ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Question: How many people (in the Bible) has Satan murdered? Reference chapter and verse, please. Thank you.
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How Many People Has Satan Murdered?
- Thread starter ThirtyThree
- Start date
Zero. How many people has God murdered? Dunno, but it is a lot. And, I guess we could say, "them all", at some point if we count Noah.
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
McBell
Unbound
Find the verse where Satan kills a single person, and I'll give you a dollar. Honestly, the only part I can think of is where Satan tempts Job killing servants and animals, but even then he's doing this at the permission of God (as the dialogue goes). I'd guess really it is God that decided to do it / allow it. The other likely is Sarah, Satan tells her Abraham will sacrifice their son Issac. The news kills her with a heart attack, but again questionable whether he did it.
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Examples_of_Satan_personally_killing_people
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Examples_of_God_personally_killing_people
God is definitely winning...
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Did Satan decide to commit these murders of His own accord or did Yahweh command them done?
McBell
Unbound
relevance?
Unless you are going to claim that Satan is a mindless robot of god....
Job 1:12 comes to mind.
12 “Very well,” the Lord told Satan, “everything he owns is in your power. However, you must not lay a hand on Job himself.” So Satan left the Lord’s presence.
Job's servants (stated as a very large number) and children (ten of them) were all killed in chapter 1, along with his livestock.
And considering that the figure in question may be the source of the name, yet is actually effectively a completely different figure entirely in terms of role and relationships, I don't really count that.
IOW, Iyyov's (English Job's) Shaitan is not the same as Western Christianity/Civilizaton's Satan/Lucifer.
Last edited:
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
-God kills 70,000 innocent people because David ordered a census of the people (1 Chronicles 21).
-God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. -He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value (Deuteronomy 3).
-He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” (Joshua 6).
-In (Judges 21) He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead
-In (2 Kings 10:18-27) God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church!
Satan = 0
-God also orders the destruction of 60 cities so that the Israelites can live there. -He orders the killing of all the men, women, and children of each city, and the looting of all of value (Deuteronomy 3).
-He orders another attack and the killing of “all the living creatures of the city: men and women, young, and old, as well as oxen sheep, and asses” (Joshua 6).
-In (Judges 21) He orders the murder of all the people of Jabesh-gilead
-In (2 Kings 10:18-27) God orders the murder of all the worshipers of a different god in their very own church!
Satan = 0
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Biblically, is Satan free to do so as He sees fit (including murder humans) or does He have to seek permission from Yahweh?
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
There is that argument. Both Satan and Lucifer are titles and not names. Ha-Satan is another matter entirely, if you ask most Jews.
The verse reads:
12 “Very well,” the Lord told Satan, “everything he owns is in your power. However, you must not lay a hand on Job himself.” So Satan left the Lord’s presence.
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Which "Satan" was the one referred to in Job? The fallen Cherub (and there is debate on that as well) or the employee of Yahweh?
And according to some, two separate figures.
McBell
Unbound
If you are going with Biblically you will have to reconcile the fact that the word "satan" is never used as the name of a specific entity.
I also hold the suspicion that the book of Job is about the Qliphoth, though, with Job's 3 daughters and 7 sons representing the different spheres. (Notice how Job had 3 more daughters and 7 more sons after his ordeal?)
(edit to add) Job 1:4-5
4 His sons used to take turns having banquets at their homes. They would send an invitation to their three sisters to eat and drink with them. 5 Whenever a round of banqueting was over, Job would send for his children and purify them, rising early in the morning to offer burnt offerings fora]">[a] all of them. For Job thought: Perhaps my children have sinned, having cursed God in their hearts. This was Job’s regular practice.
Job 1:18-19
18 He was still speaking when another messenger came and reported: “Your sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother’s house. 19 Suddenly a powerful wind swept in from the desert and struck the four corners of the house. It collapsed on the young people so that they died, and I alone have escaped to tell you!”
(edit to add) Job 1:4-5
4 His sons used to take turns having banquets at their homes. They would send an invitation to their three sisters to eat and drink with them. 5 Whenever a round of banqueting was over, Job would send for his children and purify them, rising early in the morning to offer burnt offerings fora]">[a] all of them. For Job thought: Perhaps my children have sinned, having cursed God in their hearts. This was Job’s regular practice.
Job 1:18-19
18 He was still speaking when another messenger came and reported: “Your sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother’s house. 19 Suddenly a powerful wind swept in from the desert and struck the four corners of the house. It collapsed on the young people so that they died, and I alone have escaped to tell you!”
These distinctions don't exist at the time. There is only one, aka the "employee of God" aka prosecuting attorney for the crown, etc. lol
That fallen angel jazz is a much later invention.
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Indeed, and possibly more than two. Since Satan is a title, it can apply to anyone, any group, and so on which fits that description. Likewise, Lucifer as a title.
ThirtyThree
Well-Known Member
Just referencing the Old Testament, there seem to be two uses of the title Satan, the one in Job is the second. Likewise, "serpent" had multiple meanings and not in every usage is the Hebrew word the same. Nachash in Genesis 3 is likely not the same meaning as literal serpent (snake) referenced regarding Moses throwing his rod to the ground and it becoming a "serpent" (literal creature). Then there is the firey serpent referenced elsewhere in the Bible, which comes from another Hebrew word than Nachash.