ending? It would seem a selfish proposition.

Now, I'm a theist but I will never have children. Why? I would never want any child of mine to born into this horrific place when I know I can have children in Heaven, a perfect environment. Then you ask what if you can't? That's still fine because I know I did not insert anyone into this horrible situation.

But, but, but the reason I write that is because as an atheist in the tough situation with children where there is no happy ending, how would you respond to this government? Skwim already said he would join them in some way, another person already suggested there is nothing that can be done but conform. Isn't that painful? Everyone fears death so much they are immobilized from fighting back. Seems like it's a good proposition for Totalitarians.

 

[SomeRandom]

Well, that is a really good point but in my opinion it is a flaw in the book. Remember a book is just a perspective, a sort of experiment with its variables set into place. The question you have to ask yourself is what variables are missing. I haven't read the book in a long time and I, personally, am not a huge fan of the book but it is a good book.

If I remember correctly, I think his name is Winston does make reference to a region of abject poverty outside the system. I cannot remember if the book does anything with that region or it just suggests it. Another variable that could falsely be added to the book is well, literally, Winston escapes in the end. How, you say? He dies. He is now outside the control of the system and in Heaven. So, the ending of the book from a religious perspective could be seen as a happy ending; he is now free and he can one reunite with his soulmate, lover. Meanwhile, the world is pointlessly suffering without him.

Cheers!

How does Winston escape the system? (Spoiler alert!!!)

They literally break him! He is theirs completely. His final act in life is the admiration of Big Brother. If his happy ending occurs after death then clearly you're suggesting that the solution is suicide.
Also the poverty aspect is the Proles. BB just sort of leaves them alone and in doing so kind of ensures their cooperation. The Proles don't care either way. They kind of just do their own thing. They represent apathy towards politics. Itself a dangerous position in the book. Oddly they do not seem to fear BB as Winston and his peers do.

 

[Searching1981]

How does Winston escape the system? (Spoiler alert!!!)

They literally break him! He is theirs completely. His final act in life is the admiration of Big Brother. If his happy ending occurs after death then clearly you're suggesting that the solution is suicide.
Also the poverty aspect is the Proles. BB just sort of leaves them alone and in doing so kind of ensures their cooperation. The Proles don't care either way. They kind of just do their own thing. They represent apathy towards politics. Itself a dangerous position in the book. Oddly they do not seem to fear BB as Winston and his peers do.

It's all a great point, but let me address the Bold. I am definitely not suggesting suicide, but I can understand how you think someone who believes in the afterlife or God could conclude that given the circumstances of the book.

Now, this is a great extension of the argument inserting 1984 but my argument is that, "why not fight back with all the faith in the world knowing death is not the end...so, it does not get to the point of suicide." It seems the first strategy of Big Brother is to remove all faith and insert a complete debilitating and existential fear of it; in this way they control your whole life i.e. no God, they are the closest thing to it.

From your description of the Proles, I have not read the book in a long time, I think of The Brothers Karamazov (a book I highly recommend you read if you have not read it) where Raskolnikov asserts in the end right before the time of the fall of Russia to Communism, "one day there will be a hymn from the underground." What Dostoyevsky thought is the greatest solution to Totalitarianism would be something like the Proles. Why? Big Brother would use someone like them to create a hierarchy i.e. unless you do as we say and live as we live and conform, you will end up like them. They themselves, having nothing to lose and having nothing to gain from Big Brother, not being under surveillance, have the biggest hope of living with Faith and leading the Rebellion.

Great discussion.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

This is what I'm writing: as an atheist why have children? If you believe there is no logic in this place wouldn't it be the cruelest thing in the world to insert new life with the burden of this existential struggle only to know there is no happy ending? It would seem a selfish proposition.

Why do you think an atheist believes there is no logic in the world?

The answer to your question is simple: because atheists, like anyone else, enjoy their lives and their experience, and they wish to share this life and their experiences - and hopefully impart some of their ideas - to a future generation.

But, but, but the reason I write that is because as an atheist in the tough situation with children where there is no happy ending, how would you respond to this government? Skwim already said he would join them in some way, another person already suggested there is nothing that can be done but conform. Isn't that painful? Everyone fears death so much they are immobilized from fighting back. Seems like it's a good proposition for Totalitarians.

Have you read 1984?

 

[Searching1981]

Why do you think an atheist believes there is no logic in the world?

The answer to your question is simple: because atheists, like anyone else, enjoy their lives and their experience, and they wish to share this life and their experiences - and hopefully impart some of their ideas - to a future generation.


Have you read 1984?

Let, me respond to whether I have read 1984. I have, it's been a while along with George Orwell's Animal Farm. But like I write it has been a while and I'm not going to look it up on the internet. (I'm not accusing anyone of doing that). I'm just doing it from memory.

Again, I know there are people who are enthusiastic about the book, and that's valid, but I am not. Now, sticking to my impressions of the book as it actually is (we were doing thought exercises) my criticism of the book is that so long as Faithlessness is the premise it is true in so far as Faithlessness will always lead to Totalitarianism but it is not true in that more subtle forms of it exist now with the more subtle being the preferred ie Why have a Big Brother, when essentially your neighbors will spy on you for nothing?

For everyone here, I recommend Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 as well. With the criticism of that book is that books instead of being burned are being changed; I fully well expect a day when all Religious Texts will subtly be censored to promote a Totalitarian view. For example, try to find Yeats Phases of the Moon my copy from college is a completely different poem than what is on the internet; it is a long poem.

The ultimate conclusion, is all these authors were correct but either 1) they were exaggerated in their suggestions of methods of government control 2) the government so long as it controls media and internet learned from the mto achieve more with less.

Now, as for the bolded, "to a future generation," that is idealistic and with humility naive but it plays into my argument. Why? With so much history being rewritten and scrubbed on the internet and in real life, I'll be surprised if we can still read on honest copy of all the greats in the future. Hey, Harvard is, "Finding,' different versions of the Constitution right, or is that just government propaganda changing the intent of the Constitution with false finds?

Read Shelley's Ozymandias, like those cats Outkast say in their atheist song, "Nothing is forever." Play it loud with Tidal or on Youtube and you can hear their background musicians reply to that. Outkast is not a revolutionary but the session musicians on that Album are.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Let, me respond to whether I have read 1984. I have, it's been a while along with George Orwell's Animal Farm. But like I write it has been a while and I'm not going to look it up on the internet. (I'm not accusing anyone of doing that). I'm just doing it from memory.

Again, I know there are people who are enthusiastic about the book, and that's valid, but I am not. Now, sticking to my impressions of the book as it actually is (we were doing thought exercises) my criticism of the book is that so long as Faithlessness is the premise it is true in so far as Faithlessness will always lead to Totalitarianism but it is not true in that more subtle forms of it exist now with the more subtle being the preferred ie Why have a Big Brother, when essentially your neighbors will spy on you for nothing?

For everyone here, I recommend Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 as well. With the criticism of that book is that books instead of being burned are being changed; I fully well expect a day when all Religious Texts will subtly be censored to promote a Totalitarian view. For example, try to find Yeats Phases of the Moon my copy from college is a completely different poem than what is on the internet; it is a long poem.

The ultimate conclusion, is all these authors were correct but either 1) they were exaggerated in their suggestions of methods of government control 2) the government so long as it controls media and internet learned from the mto achieve more with less.

Now, as for the bolded, "to a future generation," that is idealistic and with humility naive but it plays into my argument. Why? With so much history being rewritten and scrubbed on the internet and in real life, I'll be surprised if we can still read on honest copy of all the greats in the future. Hey, Harvard is, "Finding,' different versions of the Constitution right, or is that just government propaganda changing the intent of the Constitution with false finds?

Read Shelley's Ozymandias, like those cats Outkast say in their atheist song, "Nothing is forever." Play it loud with Tidal or on Youtube and you can hear their background musicians reply to that. Outkast is not a revolutionary but the session musicians on that Album are.

Do you understand the point being made by 1984? Do you understand that Orwell intentionally wrote it as a form of totalitarian regime where there is necessarily no other choice but to conform because whatever beliefs you have the government has the ability to literally terrify you so much that you end up selling out your ideals and conforming?

To suggest that a legitimate criticism of this book is that it was "exaggerating" is ridiculous. It's a work of fiction designed to illustrate a point - that in a truly totalitarian regime, not even our own individual freedoms of ideology, love and imagination are necessarily free of total authoritarian control.

If you wish to use a more realistic example, please do so. Do not say "It's like 1984 but worse", because then you've already lost. In such a situation, fictional and hypothetical though it may be, your faith is irrelevant. You're always just one trip to room 101 away from completely discarding your beliefs and "loving big brother".

 

[Searching1981]

Do you understand the point being made by 1984? Do you understand that Orwell intentionally wrote it as a form of totalitarian regime where there is necessarily no other choice but to conform because whatever beliefs you have the government has the ability to literally terrify you so much that you end up selling out your ideals and conforming?

To suggest that a legitimate criticism of this book is that it was "exaggerating" is ridiculous. It's a work of fiction designed to illustrate a point - that in a truly totalitarian regime, not even our own individual freedoms of ideology, love and imagination are necessarily free of total authoritarian control.

If you wish to use a more realistic example, please do so. Do not say "It's like 1984 but worse", because then you've already lost. In such a situation, fictional and hypothetical though it may be, your faith is irrelevant. You're always just one trip to room 101 away from completely discarding your beliefs and "loving big brother".

I'm not certain why this discussion angers you. For me, for me personally the situation we live in now is worse than 1984 and is not addressed in 1984. Why?

You have a situation where you feel you are free and your ideas are free flawing and original but what forms your impressions of the world? The same thing that informs all impressions of the world the Internet and Media. But the Media plays a game, "We are Conservative Media, We are Liberal Media," but the rub of that game is you can't tell they are both government run media suppressing the truth about what is going on in America and the World. So, why is that so much worse? Because you think you are making an informed, rational decision but that decision is completely molded and controlled by a government who is pulling your emotions to make that decision. So, you have no clue you made the choice government and media knows they can get you to make.

You say, "I chose atheism," the government says, "yes, we wanted you to choose atheism based on all the Televangelists we promote, based on all the Conservative Media we promote to create our impression of religion for you meanwhile all of them are living salacious gay lives behind the scene and laughing at you." Meanwhile there is another group of people, who say, "we choose religion," and the government says, "yes, we wanted this group to chose religion based on the same media."

Then on the Internet there is so much, so much false information and it's all made by people who just want to make their perspective the prevailing when nowhere in Academia is their perspective even acknowledged. Now, the point of all this government control is not to break you like Orwell showed, the point is to get you to go to a meaningless job, having enough to call yourself safe, then live to an old age of retirement dying slow incapable to fight back where you will give up your retirement to them after you die never having enjoyed life.

Hey, everyone is already grateful to media and big brother without all that intrusion or unnecessary bureaucracy. But instead of being broken to their will, you are already saying, "I'm grateful to be an American, USA,USA,USA."

I personally am grateful to be Catholic, Catholics have no media presence here and are not in Government. Perfect.

 

[shunyadragon]

Religious people and Atheists are both welcome to reply. I'm not kicking anyone out of this thread as is the practice with some people.

Now, we are living in interesting times; these are times that test the soul. Except, how do people handle these times who do not believe in a soul or everlasting life, what is your calculus of decisions and how do you react. Please be authentic and honest, you are anonymous to me and this is just a message board.

So, let us go to Scenario 1: Totalitarianism.

You live in a world where the Media and Government work in concert to control your lives. It's worse than 1984 in that you are not even aware of it. The Media pretends to oppose the Government and the Government pretends to oppose the media but The Media helps get the Government elected and through a series of coordinated Reality TV the Government feeds the Media Ratings.

As this world develops your Health Care is being taken away as are your Rights of Speech, but the Government and Media control this by introducing catastrophic war reasoning, "only a degenerate would speak out against the Media and Government during a time of Crisis."

The Media and Government convince you opposing them aggressively is only something degenerates do, what you need are endless peaceful protests the Media will not Cover and the Government does not care about. In short, you and society are cornered because no one is willing to fight for you unless you fight for yourself.

Over time, there is talk of genocide maybe of the Korean and Japanese people or maybe of the Hispanic people. Then there is talk a great recession as regulation put in place to prevent it are removed and you or others will lose your well-being and retirement as a result.

In short, this is totalitarianism.

How would you handle this crisis as an Atheist?

UPDATE !: More Details

In this society they raise the prices of cigarettes, alcohol and criminalize pot...anything that makes you think and reflect and spend time inwards is deemed bad and either criminal or expensive so only the wealthy can do it. They say it is for your health, but really it is to stop from getting you thinking, talking, congregating.

The movement starts out as a People's movement with the Leader a Wealthy Demagogue. You can't just vote the person out as both political parties are in on it. One party given you bad, unlikeable candidates and the other party selects one Demagogue after the other. Over time this People's movement like Soviet (a movement of People) Russia, China and North Korea just plain rig the elections but because freedom of speech will get you killed no one can discuss it.

Then there are Hacker groups who pretend to be on your side but are all on the side of the Demagogue. As you follow their Twitter you see them tear down any party that is not for totalitarianism all the while appealing to freedom while they undermine it.

How would an Atheist handle this scenario?

Sounds like a rigid Biblical Theocracy from my perspective. IF I was an theist I would rebel. I would rebel anyway regardless of my belief.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I'm not certain why this discussion angers you.

I'm not angry, I'm just pointing out that absurdity of your OP.

For me, for me personally the situation we live in now is worse than 1984 and is not addressed in 1984. Why?

In what way is the situation now WORSE than in 1984??

You have a situation where you feel you are free and your ideas are free flawing and original but what forms your impressions of the world? The same thing that informs all impressions of the world the Internet and Media. But the Media plays a game, "We are Conservative Media, We are Liberal Media," but the rub of that game is you can't tell they are both government run media suppressing the truth about what is going on in America and the World. So, why is that so much worse? Because you think you are making an informed, rational decision but that decision is completely molded and controlled by a government who is pulling your emotions to make that decision. So, you have no clue you made the choice government and media knows they can get you to make.

You say, "I chose atheism," the government says, "yes, we wanted you to choose atheism based on all the Televangelists we promote, based on all the Conservative Media we promote to create our impression of religion for you meanwhile all of them are living salacious gay lives behind the scene and laughing at you." Meanwhile there is another group of people, who say, "we choose religion," and the government says, "yes, we wanted this group to chose religion based on the same media."

Then on the Internet there is so much, so much false information and it's all made by people who just want to make their perspective the prevailing when nowhere in Academia is their perspective even acknowledged. Now, the point of all this government control is not to break you like Orwell showed, the point is to get you to go to a meaningless job, having enough to call yourself safe, then live to an old age of retirement dying slow incapable to fight back where you will give up your retirement to them after you die never having enjoyed life.

Hey, everyone is already grateful to media and big brother without all that intrusion or unnecessary bureaucracy. But instead of being broken to their will, you are already saying, "I'm grateful to be an American, USA,USA,USA."

I personally am grateful to be Catholic, Catholics have no media presence here and are not in Government. Perfect.

Simple question: Are you serious?

 

[Searching1981]

Sounds like a rigid Biblical Theocracy from my perspective. IF I was an theist I would rebel. I would rebel anyway regardless of my belief.

I get what you are saying, Totalitarianism comes in many forms but that is not what we are facing and have been facing since Darwin. You can, friend, be an atheist Rebel...but in my whole life I've never seen one.

 

[Searching1981]

I'm not angry, I'm just pointing out that absurdity of your OP.


In what way is the situation now WORSE than in 1984??


Simple question: Are you serious?

Yes, I'm completely serious. Now put on the veil of ignorance and decide if you say the situation this bad would you fight back? That is the hypothetical I presented. My suspicion is you would not and don't. But your frustration belies your intentions, fear is not a motivator, confidence is try having it without Faith.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Yes, I'm completely serious.

Then there is no point trying to engage with you. Bye bye.

 

[LuisDantas]

Why would being an atheist make any difference?