India and Prophet Muhammad(pbuh)

[Manish_agarwal]

I read a hadith of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) today which I had never heard of in my life. It is referred to on site (with comments on its source and origin) and is translated as follows:



(Hind is the Arabic term for India.)

What I had heard of since childhood was the couplet of the famous urdu poet Iqbal in a poem titled "The national song of Indian children" which the site claims was based on another hadith ("I feel a cool breeze coming from Hind."):

(translation is my own; the urdu poem may be read

I have long felt that the inner ways of Islam are more closer to portions of Hinduism then to Christianity/Judaism since the entire idea of "dharma" is closely linked to the idea of "deen", and the idea of Din-al-Fitrat akin to Sanatan dharma. Islam stands in marked similarity to Hinduism also in the sense that the strict demarcation between the secular and the religious is absent in both traditions signifying the oneness of the world as a reflection of oneness of God. (I recall a Sufi saint also referring to a Hindu tradition as the highest form of tawheed.)

Many other points are discussed in article One of the points says how later interpretations of Islam (in my view influenced by the Hellenic-Christian civilization for which Islam had to make apologetic adjustments) have externally made Islamic studies adopt a posture of a marked difference between man and God in contrast to Hinduism. (It is argued in the article that this was not the original Islamic position; Cf verse such as "All is from God-Quran 4:78")

Thoughts?

If you see the Vedic religion which is what the Brahmins believe......it is very similar to Islam.

Aspect of Vedic religion:
1. Belief in scriptures - vedas
2. Belief in Heaven/hell after death and 1 life.
3. Belief in 1 God.

So Vedic religion is very similar to Islam

 

[Madhuri]

If you see the Vedic religion which is what the Brahmins believe......it is very similar to Islam.

Aspect of Vedic religion:
1. Belief in scriptures - vedas
2. Belief in Heaven/hell after death and 1 life.
3. Belief in 1 God.

So Vedic religion is very similar to Islam

Hindus do not believe in heaven and hell after one life. Some Hindus do not even believe in heaven and hell.

Hindus generally believe in one God but the ideas of this one God are very different from the Islamic concept.

 

[tariqkhwaja]

If you see the Vedic religion which is what the Brahmins believe......it is very similar to Islam.

Aspect of Vedic religion:
1. Belief in scriptures - vedas
2. Belief in Heaven/hell after death and 1 life.
3. Belief in 1 God.

So Vedic religion is very similar to Islam

There are, in fact, many similarities between religions and of all religions with Islam. It is, in fact, proof that they were revealed by the same God although humans messed with them as time progressed.

I, too, respect Krishna as a righteous individual and Prophet of God. I hope you can respect my Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) as well.

 

[Madhuri]

There are, in fact, many similarities between religions and of all religions with Islam. It is, in fact, proof that they were revealed by the same God although humans messed with them as time progressed.

I, too, respect Krishna as a righteous individual and Prophet of God. I hope you can respect my Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) as well.

It is true, there are aspects of all religions present within Hinduism. Some Hindus also believe that Muhammad was empowered by God.

 

[Manish_agarwal]

Hindus do not believe in heaven and hell after one life. Some Hindus do not even believe in heaven and hell.

Hindus generally believe in one God but the ideas of this one God are very different from the Islamic concept.

well the 3 vedas say there is hell and heaven and there is only 1 life and after that u goto Brahma -Loka - heaven. that is the basis of vedas. either the vedas are lying or u are lying. which of the 2?

 

[Madhuri]

well the 3 vedas say there is hell and heaven and there is only 1 life and after that u goto Brahma -Loka - heaven. that is the basis of vedas. either the vedas are lying or u are lying. which of the 2?

Clearly you have not heard of reincarnation.

But I will accept your quotes and sources for review.

PS: I am objecting to your statement about there being only 1 life. Of course I know there are references to heavenly planets and hellish planets (plural).

 

[Manish_agarwal]

Clearly you have not heard of reincarnation.

But I will accept your quotes and sources for review.

PS: I am objecting to your statement about there being only 1 life. Of course I know there are references to heavenly planets and hellish planets (plural).

i meant 1 life in earth. after that there is either heavens or hells.

 

[Madhuri]

i meant 1 life in earth. after that there is either heavens or hells.

My understanding is that one can go from Earth to heaven or hell and from heaven or hell they can also come back to Earth. One can be born as an animal and then a person on Earth or back to an animal again depending on his karma and state of consciousness.

It is important to understand that when reading the Vedas you also need to have knowledge of the Upanishads, which are explanations of Veda (because Veda is highly symbolic and difficult to understand).

 

[Reverend Rick]

i meant 1 life in earth. after that there is either heavens or hells.

Manish, if I may ask, where are you from?

What is your background on this subject?

 

[Manish_agarwal]

Manish, if I may ask, where are you from?

What is your background on this subject?

how does it matter where im from?. I am telling you what the vedas say. i have read the vedas. In the vedas there are many verses in rigveds to reach the heaven. Similarly in Athar veda there is only 1 life on earth and then u goto different types of heaven or Hell(naraka).

Dont divert the subject.

 

[Manish_agarwal]

My understanding is that one can go from Earth to heaven or hell and from heaven or hell they can also come back to Earth. One can be born as an animal and then a person on Earth or back to an animal again depending on his karma and state of consciousness.

It is important to understand that when reading the Vedas you also need to have knowledge of the Upanishads, which are explanations of Veda (because Veda is highly symbolic and difficult to understand).

Upanishad and Vedas have absolutely no connection whatsoever.

Read the Purva Mimamsa by Janani. Vedas refer to Karma kandyas(rites and rituals of vedic sacrifice) and Jnana kandya - (knowledge of Atma of Upanishad). Janani has mentioned the 2 are different and Karma Kandya is more important for salvation than Jnana Kandya.

Even Bhagavat Gita says the Vedas (Karma Kandya) are priority than Jnana because Bhagavat Gita follows from Purva mimamsa

 

[Reverend Rick]

how does it matter where im from?. I am telling you what the vedas say. i have read the vedas. In the vedas there are many verses in rigveds to reach the heaven. Similarly in Athar veda there is only 1 life on earth and then u goto different types of heaven or Hell(naraka).

Dont divert the subject.

I believe asking an atheist what their qualifications are to speak with such authority is not diverting the subject.

The topic is Indian related, asking where you are from is a valid question as well.

If you have traveled to India or lived in India would explain your expertise.

 

[Manish_agarwal]

I believe asking an atheist what their qualifications are to speak with such authority is not diverting the subject.

The topic is Indian related, asking where you are from is a valid question as well.

If you have traveled to India or lived in India would explain your expertise.

I am from India and a former Hindu.

 

[Manish_agarwal]

I believe asking an atheist what their qualifications are to speak with such authority is not diverting the subject.

The topic is Indian related, asking where you are from is a valid question as well.

If you have traveled to India or lived in India would explain your expertise.

Following are preeminent books of Hinduism , which are of highest authority. Rig-Veda (hymns recited by the hotar) Yajur-Veda (hymns recited by the adhvaryu) Sama-Veda (hymns recited by the udgatr) Atharva-Veda (a collection of ancient spells and charms,brahma ) All talk of Vedic Rites and Rituals (Karma-kanda). There is no rebirth or moksha here. The liturgical core of each of the Vedas are supplemented by commentaries on each text which all belong to the śruti canon: Brahmanas Aranyakas Brahmanas and Aranyakas again deal with Karma-Kanda and their commentary. Upanishads are the first texts which start dealing with Rebirth. However if you read the Upanishad they are in no way connected with Vedas in 1 single thing. They cannot be commentary of Vedas because what is mentioned in Vedas and Upanishads are diametrically opposite. Unfortunately I am not a Brahmin myself so I cannot answer why Upanishads are contradicting the Vedas...

 

[Madhuri]

Upanishad and Vedas have absolutely no connection whatsoever.

The Upanishads are commentary on the Veda and considered to be divine revelations (Sruti). Each Upanishad is associated with a particular Veda. If you were Hindu before, how come you do not know this?

 

[Manish_agarwal]

The Upanishads are commentary on the Veda and considered to be divine revelations (Sruti). Each Upanishad is associated with a particular Veda. If you were Hindu before, how come you do not know this?

Well, I dont go by what someone says. I read stuff myself.

The Brahmanas and Aranyaka contain the line by line commentary of the verses of the 4 vedas LINE BY LINE.

Each Brahmanas and Aranyaka explain Line by Line the proper way to do ritual mentioned in the 4 Vedas - Rig, Vajur, Sama, Som

The Upanishad do not contain Commentary of Vedas. In fact they have no connection with 4 Vedas whatsoever. They touch a completely different subject not related to 4 vedas.


PS: There are many Upanishads they talk of Phiilosophy and stuff.......Not commentary of 4 Vedas.

 

[Manish_agarwal]

Upanishads are not connected in a single word with the Vedas. They touch a completely different topic all together. Being a Hindu u shuld havve known that.


And also several Upanishads are contradicting each other. Some say there is Rebirth while other Upanishads completely contradict and take the position of the Vedas (1 Life) then heaven or hell.

ps: im not trying to offend Hinduism or Hindus here. I am just telling from what I have read and understood from the scriptures. No offence is intended.

 

[Madhuri]

Well, I dont go by what someone says. I read stuff myself.

The Brahmanas and Aranyaka contain the line by line commentary of the verses of the 4 vedas LINE BY LINE.

Each Brahmanas and Aranyaka explain Line by Line the proper way to do ritual mentioned in the 4 Vedas - Rig, Vajur, Sama, Som

The Upanishad do not contain Commentary of Vedas. In fact they have no connection with 4 Vedas whatsoever. They touch a completely different subject not related to 4 vedas.


PS: There are many Upanishads they talk of Phiilosophy and stuff.......Not commentary of 4 Vedas.

You are right that the Aranyaka and Brahmanas are explanations associated with the Vedas. Even foremost to those are the Samhitas. But the Upanishads are also attached to the Vedas. These are the 4 sections of the Vedas. They are the Sruti texts of Hinduism (and many also consider the Bhagavad Gita to be Sruti).

 

[Reverend Rick]

I am from India and a former Hindu.

Are there many Indian Athesists? Is it common? The doctors here in the U.S.A. that have come from India that I know are Muslim, Hindu and Buddhist.

 

[Manish_agarwal]

You are right that the Aranyaka and Brahmanas are explanations associated with the Vedas. Even foremost to those are the Samhitas. But the Upanishads are also attached to the Vedas. These are the 4 sections of the Vedas. They are the Sruti texts of Hinduism (and many also consider the Bhagavad Gita to be Sruti).

Our point of debate is whether Upanishad are the commentary of the vedas or not?. Anyone can see very clearly that they are not the commentary of the vedas.

I dont understand by the term "attached to the vedas". If they are attached then yes they are attached to the Sruti but not considered as Vedas. And please dont call them as commentary of the vedas . That would be a huge lie. They are NO in way related to the vedas whatsoever.

How can you call one with Rites,Rituals, Sacrificce and one with Philosophical speculations to be related?. Its absurb really your logic here.

And 3 Vedas are supposed to be of origin around 2500 BC or so. The Upanishads origin is much much later to the vedas almost 2000 years after Rig veda. Besides the subject matter of 2 are not related whatsoever.