Impeachment indictment?

[Twilight Hue]

It’s literally like you guys have wiped the 8 year long Republican temper tantrum from your memories.

You guys have to tell me the secret because I’ll have 4 years I’ll want erased at the end of this.

That was over affairs of state issues affecting the country. Obamacare..... Immigration ...
Not tabloid stuff worthy of the National Enquirer. CNN? Lol.

Not people's personalities and quirks or dwelling on irrelevant non pertinent issues either where the Dems/left remain perpetually stuck in the past , arguing and wasting time about issues after the fact has long since passed. Poor fellas haven't even got past the initial election yet. Probably won't either anytime soon .

Republicans hold tantrums over state of affairs issues , leaving the tabloid issues alongside the mentality of the rest to cry about which clearly has been well taken up by the way by our fine friends from the left .

Doing a good job at it too .

 

[Altfish]

So with the city of Manhattan wanting to charge Trump with crimes for illegal campaign contribution, paying off the porn star, and Mueller investigating him for obstruction and Russian collusion it would seem that either impeachment or indictment would be on the horizon.

However CNN said last night it takes 67 folks from both senate and House Of representatives to impeach, unless there's something bad that Mueller has found him guilty of, it could happen but I am not counting on it.

If the state of Manhaten finds him guilty a you can not indict a sitting President.
HOWEVER, a Lawyer did say, they could find him guilty and also decide to indict after his term which would mean indictment and no second President term hooray!

If they both find him guilty and don't sentence him to anything or maybe just charge him fines instead which they could do, it will still be his last term and hopefully Dems will win next term!!!!!!!!!! So I am not unhappy if they find him guilty but do nothing to him at least I will know this is last term,Thank God another 2 years of hell and its over.

Dems will be making a big mistake trying to impeach him; he'll become a martyr overnight and play up to the base and Fox will trumpet it - no just build up the evidence (assuming there is more) and wait yout time.

 

[Shad]

It’s literally like you guys have wiped the 8 year long Republican temper tantrum from your memories.

You guys have to tell me the secret because I’ll have 4 years I’ll want erased at the end of this.

Nope I haven't.

 

[Shad]

Dems will be making a big mistake trying to impeach him; he'll become a martyr overnight and play up to the base and Fox will trumpet it - no just build up the evidence (assuming there is more) and wait yout time.

The GOP needs to flip. If the GOP does not vote for impeachment it won't matter how much evidence there is.

 

[Falvlun]

That was over affairs of state issues affecting the country. Obamacare..... Immigration ...
Not tabloid stuff worthy of the National Enquirer. CNN? Lol.

Not people's personalities and quirks or dwelling on irrelevant non pertinent issues either where the Dems/left remain perpetually stuck in the past , arguing and wasting time about issues after the fact has long since passed. Poor fellas haven't even got past the initial election yet. Probably won't either anytime soon .

Republicans hold tantrums over state of affairs issues , leaving the tabloid issues alongside the mentality of the rest to cry about which clearly has been well taken up by the way by our fine friends from the left .

Doing a good job at it too .

Oh my god. You really don’t remember the Obama years.
And please, let’s not pretend that all criticism of Trump is merely about personality or quirks.

Nope I haven't.

Then why are you acting like this “circus” is a new thing the democrats invented?

 

[Shad]

Then why are you acting like this “circus” is a new thing the democrats invented?

The circus is Congress as a body itself. The only thing that changes is which is on the main stage. An elephant on a ball or a donkey doing circles. Remember what I was talking about. Impeachment without the support of 2/3 of Congress is a waste of time and money. It is only political pandering unless the GOP flips on Trump. I expect a vote will be down party lines just like it was with Clinton minus a vote here and there. The GOP antics with Obama worked as the GOP had the majority to do so. It does not make it right but it does show a difference between power between then and now.

If the Dems try for impeachment and fails due to party voting this creates a precedents in Congress. The tactic become normalized regardless of possibility of a "win" outcome as political BS. Just like when the Dems went nuclear for lower court nominations the GOP did it later as a precedent had been set. Tit-for-tat. So again the crusade for impeachment without the GOP flipping is foolish. It is a carrot on a stick to get votes and/or a mass delusion held by many ignorant of how Congress functions.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The circus is Congress as a body itself. The only thing that changes is which is on the main stage. An elephant on a ball or a donkey doing circles. Remember what I was talking about. Impeachment without the support of 2/3 of Congress is a waste of time and money. It is only political pandering unless the GOP flips on Trump. I expect a vote will be down party lines just like it was with Clinton minus a vote here and there. The GOP antics with Obama worked as the GOP had the majority to do so. It does not make it right but it does show a difference between power between then and now.

If the Dems try for impeachment and fails due to party voting this creates a precedents in Congress. The tactic become normalized regardless of possibility of a "win" outcome as political BS. Just like when the Dems went nuclear for lower court nominations the GOP did it later as a precedent had been set. Tit-for-tat. So again the crusade for impeachment without the GOP flipping is foolish. It is a carrot on a stick to get votes and/or a mass delusion held by many ignorant of how Congress functions.

I think that cooler heads will prevail among the Democrats. Unless something heinous enough to cause the Republicans to flip arises it will simply be enough to allow Trump to continue to self destruct. The Democrats will benefit by Trump's presence in office.

 

[Falvlun]

The circus is Congress as a body itself. The only thing that changes is which is on the main stage. An elephant on a ball or a donkey doing circles. Remember what I was talking about. Impeachment without the support of 2/3 of Congress is a waste of time and money. It is only political pandering unless the GOP flips on Trump. I expect a vote will be down party lines just like it was with Clinton minus a vote here and there. The GOP antics with Obama worked as the GOP had the majority to do so. It does not make it right but it does show a difference between power between then and now.

If the Dems try for impeachment and fails due to party voting this creates a precedents in Congress. The tactic become normalized regardless of possibility of a "win" outcome as political BS. Just like when the Dems went nuclear for lower court nominations the GOP did it later as a precedent had been set. Tit-for-tat. So again the crusade for impeachment without the GOP flipping is foolish. It is a carrot on a stick to get votes and/or a mass delusion held by many ignorant of how Congress functions.

I don’t think the Dems would push for impeachment unless they were sure they had the numbers.

I also don’t think they’d do it unless there’s clear evidence that Trump commited serious crimes that would make him unfit for office. They know it will light a powder keg in this country if successful, so they have to be sure that it’s water-tight.

And if that’s the case, and the GOP wants to keep a criminal in office, I think that is much more egregious blow to our democracy than if the Dems go it alone.

And the precedent for frivolous, party-line impeachment was already set— by the Republicans, with Clinton.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I think that cooler heads will prevail among the Democrats. Unless something heinous enough to cause the Republicans to flip arises it will simply be enough to allow Trump to continue to self destruct. The Democrats will benefit by Trump's presence in office.

Yeah it would have to be much much more on the GOP side to call for Trump's impeachment on something.

Campaign Finance? I'd tell the left to give me a break. Maybe a monetary fine like Obama should they ever prove it that it is enough to even warrant a fine much less impeachment proceedings for which the left is looking pretty ridiculous as it stands already.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yeah it would have to be much much more on the GOP side to call for Trump's impeachment on something.

Campaign Finance? I'd tell the left to give me a break. Maybe a monetary fine like Obama should they ever prove it that it is enough to even warrant a fine much less impeachment proceedings for which the left is looking pretty ridiculous as it stands already.

Intent is a large factor in deciding punishment. Obama's campaign finance violations appeared to be due to incompetence and a bit of laziness. For as large as the campaign was it was a relatively small amount. Trump's amount was even more minuscule compared to the campaign as a whole, but the infraction was committed on purpose. We see that in all sorts of laws. A murder that is planned ahead and carried out is treated much more differently than a homicide that arises from neglect. They are both "homicides" but intent makes all the difference in the world.

 

[Shad]

I don’t think the Dems would push for impeachment unless they were sure they had the numbers.

Possible. A lot of the rhetoric from Dem politicians paints a different picture. For those people like Waters it would mean either they are liars baiting people for votes or delusional.

I also don’t think they’d do it unless there’s clear evidence that Trump commited serious crimes that would make him unfit for office. They know it will light a powder keg in this country if successful, so they have to be sure that it’s water-tight.

Again a lot of rhetoric shows otherwise. After all there were calls for impeachment the day of the election before the inauguration.

And if that’s the case, and the GOP wants to keep a criminal in office, I think that is much more egregious blow to our democracy than if the Dems go it alone.

*cough* Clinton.

Let's face it. The GOP will/dooes have a high standard as it their guy. Dems will have a lower standard as Trump isn't their guy. So I would first question what "clear evidence" means and what crimes qualify. Many have a different idea of what that means.

And the precedent for frivolous, party-line impeachment was already set— by the Republicans, with Clinton.

Clinton actually perjured himself, a crime. It was still a waste of time as parties still voted mostly down party lines. It was frivolous for two major reasons in my mind. The perjury trap Bill walked into and the idea Dems would flip over it.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Possible. A lot of the rhetoric from Dem politicians paints a different picture. For those people like Waters it would mean either they are liars baiting people for votes or delusional.

A dishonest politician? I am shocked! How could you make such a claim?

Again a lot of rhetoric shows otherwise. After all there were calls for impeachment the day of the election before the inauguration.

You should know by now that rhetoric is there to keep the base happy. Don't put too much stock into it.

*cough* Clinton.

Let's face it. The GOP will/do have a high standard as it their guy. Dems will have a lower standard as Trump isn't their guy. So I would first question what "clear evidence" means and what crimes qualify. Many have a different idea of what that means.

The Republicans were a bit foolish when it came to Clinton. He was a smarmy lying son of a female dog that has had puppies while in office. They did not like that sort of dishonesty used against them and they voted with their hears and not their heads. There are quite a few Democrats that are the same, but most realize that it would be foolish to attempt to oust Trump now. Right now he serves the role of useful idiot for them.

Clinton actually perjured himself, a crime. It was still a waste of time as parties still voted mostly down party lines. It was frivolous for two major reasons in my mind. The perjury trap Bill walked into and the idea Dems would flip over it.

Yep, he did. And Trump broke the campaign finance laws. Bill set up that trap himself when he signed a law that allowed the investigation of a person's sexual history when charged with sexual harassment. later found to be unconstitutional but too late for Bill. The perjury trap was of his own making. I do not think that Republicans were trying to catch him with that.

 

[Riders]

A dishonest politician? I am shocked! How could you make such a claim?



You should know by now that rhetoric is there to keep the base happy. Don't put too much stock into it.



The Republicans were a bit foolish when it came to Clinton. He was a smarmy lying son of a female dog that has had puppies while in office. They did not like that sort of dishonesty used against them and they voted with their hears and not their heads. There are quite a few Democrats that are the same, but most realize that it would be foolish to attempt to oust Trump now. Right now he serves the role of useful idiot for them.



Yep, he did. And Trump broke the campaign finance laws. Bill set up that trap himself when he signed a law that allowed the investigation of a person's sexual history when charged with sexual harassment. later found to be unconstitutional but too late for Bill. The perjury trap was of his own making. I do not think that Republicans were trying to catch him with that.

So all Clinton did for impeachment was lie? Then Trump has broken well campaign money fraud, obstruction, collusion at least and maybe more and we don't expect to impeach him?

Why even investigate, why investigate if they have no way of indicting or impeaching?

 

[Subduction Zone]

So all Clinton did for impeachment was lie? Then Trump has broken well campaign money fraud, obstruction, collusion at least and maybe more and we don't expect to impeach him?

Why even investigate, why investigate if they have no way of indicting or impeaching?

I said that they do not have enough to impeach Trump yet. The Republican attempt to impeach Clinton only strengthened the Democratic Party. If the Democrats are smart they will not impeach Trump and have the same results. Remember, removing a President from office is a two step process. Impeachment is relatively easy. It only takes a majority of the House of Representatives. Conviction is the difficult part and that takes 2/3 of the Senate. If they impeach him and fail to convict in the trial they take a huge risk of making Trump look like a martyr.

 

[Riders]

I said that they do not have enough to impeach Trump yet. The Republican attempt to impeach Clinton only strengthened the Democratic Party. If the Democrats are smart they will not impeach Trump and have the same results. Remember, removing a President from office is a two step process. Impeachment is relatively easy. It only takes a majority of the House of Representatives. Conviction is the difficult part and that takes 2/3 of the Senate. If they impeach him and fail to convict in the trial they take a huge risk of making Trump look like a martyr.

Ok but how is it that they convicted Clinton?

 

[Twilight Hue]

55 + post into this thread and they haven't impeached anybody yet?

Boy are people slow these days.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Why are Americans so chronically uninformed and ignorant about the process of impeachment? I would wager that likely most of the voting populace in America has seen one president impeached, and a good chunk of them seeing a president resign before he could be impeached. So why do we keep getting it wrong?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Ok but how is it that they convicted Clinton?

They did not convict Clinton, they only impeached him.

An impeachment is very similar to an indictment. It is a formal charging with a crime. Conviction occurs in the Senate and results in deposition. Clinton was not convicted.

 

[Riders]

55 + post into this thread and they haven't impeached anybody yet?

Boy are people slow these days.

Well trump has committed crime after crime after crime and apparently its not near good enough to impeach him. I guess unless he commits murder or rape were stuck with the a hole.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Well trump has committed crime after crime after crime and apparently its not near good enough to impeach him. I guess unless he commits murder or rape were stuck with the a hole.

What matters are not what crimes people think that he committed, but rather those that there is strong evidence that he committed. Once again, even members of his own party have to be convinced that they are better off without him than with him for him to be convicted.