Implication of Modern Science on Morality and Ethics

[PureX]

Since when does being stupid excuse others from exploiting a person? Do you think people CHOOSE to be stupid?

Yes, in most instances people do choose to be stupid. Especially here in the U.S., where truth and reality are just another commodity for sale. We happily buy into the delusion that we are a free and just and righteous nation, because that's what we want to believe. When in truth we are none of those things. And our situation is getting worse and worse because of this willful stupidity.

 

[PureX]

I know what you mean, yes they do it, but no money does not actually make anyone happy for more than a few moments.

I disagree. Money, in our culture, buys EVERYTHING a relatively stupid person would think to want. And the people that seek to acquire big piles of money are quite stupid people. The ones that succeed are also lucky, and clever, but they are nevertheless quite stupid. And in their stupidity they are very happy being rich, and easily able to ignore the horrible suffering their greed and selfishness causes others. Not to mention that there are a lot of stupid people that want to be just like them.

Doesn't mean you don't need it or that it is evil.

Money is just money. It's an abstract mechanism of trade. It's the greed, selfishness, and the willful dismissal of other people's suffering that is 'evil'. Which is why excessively rich people are evil, and why the more excess wealth they seek, and acquire, the more evil they are.

 

[ChieftheCef]

May I suggest that if someone has a lot of money, and it is not increasing their happiness, that perhaps they just aren't spending it right.

Don't ***, whatever you do. No, I have verified the facts. I gave the source. So don the big boy pants and ****ing learn you idiot.

You remind me of how everyone is special so no one is special.

 

[ChieftheCef]

I like positivity and think it is attainable for many people.

I am all for improving positivity and strengthening the mind. A tree that resists wind grows thicker. One that is never stressed becomes fragile, and in some ways our minds are like that.

I don't disagree at all.

The challenge is to become better than human, but we are human. How do we proceed?

Do these things: Exercise what you can, up from the least important action to the fulfillment of exercise, same with meditation. Now when you have a behavior you want to change do these three things: contemplate and convince yourself how sweet the rewards are, realize how bad it is without over and over throughout the time till and after you succeed, contemplate what challenges are associated with it. All the while you should learn to relax your body like with meditation, progressive muscle relaxation, EDMR and other things like them.

If you can keep a journal of everything that you observe in your day to day. While you do this, or without, be thankful to the ever flowing QUantum Field, for added therapuetic benefit. When you are thankful be sure to re feel and otherwise experience without action the pleasures of the days. There's something to do about the pain s but I don't know it yet. Slanted society /:

There's more, just learn from trusted sources, combine all you know by focusing on that instead of your addictions, consolidate, become stronger and get that addiction done. Speaking of which I have constructed a pre-text for quitting addictions. Lemme find i9t. It is proto.

 

[ChieftheCef]

Like I said: proto.

You are amazing. You have a body that can sustain itself, and does so in civilization, a paradise among decrepit paradise. You’re a necessarily repeating fluke. You beat everything else in comfort, and some of you are able to help make it that way in a more meaningful way than simply but necessarily supporting those that do, vertantly and inadvertently. But all of us grow stronger with every break as long as we let it. Everything that doesn’t kill you makes you stronger as long as it’s not too much in total. You are, besides your bit of the conscious well of souls (quantum field), also as many as there are stars in our sector of mini you, including their consciousness, all collaborating with other organisms through your walking world body. You are eons old to them, their generations have lived and died in a blink of your eye. There are eons of death-life-rebirth inside of you, in every place as either as you body or it’s inhabitants. You trade with them for stuff we need and they help keep you alive. Then when you start to recycle they eat you and become one with the environment i.e. go through a death. That is you. You breath out carbon dioxide to be breathed by plants who in turn make oxygen for you and I and every other moving thing just about to breath. Your poop is valuable. It gives food to bacteria and decomposers who in turn give food for other bacteria and then to plants and then to animals. And without your poop the same level of fertility wouldn’t be possible and thus oxygen for you and carbon dioxide for them and really everything for everything wouldn’t be there. YOu breath and make the world more livable. You fertilize everything. Your methane is needed to feed the methanotrophs who make food for the fertility cycle. And badness only grows things back stronger. You are relatively unique as well. You happen once in a light year, infinitely. You are always extant in every moment doing every thing. So make it count. You have always existed in Nothingness and are now, and forever, brought to life and will then begin to recycle into the soil and well of souls, absence, which is the chiefest part of you. We are all entertaining the Goddess, the Absence that Created Everything, the Void, the Quantum Field. You evolved from nothing, eonicaslly and gradually over time, never over stepping your bounds so much that you’d cease to be. Your ancestors knew things we’ve only begun discovering. They navigated by the stars with their bare hands. And all of them that led to you, got there. We travel through tumultuos seas of chaos, astride waves of gravity keeping us where we developed and holding us dear to those parameters. The whole world is fresh with life and opportunity. You can waste. But even the journey there will be one that will teach you something. And then you can move on and seize your life b y the day.

 

[ChieftheCef]

I disagree. Money, in our culture, buys EVERYTHING a relatively stupid person would think to want. And the people that seek to acquire big piles of money are quite stupid people. The ones that succeed are also lucky, and clever, but they are nevertheless quite stupid. And in their stupidity they are very happy being rich, and easily able to ignore the horrible suffering their greed and selfishness causes others. Not to mention that there are a lot of stupid people that want to be just like them.

Well, money does buy wellbeing it's just so little that if you actually knew you'd be like embaressed to say that. It'd seem you were chugging along to someone elses tune then, had you known.

Money is just money. It's an abstract mechanism of trade. It's the greed, selfishness, and the willful dismissal of other people's suffering that is 'evil'. Which is excessively rich people are evil, and why the more excess wealth they seek, and acquire, the more evil they are.

So the winner is 1 1/2

 

[wellwisher]

Science gives us more options, which is not a moral issue at all and only reflects positively on it. It allows us to live longer, remain more functional, and it makes life easier, safer, more comfortable, more efficient, and more interesting.

And your Christian morality, which is based in ancient, received values from people who didn't know where the rain came from or where the sun went at night, is not my humanist morality, which is based in reason applied to empathy and justice. I consider the American Christian position on abortion immoral.

Once again, not a moral issue regarding the science, but rather, its application.

And once again, I see the Christian attitude immoral and worse, its actions persecuting these people even more immoral. But then again, I'm a humanist, and my values come from a sense of empathy and justice, not ancient superstitions.

What you describe - avoiding STDs because they are diseases - is not moral behavior. It's just good hygiene.

And yet again, YOUR moral values are for YOU. They're not mine.

Also, sexual abstinence is not a virtue, and you can still catch a STD such as HIV being monogamous if your partner isn't.

War, along with the other causes of premature death common in biblical days such as high infant mortality, high maternal death during childbirth, and infection, is why we have to contend with ancient, primitive Christian values regarding sex. The ancients needed every fertile womb (except those of nuns, whose babies would have to be supported by the church along with their mothers) to churn out a baby every year, and anything that interfered with that was declared immoral - maidens remaining unmarried and childless, wives refusing sex to their husbands, masturbation, homosexuality, the rhythm method, early withdrawal, and in more modern times, medical abortion and artificial contraception, were all deemed immoral.

Worse, Christians perpetuate these values mindlessly today - a time when we need fewer people on the planet. In the States, they're back to forcing unwanted pregnancies to come to term as if those new people were still needed to prevent the tribe from going extinct or being made slaves as could happen in antiquity following an insufficiently defended invasion, when these rules were of practical value and importance.

Adultery and fornication didn't make that list. They were declared immoral not because of population concerns, but because of paternity and inheritance concerns.

You miss the point. If we took away science, many forms of modern behavior would not be possible. In a more natural world of natural living; organic, without science, different behavior become optimized and/or are possible or not possible. Processed food is due to food science.

Say we took away all medicines for STD's and all manufactures no longer produce any preventive hardware like condoms. People could not engage in the same behavior for very long, until the crap hits the fan. Classic morality imposes the natural standard. Once you add science, then unnatural become possible; processed foos, and it is called relative morality, as though it is just as good, even if dependent on the cleaning lady coming at night to mop the floor and empty the waste paper baskets. There is an out of sight and mind effect. We may like fast foods but try to ignore the additives so we can have a better time eating.

Fentanyl is a manufactured drug, made by science, that is addictive, in demand, with a high death toll. It is still chosen by many because of the new science morality. If we took away that science, that drug would not be an option and many would be healthier and alive.

Science does a lot of good things. However, the shady sides of humans can turn it upside down and call it right side up. A big issue for the political left are guns, which are a product of science. They would like to remove that science from culture to avoid the shady side bu talking away that option. While those who like guns, but maintain classic morality do not see any problem other than the dark side of humanity that can justify the new relative science morality.

 

[ChieftheCef]

Yes, in most instances people do choose to be stupid. Especially here in the U.S., where truth and reality are just another commodity for sale. We happily buy into the delusion that we are a free and just and righteous nation, because that's what we want to believe. When in truth we are none of those things. And our situation is getting worse and worse because of this willful stupidity.

There are a two kinds of people, those that learn (with he qualifier true information), and those that don't learn. The fault lies in the individual, not the environment.

 

[PureX]

Well, money does buy wellbeing it's just so little that if you actually knew you'd be like embaressed to say that. It'd seem you were chugging along to someone elses tune then, had you known.

Money buys life, health, freedom, happiness, respect, security, opportunity, all manner of pleasure, and the ability to satisfy any silly distracting itch that one might want scratched. This is more than enough to fully satisfy anyone that's too stupid or foolish to bother asking themselves about the actual value or purpose of their lives. And there are a LOT of these people among us.

So the winner is 1 1/2

I have no idea what that means. Qr who wins what.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

If we took away science, many forms of modern behavior would not be possible. In a more natural world of natural living; organic, without science, different behavior become optimized and/or are possible or not possible. Processed food is due to food science. Say we took away all medicines for STD's and all manufactures no longer produce any preventive hardware like condoms. People could not engage in the same behavior for very long, until the crap hits the fan. Classic morality imposes the natural standard. Once you add science, then unnatural become possible; processed foos

Take away all of science's achievements and see what results. For starters, mass starvation. Add increasing maternal and infant mortality, increasing death from infection, increasing death from poisoning, say goodbye to the diabetics and your eyeglasses, to your automobile and indoor lighting, and everything else that cave dwellers lacked.

Fentanyl is a manufactured drug, made by science, that is addictive, in demand, with a high death toll. It is still chosen by many because of the new science morality.

Science morality? Science is amoral - neither moral nor immoral.

Here's how I used fentanyl as a hospice medical director - for pain control. Narcotics and anesthetics have been a godsend in the management and prevention of pain. Transdermal fentanyl was a godsend for treating patients with moderate to severe chronic pain who cannot swallow pills. Before these patches, continuous IV infusion of morphine was necessary for such patients, but IV therapy is more expensive, more likely to induce infection, stops when the IV blows r falls out until a nurse can replace it, and is more restrictive becuase it connects one to a pole and a bag.

If we took away that science, that drug would not be an option and many would be healthier and alive.

That's short-sighted. You're only looking at half of the cost-benefit analysis.

Treating pain with potentially lethal drugs that could cause addiction was an ethical issue that plagued treating chronic pain patients. Many people benefitted and many either died or suffered in other ways (relationships, the law, employability).

I finally decided that I would treat pain as liberally as I deemed necessary knowing fully well that some of my prescriptions were being diverted and abused and that that would cause grief in some lives. I could be more distrustful and prescribe less to protect the weak form themselves at the expense of the suffering or just let people who are willing to risk death for recreational narcotic abuse meet whatever fate awaited them while making the lives compliant and sincere patients better. It wasn't a difficult choice.

A big issue for the political left are guns, which are a product of science. They would like to remove that science from culture

They want private gun ownership optimally regulated, not banned. They largely appreciate that the police are armed.

Money buys life, health, freedom, happiness, respect, security, opportunity, all manner of pleasure, and the ability to satisfy any silly distracting itch that one might want scratched

Those are mostly desirable things.

I don't know that money buys happiness. It buys freedom from many dysphorias such as food insecurity as you've indicated, and it makes many more options available, but that's not happiness. One still needs to discover what brings lasting happiness to know how to use that money properly.

 

[PureX]

Those are mostly desirable things.

I don't know that money buys happiness. It buys freedom from many dysphorias such as food insecurity as you've indicated, and it makes many more options available, but that's not happiness. One still needs to discover what brings lasting happiness to know how to use that money properly.

There is no "properly" with money. We have to impose that, ourselves. Something that stupid people are not so inclined to do beyond serving their own greed and selfishness.