Intel sources indicate Russia is trying to sow discord in the U.S.

[Stevicus]

Russia Trying to Stoke U.S. Racial Tensions Before Election, Officials Say

WASHINGTON — The Russian government has stepped up efforts to inflame racial tensions in the United States as part of its bid to influence November’s presidential election, including trying to incite violence by white supremacist groups and to stoke anger among African-Americans, according to seven American officials briefed on recent intelligence.

Russia’s lead intelligence agency, the S.V.R., has apparently gone beyond 2016 methods of interference, when operatives tried to stoke racial animosity by creating fake Black Lives Matter groups and spreading disinformation to depress black voter turnout. Now, Russia is also trying to influence white supremacist groups, the officials said; they gave few details, but one official said federal investigators are examining how at least one neo-Nazi organization with ties to Russia is funded.

Other Russian efforts, which American intelligence agencies have tracked, involve simply prodding white nationalists to more aggressively spread hate messages and amplifying their invective. Russian operatives are also trying to push black extremist groups toward violence, according to multiple officials, though they did not detail how.

The article mentions that the officials spoke on condition of anonymity, and that the Russians are trying to foster a sense of chaos in the U.S. (not that that would be very difficult to do).

Russia’s primary goal, according to several officials briefed on the intelligence who spoke on condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive information, is to foster a sense of chaos in the United States, though its motivations are under debate and difficult to decipher in the absence of high-level intelligence sources inside Moscow.

They can't discern their motives because they have no high-level intelligence sources inside Moscow.

I wonder if other countries are doing this. I mean, it's relatively easy to troll the internet. Any ordinary Joe can do it from his own home, without the need for backing or support from foreign governments or intelligence agencies.

It's relatively easy to get people riled up, especially in a culture of rageaholics like ours. It's all the more reason for people to take a chill pill and learn to govern their passions a little better. There's too much knee-jerk, phony "outrage" - yet so many people can be fooled and manipulated in this way. This is what makes our democracy vulnerable to these kinds of tricks. I'm not saying that any of this is actually happening, but it's easy to see how it could happen.

The F.B.I. and other intelligence agencies declined to comment on specific Russian activities.

“We see Russia is willing to conduct more brazen and disruptive influence operations because of how it perceives its conflict with the West,” David Porter, a top agent on the F.B.I.’s Foreign Influence Task Force, said last month at an election security conference in Washington.

He added, “To put it simply, in this space, Russia wants to watch us tear ourselves apart.”

I believe that it's true that there are sharp divisions within the U.S., and it's entirely probable that outside forces may be trying to exacerbate and intensify such differences within the political and cultural landscape. But we, as Americans, are still the ones who created those divisions in the first place. We have to face that and own up to that, before we start accusing others of taking advantage of our weaknesses.

Apparently, they've used such tactics before:

The tactics date at least to the Cold War, when the Soviet Union tried to exacerbate racial tensions in the United States. “The most successful efforts in these kinds of interference activities are those that exploit real division,” Ms. Rosenberger said. “Race is certainly one in the United States.”

Independent researchers continue to identify social media accounts with Russian links. Race was among the top issues that such accounts tried to foster division over, said Young Mie Kim, a University of Wisconsin professor who studies political communication online. Others included nationalism, immigration, gun control and gay rights.

Russia Today, the television station controlled by the Kremlin, has fanned division on both sides. Last week, RT ran a story about a video of New York police arresting a black man that sparked outrage. The organization has also posted tweets aimed at stirring white animosity, publishing an article in January accusing The New York Times of hating white people and criticizing Hank Azaria for quitting as the voice of Apu on “The Simpsons” because of its stereotyping of South Asians.

So, what is the solution here? Should we just cut off all Russian communication with the US? Can an entire country be banned from the internet? And even if we could ban Russia, it wouldn't do a thing, since they could just send agents to any country and set up shop as bonafide "keyboard warriors."

Is it up to each of us, as voters and internet users, to try to keep our cool and stop instantly reacting with knee-jerk outrage over every little thing they might see? There are too many hotheads, and they need to stop getting mad.

Should we follow the teachings of Surak and embrace logic over emotion? That would seem to be the only effective defense against this kind of interference.

 

[Shad]

Russia does not need to lift a finger as it already exists in the USA from real racism to hoaxes.

 

[Stevicus]

Russia does not need to lift a finger as it already exists in the USA from real racism to hoaxes.

True, although I guess it would be easy enough for any country (or even a group of trolls) to exacerbate such tensions in the U.S. these days.

 

[Stevicus]

I mean, look how easy it can be to rile up some of the posters here on RF, and I consider RF posters to be far more mellow and relaxed than the typical internet denizen.

 

[Shad]

True, although I guess it would be easy enough for any country (or even a group of trolls) to exacerbate such tensions in the U.S. these days.

Pretty much considering hoaxes get front page coverage and are treated like gospel until exposed.

 

[Quintessence]

Unfortunately for Russia, the United States is a multicultural society and is quite accustomed to the inevitable discord that accompanies this. And the most multicultural areas of this country tend to be fairly liberal and get along with each other just fine. This is a battle they can't win because of the nature of the United States as a country. They're wasting their time. Doubly so when the entire planet is going to have far worse things to concern itself with over the next two centuries.

 

[Thief]

the Russians are trying to foster a sense of chaos in the U.S.

they are too late

 

[BSM1]

Russia Trying to Stoke U.S. Racial Tensions Before Election, Officials Say



The article mentions that the officials spoke on condition of anonymity, and that the Russians are trying to foster a sense of chaos in the U.S. (not that that would be very difficult to do).



They can't discern their motives because they have no high-level intelligence sources inside Moscow.

I wonder if other countries are doing this. I mean, it's relatively easy to troll the internet. Any ordinary Joe can do it from his own home, without the need for backing or support from foreign governments or intelligence agencies.

It's relatively easy to get people riled up, especially in a culture of rageaholics like ours. It's all the more reason for people to take a chill pill and learn to govern their passions a little better. There's too much knee-jerk, phony "outrage" - yet so many people can be fooled and manipulated in this way. This is what makes our democracy vulnerable to these kinds of tricks. I'm not saying that any of this is actually happening, but it's easy to see how it could happen.



I believe that it's true that there are sharp divisions within the U.S., and it's entirely probable that outside forces may be trying to exacerbate and intensify such differences within the political and cultural landscape. But we, as Americans, are still the ones who created those divisions in the first place. We have to face that and own up to that, before we start accusing others of taking advantage of our weaknesses.

Apparently, they've used such tactics before:





So, what is the solution here? Should we just cut off all Russian communication with the US? Can an entire country be banned from the internet? And even if we could ban Russia, it wouldn't do a thing, since they could just send agents to any country and set up shop as bonafide "keyboard warriors."

Is it up to each of us, as voters and internet users, to try to keep our cool and stop instantly reacting with knee-jerk outrage over every little thing they might see? There are too many hotheads, and they need to stop getting mad.

Should we follow the teachings of Surak and embrace logic over emotion? That would seem to be the only effective defense against this kind of interference.

Ya think? Russia has never ended the Cold War...

 

[exchemist]

Unfortunately for Russia, the United States is a multicultural society and is quite accustomed to the inevitable discord that accompanies this. And the most multicultural areas of this country tend to be fairly liberal and get along with each other just fine. This is a battle they can't win because of the nature of the United States as a country. They're wasting their time. Doubly so when the entire planet is going to have far worse things to concern itself with over the next two centuries.

Yes I suspect there is a lot in what you say here.

Although it is disreputable and sinister of Russia to try to do this, we may in years to come look back on their efforts with amusement, as we do the CIA's attempts to make Castro's beard fall out in the 1960s. Russians seem to have a fatal love affair with conspiracies and the secret police, perhaps out of all proportion to their actual effectiveness. It has been going on since the time of the Tsar's Okhrana.

 

[Stanyon]

Russia has nothing on our domestic news sources that sell outrage and division on a daily basis regardless of the facts.

 

[columbus]

Russia has nothing on our domestic news sources that sell outrage and division on a daily basis regardless of the facts.

Pretty much this.
Our own political leadership has already set the stage. The Republocrats have been using identity politics, fake news, wedge issues, attack ads and such to keep in power for a long time.

Russia is just exploiting the weaknesses created by all that for their own purposes. And they don't have to do much. They needn't hack voting machines and such overt actions.

Just a little nudge here and a little nudge there. We've already done the heavy lifting for them, in terms of sowing division and creating a media system and political system that thrive on sowing more.

Divide and conquer. It's not a new concept.
Tom

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

The size skills and natural resources of Russia would lead one to suppose that they should be the leading country in almost every sphere in the world.
But they are not?
Why?

 

[bobhikes]

Russia Trying to Stoke U.S. Racial Tensions Before Election, Officials Say



Should we follow the teachings of Surak and embrace logic over emotion? That would seem to be the only effective defense against this kind of interference.

Although I have no doubt Russia is trying to interfere now as well as doing it in the past. We are to diverse a nation to be majorly effected by it. Pockets of violence may evolve but the US generally reacts harshly against internal violence.

 

[columbus]

The size skills and natural resources of Russia would lead one to suppose that they should be the leading country in almost every sphere in the world.
But they are not?
Why?

I can think of several reasons.
1) Poor economic planning.
2) Weak leadership, like Gorbachev.
3) Ruthless competition from the USA.
4) A slow and deliberate approach to regaining power, like Putin's.

That's a start.
Tom

 

[shmogie]

Unfortunately for Russia, the United States is a multicultural society and is quite accustomed to the inevitable discord that accompanies this. And the most multicultural areas of this country tend to be fairly liberal and get along with each other just fine. This is a battle they can't win because of the nature of the United States as a country. They're wasting their time. Doubly so when the entire planet is going to have far worse things to concern itself with over the next two centuries.

A multicultural area need not be liberal to get along. Conservatives are about policies that are best for all.

I live in rural Arizona in a community that is very Conservative. The 50% of us who are Hispanic are also Conservative. Our values are the same, yet our race and cultures are different ( though, actually, we have a hybrid culture, the best of both combined).

We get along beautifully. Anglo families have Hispanic members via marriage and vice versa.

I have not heard anyone complain about about being treated differently because of their race.

 

[Quintessence]

A multicultural area need not be liberal to get along. Conservatives are about policies that are best for all.

Sorry, I mean liberal in the more classical sense - and in the classical sense it is kind of required. Liberalism upholds the notion that all people are equal before the law as well as fundamental liberty, which goes a very, very long way to allowing multicultural harmony.

 

[shmogie]

Pretty much this.
Our own political leadership has already set the stage. The Republocrats have been using identity politics, fake news, wedge issues, attack ads and such to keep in power for a long time.

Russia is just exploiting the weaknesses created by all that for their own purposes. And they don't have to do much. They needn't hack voting machines and such overt actions.

Just a little nudge here and a little nudge there. We've already done the heavy lifting for them, in terms of sowing division and creating a media system and political system that thrive on sowing more.

Divide and conquer. It's not a new concept.
Tom

Agreed. The news media, for profit companies, stoke the divisions in hysterical and judgemental ways, the more outlandish, the more papers or air time sold.

One political party. more than the other, thrives on identity politics. Never seeing the people, as the people, but as voting blocks defined by race, sex, handicaps, etc., etc.

It is hard to believe now, but when I was a kid, many were against JFK being elected because he was a Catholic.

BUT, after his election, those same people accepted him as president, and that was it.

I don't remember any political sniping during the missile crisis, everyone was rooting for him, and supported him.

Today, in the same scenario, the political criticism and wrangling would be huge, every decision dissected with the talking heads screaming about how great the president is, or how terrible he is, and exploit the situation to destroy him, if possible.

Until party power at all costs is abandoned for some semblance of co operation and mutual respect, these scorched earth tactics will continue. There have been some terrible precedents set, and someday there will be a democrat president. Will the resist at all costs philosophy carry over to the republicans?

The Russians watch, smile, and do some tweaking of the chaos, to make it worse.

 

[shmogie]

Sorry, I mean liberal in the more classical sense - and in the classical sense it is kind of required. Liberalism upholds the notion that all people are equal before the law as well as fundamental liberty, which goes a very, very long way to allowing multicultural harmony.

Conservatism reveres the Constitution, every word of it, thus we also strongly support the equality of people and the concept of individual liberty.

I guess we are conservatively liberal.

 

[sun rise]

Russia does not need to lift a finger as it already exists in the USA from real racism to hoaxes.

I'm going to basically agree with you even though Putin is doing his best to tear us down.

 

[sun rise]

Conservatism reveres the Constitution, every word of it, thus we also strongly support the equality of people and the concept of individual liberty.

I guess we are conservatively liberal.

As does liberalism. Of course we differ about what it means and how to apply it in various circumstances.