Hypothetical Regarding Child Support

[otokage007]

So the poll so far has shown Bill is suffering a rather unfair situation. Any thoughts?

 

[McBell]

So the poll so far has shown Bill is suffering a rather unfair situation. Any thoughts?

One actually....

I wonder how differently the poll would have gone had it been made so that everyone can see who voted for what..?

 

[Me Myself]

One actually....

I wonder how differently the poll would have gone had it been made so that everyone can see who voted for what..?

Less honesty probably.

I know for a fact a lot of men are not inclined to talk on threads about gender or sex equality on their opinion for the simple fact that they dont want to be seen as sexist by the women, even though they do not see themselves as sexists.

Simply put, I ve found that in religious forum, talking about gender equality on anything that isnt "the women need more rights here" is almost unequivocally shut down by both men and women telling men to "man up" in the same way probably in another time a woman would say to a woman to "be a woman" on stuff that truly becomes oppressive towards them.

Its a shame, but its true.

The fact that you ask this is a direct pointer of this censorship and the high awareness people have of it even if it were on a deeper level.

 

[Alceste]

So the poll so far has shown Bill is suffering a rather unfair situation. Any thoughts?

I was honest. I said it's not fair, and that life's not fair. Sex isn't fair. Gender isn't fair. Families aren't fair. Pregnancy isn't fair. The fact that many of us agreed that it's not fair says nothing about whether or not we believe men should be able to weasel out of their legal responsibilities toward their own children because the feel they've been unfairly treated by the mum. Many of the women in the thread said "Yeah, it's not fair. Grow up and quit whining about it."

 

[Alceste]

Less honesty probably.

I know for a fact a lot of men are not inclined to talk on threads about gender or sex equality on their opinion for the simple fact that they dont want to be seen as sexist by the women, even though they do not see themselves as sexists.

Simply put, I ve found that in religious forum, talking about gender equality on anything that isnt "the women need more rights here" is almost unequivocally shut down by both men and women telling men to "man up" in the same way probably in another time a woman would say to a woman to "be a woman" on stuff that truly becomes oppressive towards them.

Its a shame, but its true.

The fact that you ask this is a direct pointer of this censorship and the high awareness people have of it even if it were on a deeper level.

"All the men in this thread must really agree with me, even though they're arguing against me - they're trying to impress the women..."

No, they're just grown-ups.

 

[otokage007]

I was honest. I said it's not fair, and that life's not fair. Sex isn't fair. Gender isn't fair. Families aren't fair. Pregnancy isn't fair. The fact that many of us agreed that it's not fair says nothing about whether or not we believe men should be able to weasel out of their legal responsibilities toward their own children because the feel they've been unfairly treated by the mum. Many of the women in the thread said "Yeah, it's not fair. Grow up and quit whining about it."

quite a good answer

 

[NIX]

Parent= both rights and duties

So if he indeed felt involved in the childs life, had legal right to see him/her , etc then he has rights as a father. Now in this circumstance he doesnt want the duties even though he does have the rights.

My argument comes from the side of a man who expects no rights of parenthood and thus no duties towards it. In otherwords he is not picking one and letting the other behind, he is truly not being a parent at all.

Wanting to actually BE a parent (in responsibility and action), and wanting the rights of a parent are two completely different things.

The rights of a parent obviously should be compulsory on their actually being a parent (in responsibility and action)

 

[NIX]

There is no reason to assume that a married partner wanted the children initially. Marriage is not an agreement to have children. Marriage is an agreement to build a life together as a couple. Each couple makes their own plans together- whatever they might be- including, or not including children. When it turns out that joint plans were not as foolproof as they were first assumed to be, this can easily be the beginning of one or both spouses coming so deeply into a scenario of irreconcilable differences (and resentment) that divorce becomes the only natural thing to follow -either right away, or sometime later as things spiral towards their inevitable low.

The marriage situation in question here is really no different from the one put forth in the OP.

If he is not a parent then he hasnt even the legal rights to visit.

The child was still born inside the marriage or wasnt it?

If you marry someone, you become the parent of any kid they have.

As pointed out in my top post marriage does not change the OP scenario simply because there is a marriage.

A formal divorce will be necessary yes, but beyond that, if she promised no kids/no more kids- why should the (soon to be x) husband be expected to pay child support for the new baby any more than the one night stand guy? After all, a promise is a promise, right? As said about the one night stand gal, the wife was unfaithful to their agreement, and her word. So why should the guy/husband pay?

I wonder how a marriage/divorce court judge might rule on this scenario. Even if the wife admitted it was so, and that she had indeed gone back on their agreement.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Less honesty probably.

I know for a fact a lot of men are not inclined to talk on threads about gender or sex equality on their opinion for the simple fact that they dont want to be seen as sexist by the women, even though they do not see themselves as sexists.

Simply put, I ve found that in religious forum, talking about gender equality on anything that isnt "the women need more rights here" is almost unequivocally shut down by both men and women telling men to "man up" in the same way probably in another time a woman would say to a woman to "be a woman" on stuff that truly becomes oppressive towards them.

Its a shame, but its true.

The fact that you ask this is a direct pointer of this censorship and the high awareness people have of it even if it were on a deeper level.

So, it's only true when men agree with you. And men are lying when they support feminist issues. Because if men were really honest, they'd be against most things that are important to women?

Are you honestly truly saying that to the world?

What a dim view of men YOU have, MM.

 

[Mathematician]

One actually....

I wonder how differently the poll would have gone had it been made so that everyone can see who voted for what..?

Why do you ask? Do you think it would be significantly different?

 

[Kathryn]

Be particular about who you poke, or let poke you.