If "the West" is nice, 500 mil. Islamists won't push for Sharia??

[Jeremiahcp]

It depends on your definition of "fundamentalist". I would agree that there are very few extremists, but there are hundreds of millions of "Islamists", and you could argue that an Islamist is a fundamentalist.



First, it doesn't take a substantial number to cause trouble.

Second:

Muslims Rapidly Adopt U.S. Social Values

From this poll of Muslims living in the US:

37% think Sharia should be a source of legislation
13% think terrorism is sometimes justified to "defend Islam"

Here are some more statistics from your link there:

U.S. Muslims—81 percent of whom are immigrants or children of immigrants—are the most socially liberal and religiously tolerant in the world and becoming more so with each passing year.

Yet as Figure 2 shows, in the United States in 2011, 45 percent of U.S. Muslims considered homosexuality morally acceptable—the highest in the world—compared to 47 percent who did not.

Muslims in 2011 were unique among Muslims around the world in that they rejected the idea that Islam is the only faith leading to eternal life, instead believing that many other religions can also do so. As Figure 3 shows, a majority—56 percent—adopted the more liberal view, compared to just a country-level average of 20 percent for Muslims elsewhere.

Muslim Americans are half as likely as other Muslims to believe that the Quran should be taken literally.

Pew also conducted a survey of Muslims in 12 countries that asked about their views on al Qaeda. Of all the Muslims surveyed, only Lebanese had a more negative view of the Sunni terrorist group al Qaeda than U.S. Muslims (Figure 8). Just 5 percent of Muslim Americans had a favorable view of the group, compared to 81 percent who did not. The opposition was more pronounced among U.S. Muslim immigrants—just 2 percent saw al Qaeda favorably compared to 83 percent who didn’t. Both

And so on like that....

It seems like the best way to deal with Muslims is not to push them away but to welcome them into our country. As we are rubbing off on them more then they are rubbing off on us.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Well in the post before this one you mentioned that many Christians think we should put the Bible before their US citizenship. I'm happy to criticize BOTH Christians AND Muslims who are anti-secular.

The point of this thread is to defend secularism. full stop.

"The point of this thread is to defend secularism. full stop"

Horse poop. full stop.

 

[icehorse]

It seems like the best way to deal with Muslims is not to push them away but to welcome them into our country. As we are rubbing off on them more then they are rubbing off on us.

Why hasn't that worked in Europe?

 

[icehorse]

"The point of this thread is to defend secularism. full stop"

Horse poop. full stop.

Oh, I see, and you're a mind reader as well!

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Oh, I see, and you're a mind reader as well!

I don't need to read minds to read the thread.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Why hasn't that worked in Europe?

Who says it isn't? Are you amusing the terrorist attack was the work of all Muslims?

 

[icehorse]

Who says it isn't? Are you amusing the terrorist attack was the work of all Muslims?

you clearly are not reading, good to know

 

[Jeremiahcp]

you clearly are not reading, good to know

What's that say? I can't tell as I am not reading.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Why hasn't that worked in Europe?

Maybe because Europe isn't America and has its own issues integrating immigrants that America doesn't, or not to the same extent. Also, Europe is a continent, not a country.

 

[icehorse]

Maybe because Europe isn't America and has its own issues integrating immigrants that America doesn't, or not to the same extent. Also, Europe is a continent, not a country.

Or maybe it's because the ratios are different.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Or maybe it's because the ratios are different.

Or maybe it's because America was pretty much built by large-scale immigration that came in huge waves over the centuries and modern European countries weren't, so we tend to be better at integrating immigrants than most other countries.

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

This thread's only goal is to stereotype and smear Muslims.

You all need to be listening to the Bill Maher show. Islam isn't quite our worst problem right now, but a well placed terrorist attack, NOT even by Muslims is all that's required to make things much worse for America. Your most serious problem is the Russian connection to Trump. Do note that Jeff Sessions is OUT on conflict of interest charges, collusion with the Russians already.

 

[icehorse]

Or maybe it's because America was pretty much built by large-scale immigration that came in huge waves over the centuries and modern European countries weren't, so we tend to be better at integrating immigrants than most other countries.

I think you're assuming that all immigrants bring with them ideologies that are equally conducive to assimilation into their host countries. In other words, Islam is unique in its hostility towards other ideologies, and that needs to be factored into discussions of immigration.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I think you're assuming that all immigrants bring with them ideologies that are equally conducive to assimilation into their host countries. In other words, Islam is unique in its hostility towards other ideologies, and that needs to be factored into discussions of immigration.

I don't see what extremist ideologies have to do with immigration itself, really. We have plenty of native-born extremists in America - from radical Marxists and anarchists, Christian Dominionists to neo-Fascists, all of which behave quite violently (or wish to, if given a chance).Typically if a person is going to go through the trouble of becoming a citizen of a country, they most likely are quite fond of the country.

I see no evidence of Islam being "unique in its hostility towards other ideologies". That's just ignorant rhetoric.

 

[Notanumber]

Maybe because Europe isn't America and has its own issues integrating immigrants that America doesn't, or not to the same extent. Also, Europe is a continent, not a country.

Europe is a window on the future.

 

[icehorse]

I don't see what extremist ideologies have to do with immigration itself, really. We have plenty of native-born extremists in America - from radical Marxists and anarchists, Christian Dominionists to neo-Fascists, all of which behave quite violently (or wish to, if given a chance).Typically if a person is going to go through the trouble of becoming a citizen of a country, they most likely are quite fond of the country.

I see no evidence of Islam being "unique in its hostility towards other ideologies". That's just ignorant rhetoric.

Your first paragraph seems to boil down to a variation on "two wrongs make it right"?

Your comment concerning ignorance seems more like an admission than an accusation, given that you have no idea of my knowledge of Islam. Frankly, such an ad hominem seems a bit beneath you.

 

[Notanumber]

I don't see what extremist ideologies have to do with immigration itself, really. We have plenty of native-born extremists in America - from radical Marxists and anarchists, Christian Dominionists to neo-Fascists, all of which behave quite violently (or wish to, if given a chance).Typically if a person is going to go through the trouble of becoming a citizen of a country, they most likely are quite fond of the country.

I see no evidence of Islam being "unique in its hostility towards other ideologies". That's just ignorant rhetoric.

Of all the extremist ideologies, which is the one that is most discussed on this forum and does that not speak volumes?

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

"Well how can I compete with wit and cogency like that?"

I have doubts you can.

I have doubts /that/ you can.

With wits like yours, who needs grammar.

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

Of all the extremist ideologies, which is the one that is most discussed on this forum and does that not speak volumes?

One important point to St Frankie's post is that most of those groups he correctly mentions will have outbursts of temporary rage, but FundaMuslims [sic] are rather unique in that they are more driven by the ideology of Islam to convert or kill the entire human race at full scale. Seems most of those other groups aren't thinking that big and certainly don't have the numbers of adherents as !slam does with
~ 1.7 billion people. (All Muslims, including fundamentalist) Just 1/4 of that would roughly equa-Oops - (calculator) exceed the entire population of the US. That's about the ratio of fundies to other more moderate sects of Islam isn't it, about 1/4?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Your first paragraph seems to boil down to a variation on "two wrongs make it right"?

No, I just see the two as being different subjects.

Your comment concerning ignorance seems more like an admission than an accusation, given that you have no idea of my knowledge of Islam. Frankly, such an ad hominem seems a bit beneath you.

Yes, I have "no idea" when you've made numerous threads about your suspicions of Islam.