-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
In general, where do Presbyterians fit on the liberal to fundamentalist spectrum?
- Thread starter wabisabi
- Start date
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
There are two strands of American Presbyterians - one is more conservative and one is more liberal.
That being said, most Presbyterian groups are very serious about the study of the Bible. That can be good or bad - depends on their individual application.
Presbyterianism also is a Calvinist sect, which believes and teaches predestination. Which is one reason why I USED to be Presbyterian, but am no longer.
I was raised Presbyterian so speaking from that experience I would say on your scale, they rate about a 7. Overall they're not a bad bunch, but there's a reason they're nicknamed The Frozen Chosen.
That being said, most Presbyterian groups are very serious about the study of the Bible. That can be good or bad - depends on their individual application.
Presbyterianism also is a Calvinist sect, which believes and teaches predestination. Which is one reason why I USED to be Presbyterian, but am no longer.
I was raised Presbyterian so speaking from that experience I would say on your scale, they rate about a 7. Overall they're not a bad bunch, but there's a reason they're nicknamed The Frozen Chosen.
wabisabi
Member
I'm a little dense sometimes. Is that because they're stuck in their ways, or am I totally off base?
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
LOL, you're not dense - I just know this phrase because I grew up with it.
The (off) doctrine of predestination teaches that we don't really have free will - that God chooses who He wants and therefore, if you're not predestined for heaven, well that's just tough.
That sort of thinking leads to an unsympathetic and dispassionate mindset in my opinion - and that's apparently the opinion of others, who have nicknamed the Presbyterians the Frozen Chosen.
Besides that, Presbyterians in general are VERY traditional in their worship services, and also very (in my opinion) paranoid about "Roman" influences. I remember when I was the music director of a Presbyterian church, they would not allow us to sing Ave Maria during the Christmas Eve service. WHAT THE HECK - she was the mother of Christ! Give me a break!
They tend to be more intellectual than the average church groups though, to give them some credit. They have some excellent Sunday School and bible study programs. Most of their doctrines are in my opinion very sound - even if the presentation is a bit dry for my taste.
The (off) doctrine of predestination teaches that we don't really have free will - that God chooses who He wants and therefore, if you're not predestined for heaven, well that's just tough.
That sort of thinking leads to an unsympathetic and dispassionate mindset in my opinion - and that's apparently the opinion of others, who have nicknamed the Presbyterians the Frozen Chosen.
Besides that, Presbyterians in general are VERY traditional in their worship services, and also very (in my opinion) paranoid about "Roman" influences. I remember when I was the music director of a Presbyterian church, they would not allow us to sing Ave Maria during the Christmas Eve service. WHAT THE HECK - she was the mother of Christ! Give me a break!
They tend to be more intellectual than the average church groups though, to give them some credit. They have some excellent Sunday School and bible study programs. Most of their doctrines are in my opinion very sound - even if the presentation is a bit dry for my taste.
The Middle
Member
I'm a Presbyterian and I'm very middle-of-the-road. The PC(USA) is by far the largest denomination, and it's mostly moderate-to-liberal. The PCA is a much smaller denomination and it's mostly conservative.
Smoke
Done here.
Presbyterians are the descendants of the Scottish Reformed tradition -- "Reformed" meaning "Calvinist," as distinguished from Lutheran, Hussite, Anabaptist, Baptist, etc.
They are presbyterian as distinguished from episcopalian; that is, they are governed by elders (presbyteroi) rather than by bishops (episkopoi).
A quick run-down of US Presbyterians:
Presbyterian Church in the U.S.A. (PCUSA) - by far the largest (over 10,000 congregations), this denomination was formed by the merger of the United Presbyterian Church in the U.S.A and the Presbyterian Church in the United States. Not so Calvinistic. This is where you find the moderates and liberals, though the denomination has its share of conservatives, too. The really hardline evangelical/fundy types have mostly left for other denominations. You can think of them as the "Episcopalians" of Presbyterianism.
Presbyterian Church in America (PCA) - with about 1700 congregations, this is an evangelical (not in the sense of "Lutheran")/fundamentalist group that broke off from the PCUS in the 1970s mostly over women elders, but they also have the full complement of fundy issues. Think of them as the "Southern Baptists" of Presbyterianism. However, the PCA is also Calvinistic and is also the haven of many Dominionists in the tradition of R. J. Rushdoony. In other words, this is where you find most of the really scary-crazy Presbyterians in the U.S.
Cumberland Presbyterian Church, at about 800 congregations, is a mostly Southern, and traditionally rather liberal denomination. With the rise of the Religious Right, the CPC has tended to drift more toward evangelicalism. You can think of them as the United Methodists of Presbyterianism.
Evangelical Presbyterian Church has around 225 congregations. It's a theologically (Calvinist) and socially conservative denomination, though it does ordain women. You can think of them as the "Church of the Nazarene" of Presbyterianism.
Associate Reformed Presybterian Church has about the same number of congregations as the EPC, but fewer members. It's Calvinist and very conservative. Doesn't ordain women, doesn't like gay people or legal abortion, maintains the inerrancy of the Bible. This is the "Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod" of Presybterianism, and it's also the church Billy Graham grew up in.
There are other, smaller Presbyterian denominations in the U.S., of course, but those are the most notable ones.
They are presbyterian as distinguished from episcopalian; that is, they are governed by elders (presbyteroi) rather than by bishops (episkopoi).
A quick run-down of US Presbyterians:
Presbyterian Church in the U.S.A. (PCUSA) - by far the largest (over 10,000 congregations), this denomination was formed by the merger of the United Presbyterian Church in the U.S.A and the Presbyterian Church in the United States. Not so Calvinistic. This is where you find the moderates and liberals, though the denomination has its share of conservatives, too. The really hardline evangelical/fundy types have mostly left for other denominations. You can think of them as the "Episcopalians" of Presbyterianism.
Presbyterian Church in America (PCA) - with about 1700 congregations, this is an evangelical (not in the sense of "Lutheran")/fundamentalist group that broke off from the PCUS in the 1970s mostly over women elders, but they also have the full complement of fundy issues. Think of them as the "Southern Baptists" of Presbyterianism. However, the PCA is also Calvinistic and is also the haven of many Dominionists in the tradition of R. J. Rushdoony. In other words, this is where you find most of the really scary-crazy Presbyterians in the U.S.
Cumberland Presbyterian Church, at about 800 congregations, is a mostly Southern, and traditionally rather liberal denomination. With the rise of the Religious Right, the CPC has tended to drift more toward evangelicalism. You can think of them as the United Methodists of Presbyterianism.
Evangelical Presbyterian Church has around 225 congregations. It's a theologically (Calvinist) and socially conservative denomination, though it does ordain women. You can think of them as the "Church of the Nazarene" of Presbyterianism.
Associate Reformed Presybterian Church has about the same number of congregations as the EPC, but fewer members. It's Calvinist and very conservative. Doesn't ordain women, doesn't like gay people or legal abortion, maintains the inerrancy of the Bible. This is the "Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod" of Presybterianism, and it's also the church Billy Graham grew up in.
There are other, smaller Presbyterian denominations in the U.S., of course, but those are the most notable ones.