I HAVE ARRIVED

[Laika]

Welcome to RF Julian.

 

[faroukfarouk]

I'm Julian, 20, from San Francisco. I will ridicule ridiculous claims, don't make them around me. Also, I'm pretty open minded, so if you make a ridiculous-sounding claim that actually doesn't happen to be ridiculous (and you'd be willing to chat) I'd be interested to hear you out I'm interested in philosphy, politics, psychology, economics, and a bunch of other stuff. I try to communicate as fairly and honestly as possible. I aim for perfection, never attain it, but never settle. I think life is about constantly recalculating and putting your best, most informed foot forward. Anything less is highly irresponsible; as we are the most powerful and informed actors in our observable universe, and are thus largely responsible for the state of the world we live in. I'm here because I want to learn more from people, and learn better how to bridge the cultural chasms that many institutional religions currently prevent us from bridging. Many problems the 21st century will face will require mankind to act in unison like it has never done before; and I firmly believe we have to eliminate religion to fix problems like Palestine, world inequality, and the perverted social hierarchy modern society has adopted. Thanks for the read, please respond

Haha.....sounds like you been eating too much sourdough bread.
Welcome to RF.

 

[DawudTalut]

Peace be on you. Welcome.

 

[Marisa]

I automatically like anyone who types "I HAVE ARRIVED" in all caps as their intro thread. Welcome!

 

[Julian]

We cant

Welcome.

It's not possible to "eliminate" religion while people want to hold religious views and carry out religious practices. That is their right and forcing them to stop is unethical.

Except for where those practices harm others, such as denying medical treatment to children. I'm all for eliminating that practice, and many countries already have laws dealing with that.

But as long as religious practices are not hurting others, then to my mind the only ethical/moral/human rights based option is to live and let live.

If religion changes and becomes less prevalent, as many predict it will, that is one thing, but actively trying to eliminate it against the wishes of others is not something I can support.

I dont think we should force christians or anyone to abandon their faith. I dont advocate the use of force to achieve really anything. I do however, think we have a moral imperative to disspell the various myths attatched to our cultures so we could come together WITHOUT dissonance, and accept that we are JUST human. Unless religious people relinquish their special relationship with their ego, they are dangerous because they sont value the truth. Theres so much wrong with that, and theres so much more. No, anyone who has seriously questioned their beliefs has concluded that either the majority of other religons have it wrong, or they have it wrong. This "tolerance" of diverse religious beliefs is really just building "tolerance" of dissonance, WHICH IS UNHEALTHY AND DANGEROUS. We need to address the truth as often as possible as SOBER as possible, BECAUSE we love each other and need to (and for the first time in history, have a chance to) get on the same page, not becuase im bitter or sour or have a superiority complex. If I and the Atheists are wrong, my mind is open to that, but one things for damn sure, we're not all right; theres no way jesus is son of god and also not the son of god. Atheists defending theism is silly, if we dont disspell these myths as myths, or do everything we can to try to open peoples minds to the lonely and reality of human life on earth, i implore you, who will?

 

[FTNZ]

We cant

I dont think we should force christians or anyone to abandon their faith. I dont advocate the use of force to achieve really anything. I do however, think we have a moral imperative to disspell the various myths attatched to our cultures so we could come together WITHOUT dissonance, and accept that we are JUST human. Unless religious people relinquish their special relationship with their ego, they are dangerous because they sont value the truth. Theres so much wrong with that, and theres so much more. No, anyone who has seriously questioned their beliefs has concluded that either the majority of other religons have it wrong, or they have it wrong. This "tolerance" of diverse religious beliefs is really just building "tolerance" of dissonance, WHICH IS UNHEALTHY AND DANGEROUS. We need to address the truth as often as possible as SOBER as possible, BECAUSE we love each other and need to (and for the first time in history, have a chance to) get on the same page, not becuase im bitter or sour or have a superiority complex. If I and the Atheists are wrong, my mind is open to that, but one things for damn sure, we're not all right; theres no way jesus is son of god and also not the son of god. Atheists defending theism is silly, if we dont disspell these myths as myths, or do everything we can to try to open peoples minds to the lonely and reality of human life on earth, i implore you, who will?

I wasn't defending theism, I was defending people's right to be theists if they want to. Your OP didn't identify what you meant by eliminating religion. If you had said work towards the elimination of religion by discussion and challenge of beliefs with willing participants, then I would have had no objection at all. Indeed, that is what I do.

Tolerance of religious beliefs/dissonance is not "unhealthy and dangerous"... I don't tolerate the actions of the religious where they harm others, but that is totally different to tolerating beliefs. You get to live in a free society where your beliefs/nonbeliefs are (more or less) tolerated. Part of that deal is allowing others the same freedom, even when you think their beliefs are myth, and/or lead to harm. Tolerance is the price we pay for our freedom.

 

[Julian]

Disagree. Your concepts of freedom and rights are legal concepts, with the end goal of making everyone happy. I posit that people can't be honestly happy if they have this dissonance. They need to accept the truth of their situation so they can learn from other people and the people and world around them, which is natural, NOT supernatural. Tolerance isn'ta price we have to pay for our freedom. You can seize the intellectual freedom the masses have recently been granted to expose these inconsistencies. You can use your freedom as a tool, to actively pursue the truth using freethought and reason. The truth of our situation is ugly NOT because god made us this way, but BECAUSE we've never fully taken control of our situation. And we never will if we don't reclaim our ability to think for ourselves. And that goal of making life on Earth better is what compels me to discredit this notion of tolerance. If we had believed that disease was caused directly by god, we would have no medicine. Secular science is the way for us to interact coherently with the world around us, anything else IS damaging wishful thinking that is holding us back from our potential. It is absolutely critical to not tolerate things that are wrong.

 

[Julian]

From ourselves or others, I should add

 

[Smart_Guy]

Be careful, no one messes with Wonder Woman

 

[Deidre]

Welcome Julian

 

[Revoltingest]

Greetings!

To ease you into our little group, have some....

 

[Julian]

Hands up means dont shoot! *duck*

 

[NewGuyOnTheBlock]

Hello, Julian, I'm sure you'll make an interesting addition here. Many things we will see eye to eye; but I suspect you will lean further left than I. Oh well. It takes all kinds.

Just a thought to chew on though: Freedom of religion, freedom of thought, freedom of expression: These are necessary for a free society. I struggle with this myself as I also disdain religion. But perhaps it is a necessary element of our cultures; if for no other reason, but by granting others the right to believe as they will guarantees us the right to believe as we won't.

Cheers.

 

[Knight of Albion]

A very warm welcome to the forum, dear Julian.