Is Aleprechaunism a Belief System?

[wandering peacefully]

[QUOTE="Quintessence, post: 5657263, member:

"Acceptance of god(s) is different from something like accepting leprechauns because of the meaningfulness andimplications that acceptance has to one's overall worldview or belief system. Accepting gods is an anchor, pillar, or cornerstone of a worldview; it's of central importance, and it informs many other aspects of a belief system. It has a systemic impact, in other words. The same cannot be said of accepting leprechauns. It's not a cornerstone, it doesn't have a systemic impact on someone's way of life or view of the world. Suggesting otherwise is making an apples and gears comparison."

That still does not answer the bottom line question of what is the exact difference between gods and leprechauns? Are you saying that just because many people have built their lives and world views around the abstract idea of gods that it should make gods more real than leprechauns? Do you think people could be mistaken for building their worldviews around otherworldly, unproven, ideas? Does quantity of belief equal reality of that belief?

Not that it isn't okay for people to do that but it doesn't make gods any more real than leprechauns as far as I can tell.

 

[sealchan]

Only if the existence or non existence of said lil green
guys is the most fundamental question in the universe-
and you bother to think about it / them.

Well, that is the reality...many people feel that if someone doesn't believe in God then the whole foundation of meaning must be fundamentally different for that person. They imagine that the atheist has some elaborate system which they must use to keep up their deeply misguided belief and make the world still make sense.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Sue is an Aleprechaunist. She dares to not believe in leprechauns. So is her disbelief in John's claim about leprechauns a belief system in itself?

Stalin was a staunch aleprechaunist, which led to the death of millions.

 

[PureX]

We are talking about belief.

No, you are talking about belief. I am talking about a philosophical proposition, and the acceptance or rejection of that proposition, and the reasons for the choice.

 

[Audie]

Well, that is the reality...many people feel that if someone doesn't believe in God then the whole foundation of meaning must be fundamentally different for that person. They imagine that the atheist has some elaborate system which they must use to keep up their deeply misguided belief and make the world still make sense.

Maybe one of them would be so kind as to explain.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

John: Invisible leprechauns run around trees and cause thunderstorms.

Sue: I don't believe you.

Sue is an Aleprechaunist. She dares to not believe in leprechauns. So is her disbelief in John's claim about leprechauns a belief system in itself? Does your own Aleprechanism inform your views on the age of the universe or how thunderstorms form?

No, like atheism, aleprechaunism is not only not a belief system, it is not even a belief.

The only beliefs involved precede these positions, not follow from them, and they are the same two in each case: First, one should not believe anything more than the supporting evidence justifies (skepticism), and second, there is not enough evidence to support a belief in gods or leprechauns.

Those two beliefs are also the foundation for avampirism in most skeptics

Neither atheism, aleprechaunism, nor avampirism are beliefs, and none of them inform any action that the typical skeptic takes. It's the believers in these things whose actions are informed by their beliefs (searching for pots of gold, wearing cloves of garlic, religious rituals, etc..), not the unbeliever.

 

[Audie]

And how long will it be before we see
yet another earnest religionist pop up
to tell us that "Atheism is a Religion"!

And

"it takes more faith to be a atheist than
to be a religionist!"

 

[David T]

John: Invisible leprechauns run around trees and cause thunderstorms.

Sue: I don't believe you.

Sue is an Aleprechaunist. She dares to not believe in leprechauns. So is her disbelief in John's claim about leprechauns a belief system in itself? Does your own Aleprechanism inform your views on the age of the universe or how thunderstorms form?

The question is only relevant to a tiny portion of the cranium that has kicked in the anthropocene epoch. That region of the brain functioning as what we call science has increased to population 200,000 over the last 24 hours.

I love leprechauns magical thinking is fundy-mental to the dysfunctionally self labeled "higher functioning" region of the brain.zero evidence of that.

 

[sealchan]

Maybe one of them would be so kind as to explain.

I can't because I was an atheist before I was a believer. I know believers and I know that their belief is rooted in deep in their unconscious.

That is what an atheist has to confront when arguing with a believer...the believer often has an unconscious basis for their belief that is tied into every good thing they remember about their lives.

My coming to be a believer was a very self conscious process.

 

[sealchan]

And how long will it be before we see
yet another earnest religionist pop up
to tell us that "Atheism is a Religion"!

And

"it takes more faith to be a atheist than
to be a religionist!"

To many believers this seems true because of the depth of their belief.

It is fairly easy to rationally dismiss this idea on an objective level, but it won't shake the believers intuition. To do that you have to get the believers story and gently bring it out into the light of objectivity. Often that can be done by comparing their experience to similar experiences of people from different faiths. But you have to get at their story and you have to have some idea about the types of religious experience that people have and how they shape a person's life.

 

[sealchan]

No, like atheism, aleprechaunism is not only not a belief system, it is not even a belief.

The only beliefs involved precede these positions, not follow from them, and they are the same two in each case: First, one should not believe anything more than the supporting evidence justifies (skepticism), and second, there is not enough evidence to support a belief in gods or leprechauns.

Those two beliefs are also the foundation for avampirism in most skeptics

Neither atheism, aleprechaunism, nor avampirism are beliefs, and none of them inform any action that the typical skeptic takes. It's the believers in these things whose actions are informed by their beliefs (searching for pots of gold, wearing cloves of garlic, religious rituals, etc..), not the unbeliever.

Science itself is showing us that most of human thought is unconscious and that our decisions are largely framed in unconsciousness. The enlightenment notion that we are the commanders of our own minds is an ideal we strive to achieve but also a great mountain for any of us to climb.

 

[Fool]

John: Invisible leprechauns run around trees and cause thunderstorms.

Sue: I don't believe you.

Sue is an Aleprechaunist. She dares to not believe in leprechauns. So is her disbelief in John's claim about leprechauns a belief system in itself? Does your own Aleprechanism inform your views on the age of the universe or how thunderstorms form?

there are plenty of people in psych wards with belief systems that don't align with reality, or their beliefs about someone, something is real, or not.

having a belief isn't harmful until someone starts making an attempt to turn belief into reality without questioning it. in the process of elimination we discover things, we discover things based on what they aren't.

healthy belief systems question their beliefs and their reality. unhealthy belief systems believe their reality and beliefs aren't questionable. no human, except the unconscious, walks this planet without a belief system.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

John: Invisible leprechauns run around trees and cause thunderstorms.

Sue: I don't believe you.

Sue is an Aleprechaunist. She dares to not believe in leprechauns. So is her disbelief in John's claim about leprechauns a belief system in itself? Does your own Aleprechanism inform your views on the age of the universe or how thunderstorms form?

I'm an aleprechaunist and also an anaturalist, I refuse to believe in any leprechauns or naturalistic universe creating mechanisms until sufficient evidence arises.

(I'd give the leprechauns slightly better odds though)

 

[`mud]

As to what we are or might be:
I'm an astuffiest, and the more of an alifeeist !
NuffStuff

 

[Thermos aquaticus]

I'm an aleprechaunist and also an anaturalist, I refuse to believe in any leprechauns or naturalistic universe creating mechanisms until sufficient evidence arises.

As previous posts have demonstrated, you even refuse to accept natural mechanism when sufficient evidence is given.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

As previous posts have demonstrated, you even refuse to accept natural mechanism when sufficient evidence is given.

Call me a stickler, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence Thermos!

 

[Thermos aquaticus]

Call me a stickler, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence Thermos!

And extraordinary evidence has been given.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Just to confirm, since they both rely on artistic impressions, which are we talking about now?

 

[Thermos aquaticus]

healthy belief systems question their beliefs and their reality. unhealthy belief systems believe their reality and beliefs aren't questionable. no human, except the unconscious, walks this planet without a belief system.

I would absolutely agree. Atheists have belief systems, but atheism isn't one of them. A lot of atheists carry with them the belief system that reality is objectively real and can be reliably observed. Atheists also tend to believe in things like loving their family, loving their spouse, being kind to their neighbors, leaving the world in a better place than when they came into it, equal rights, adding to human knowledge, and many other beliefs. But, none of that is atheism . . . or apleprechanism, that is.

 

[Ponder This]

John: Invisible leprechauns run around trees and cause thunderstorms.

Sue: I don't believe you.

Perhaps Sue is really an aJohnist… she does believe in John...
She might actually still believe in leprechauns but not believe that they cause thunderstorms.