How to become a Christian?

[Desert Snake]

I don't see a nefarious plot in Deific Jesus belief, the early Christians were already outside the context of 'Judaism', Constantine for instance didn't 'have' to become a Christian, much less initiate Deific Jesus doctrine. I think there was 'backpeddling' only in the context of quelling incorrect religious ideas within Christendom, whether one 'believes' the doctrine, is irrelevant.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

But it wasn't a close call when the accepted beliefs were codified. And look what happened, monotheism, Jesus as equal to God through the trinity. If the 'intent' was to make Jesus God, they could have just either declared Jesus as sole Deity, or expressed Oneness Doctrine. They did neither. The intent was not 'over-Deification', it was rationalizing Deification.

The Argument was far more esoteric than that and far more complex and there were far more arguments and players.
The basic argument was the nature of Jesus, and if his nature was the same as God, how could that be shown to be monotheism. The second aspect was the subordination of Jesus to God. This was all second to third and fourth century argument as during the first century few people thought Jesus was GOD anyway.
Even today if you ask a man in the street if Jesus is God they will likely answer is no. And if you ask those who answer yes, to explain it, they can not.

My own view...... is that Jesus is the Son of God and is subordinate to God. This positions Mary as Jesus mother, not the mother of God. I think that would be the position of a large majority those early first century Judo-Christians as well.
It was the rationalizations/ inventions of the later centuries that got us into the illogical mess we find today.

Christians worship God not Jesus or Mary, They do so in the fashion taught by Jesus.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

When I talk about Early Christianity I am talking about the first century AD From the death of Jesus to the years around 100AD, which can be thought of as the apostolic age. An age that had known Jesus and was still under the direct influence of those taught by him and had heard him speak. They had not yet any established Christian scripture though some was in the process of being written but neither collated nor copied and distributed... .The Romans were not yet Christian in fact were persecuting and slaughtering Christians. This is the first formative period of Christianity, before any thought of its later theology was established and codified.

 

[Shiranui117]

The Argument was far more esoteric than that and far more complex and there were far more arguments and players.
The basic argument was the nature of Jesus, and if his nature was the same as God, how could that be shown to be monotheism. The second aspect was the subordination of Jesus to God. This was all second to third and fourth century argument as during the first century few people thought Jesus was GOD anyway.
Even today if you ask a man in the street if Jesus is God they will likely answer is no. And if you ask those who answer yes, to explain it, they can not.

My own view...... is that Jesus is the Son of God and is subordinate to God. This positions Mary as Jesus mother, not the mother of God. I think that would be the position of a large majority those early first century Judo-Christians as well.
It was the rationalizations/ inventions of the later centuries that got us into the illogical mess we find today.

Christians worship God not Jesus or Mary, They do so in the fashion taught by Jesus.

Ignatius of Antioch thought otherwise, and he had close ties to the Apostles. Would he have been one of the "few" then, in your view?

But aside from some of the Apostolic Fathers, you're right, there were no hard and fast declarations or explanations on how Jesus was God in the first century, that much is clear. It would have been nicer had more of the first Christians written something down.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Ignatius of Antioch thought otherwise, and he had close ties to the Apostles. Would he have been one of the "few" then, in your view?

But aside from some of the Apostolic Fathers, you're right, there were no hard and fast declarations or explanations on how Jesus was God in the first century, that much is clear. It would have been nicer had more of the first Christians written something down.

As one of the five Apostolic fathers Ignatius's six (confirmed) letters form perhaps the earliest attempt at creating a Christian theology before the end of the first century. His life spans the period from just before Christ death to perhaps 117AD There is a possibility that he was actually blessed by Jesus, But his learning came later as a student of John.

He was certainly one of the very few who fit what I was suggesting.

He did espouse the deity of Jesus. he did associate the Eucharist with the body and blood Of Christ, though not necessarily the real presence.
However he did not know of the Trinity, or that Mary might be the mother of God.
He taught that the bishops presided in the place of God, not in the place of Jesus.
He was the first to coin the Greek word for Catholic.

He was perhaps the prototype of the future Christian theologians.