In God's Image?

[Tiberius]

Something that popped up in another thread I' in, but I didn't think it fit in there, as it was off topic so i decided to start this thread to discuss it.

In the Bible it says:

And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness

What exactly does this mean? In what way are we in God's image?

Is it literal appearance? I don't see how this could be, as God (being all-powerful) could easily appear to us as an elephant if he wanted to.

Is it in wisdom? Obviously not, because when Adam and Eve were created they didn't even have wisdom enough to tell good from evil.

Is it in spirit? That would mean that our spirit is like the spirit of God. I can't imagine that there would be many Xians who'd be prepared to admit to that.

In emotion? Then that would mean that the love God feels for us is a love we can experience ourselves.

So, is there any clear answer to this? Something that Xians actually agree on?

 

[Nick Soapdish]

I do not think it was referring to anything physical, but something much deeper and true to what we are. I believe it has something to do with God making us as creative beings. We are not simply stimulus-response organisms, but rather we have the ability to invent. We have freewill, reason, creativity and the ability to choose. This is at the core of our identity and purpose.

And of course, God is the ultimate creator.

 

[Tiberius]

Chimps have been seen inventing things as well. Tools to get food, such as trimming twings to get access to termites, chewing leaves so they can make a sponge to soak up water at the bottom of a hole.

Also, crows in Japan have invented a method for cracking hard shelled nuts by dropping them on roads so they are crushed by the passing cars. They've even learnt to do this at intersections so they can gather the crushed nuts in safety while the lights have turned red.

So if our inventiveness is the way in which we were made in God's image, then chimps and crows were also made in God's image. And many other animals I'm sure.

 

[gnostic]

To Tiberius:

I think the usual interpretation of this passage that God looks "human", but since he made man in God's image, then it would be the other way around.

To atofel:

Though your interpretation is wonderful, I don't think this is likely.

 

[jeffrey]

I've always thought the most interesting aspect of that passage is the word "us"....

 

[Master Vigil]

I've always seen this concept as an attributation to humans insatiable attachment to our ego.

 

[gnostic]

I've always thought the most interesting aspect of that passage is the word "us"....

Yes, it is. And "our image" and "our likeness". There seemed to be room for a lot of gods (and goddesses) in this heaven.

In Genesis 6, about the angels who had taken mortal wives, it state the "sons of God" (or "sons of gods", depending on the translation), then does this refer to many sons, other than Jesus?

 

[Master Vigil]

I've always seen this concept as an attributation to humans insatiable attachment to our ego.

Life on earth is gods tree. A farmer plants his seeds knowing what fruits his trees will bear. As did God plant his seeds on the earth knowing what fruits his trees will bear. Humans are the fruit of gods tree of life, and the pride of his seeds.

See why?

 

[jeffrey]

Yes, it is. And "our image" and "our likeness". There seemed to be room for a lot of gods (and goddesses) in this heaven.

In Genesis 6, about the angels who had taken mortal wives, it state the "sons of God" (or "sons of gods", depending on the translation), then does this refer to many sons, other than Jesus?

I agree. Things that make you go hmm..

 

[Tiberius]

Life on earth is gods tree. A farmer plants his seeds knowing what fruits his trees will bear. As did God plant his seeds on the earth knowing what fruits his trees will bear. Humans are the fruit of gods tree of life, and the pride of his seeds.

That doesn't really answer the question. I'm not asking what the nature of God's relationship to people is, I'm asking in what way are we in God's image. Your answer doesn't address this, unless you are saying that the fruit is grown in the farmer's image.

 

[Tiberius]

So we have the same kind of spirit as God. Since god is nothing but spirit according to you, then everything God is must be contained within his spirit. And if we have the same kind of spirit as God, shouldn't we be gods?

 

[Tiberius]

Then are you saying that in the same way that a bunch of atoms together make a Human that a bunch of humans together make a God?

 

[michel]

Something that popped up in another thread I' in, but I didn't think it fit in there, as it was off topic so i decided to start this thread to discuss it.

In the Bible it says:



What exactly does this mean? In what way are we in God's image?

Is it literal appearance? I don't see how this could be, as God (being all-powerful) could easily appear to us as an elephant if he wanted to.

Is it in wisdom? Obviously not, because when Adam and Eve were created they didn't even have wisdom enough to tell good from evil.

Is it in spirit? That would mean that our spirit is like the spirit of God. I can't imagine that there would be many Xians who'd be prepared to admit to that.

In emotion? Then that would mean that the love God feels for us is a love we can experience ourselves.

So, is there any clear answer to this? Something that Xians actually agree on?

I think you'll find that quite a few think as I do.

Is it literal appearance?

Many Christians would agree with this one, but I personally don't subscribe to it, partly for the very same reasonable point you made about this.

Is it in wisdom?

If wisdom = intelligence + experience, the I would say God must be pretty wise! No, I don't think wisdom.

Is it in spirit?

Bingo! I believe that we are all spirit, as God is. the difference between our spirits and his is that ours need to learn, to become wise, to then become "one" with God.

In emotion?

I doubt very much that we can understand God's love. I would imagine that God loves Hitler and Saddam Hussein, and all the other tyrants. He probably sees them as "Children who have been led astray by greed"; I am trying to understand the "Love the sinner, hate the sin" principle; I knopw that that is something to learn.

 

[Tiberius]

So, if we are like God in spirit, either we have a God-like spirit, or God has a Human-like spirit.

One raises us infinitely high (God is infinite, after all), and the other limits God to Humanity. Which one would you rather do?

In any case, I'd appreciate it if you could tell me how a Human's spirit and God's spirit are the same. After all, God has been said to be nothing but spirit. if that is true, then everything God is must be contained within that spirit. And if our spirits are the same, then everything that God is must be contained within our spirits as well. Even if our spirits are merely similar, then we must still have similar spiritual properties to God.

 

[Opethian]

I believe it has something to do with God making us as creative beings. We are not simply stimulus-response organisms,

Yes we are, we are simply very complex organisms that respond to a large array of stimuli in very complex patterns, but we still are stimuli-response organisms.

but rather we have the ability to invent

Because we have evolved to an organism with a greater intelligence than the other species on this planet.

We have freewill

Nothing has free will. Not you, not me.

reason

All organisms have reason.

creativity

A lot of organisms have creativity. Ever seen a crow drop a nut on the freeway, exactly at the place where the cars wheels pass as they drive by, in front of a red light so that the crow can pick it up when the light's on red? I have.

and the ability to choose

Every organism can choose. Yet those choices can be predicted because of the laws of physics and insight in biochemistry. This eliminates the concept of free will.

This is at the core of our identity and purpose.

The only thing that truly separates us from other organisms is our higher intelligence.

 

[Tiberius]

Nothing has free will. Not you, not me.

Every organism can choose. Yet those choices can be predicted because of the laws of physics and insight in biochemistry. This eliminates the concept of free will.

In what sense is it a "CHOICE" then, if there is only one possible outcome.

 

[Opethian]

In what sense is it a "CHOICE" then, if there is only one possible outcome.

The process that goes on in our brain as the available information is coming in and the output is forming, could be perceived as a choice, although it has only one possible outcome based on the laws of physics.

Btw, do you believe in free will Tiberius? If you do, what are your reasons?

 

[Tiberius]

yes, I believe in free will.

The main arguments against free will are the "God knows everything", but as I am an atheist, it doesn't apply to me. Your argument appears to be based on an assumption, and I do not agree with that assumption. Perhaps you can support your claim that knowledge of available information allows prediction of future events?

I mean, I understand what you're trying to say - that if I know everything about you, i'll know what your mood tomorrow will be and thus I will know which teeshirt you'll want to wear.

But that doesn't mean that i can use it to predict the future. What if your house burns down tonight? What if you die in your sleep? There are lots of things that can prevent you from fulfilling the "destiny" I figured out by knowing everything about you.

So I believe in free will because the arguments against it are ones I do not find plausible.

besides, if the choice is already made, then I could spend a long time agonising over a difficult decision when there's no need. Why agonise over whether to kill your child with your bare hands in order to save a hundred million people if there's only one possible option?

Anyway, back on topic... God's image and all that...

 

[Scuba Pete]

What exactly does this mean? In what way are we in God's image?

Is it in spirit? That would mean that our spirit is like the spirit of God. I can't imagine that there would be many Xians who'd be prepared to admit to that.

God is Spirit... if we are in his likeness, then it must be spiritual. Unfortunately, we have lost that likeness in many respects. Growing in the "Grace" of God means becoming more like him in Spirit.

 

[Super Universe]

God is everlasting sentient energy. God created the universe for sentient life to grow from matter in varied types. There are millions of different types of life on this planet alone.

The genetic engineers (angels) developed DNA and choose the specific type to seed a new planet with depending on the planet's environment: level of gravity, availability of light, amount of cosmic rays, available food, atmosphere type.

The genetic engineers do their best to protect and nurture the chosen life's evolution until it is able to make the first moral decision, then they must leave the planet and allow it to develop it's own soul connection.

Over time (we are taking an extremely long time) sentient species connections to their souls increase and they know they are not alone.