Is evolution as reliable as gravity?

[Just_me_Mike]

So what is the verdict. The more I read, listen too and talk with those who are authorities on evolution, I sense the certainty is just as great as us suggesting gravity is what it is.

 

[savethedreams]

oooo good question my answer is bluntly NO.

Like I said in the past forum..

Evolution believers, 1st. prove absolute dating fact and carbon dating fact,

prove the fossils weren't 'place there'

as regards to big bang theory, prove to us that those 'gases' were there

If evolutionist is true, why can't you recreate the earth,, and prove to my way cant you.

I'm not attacking the evidence but the foundation you build the evidence on. but let's start with carbon and aboslute dating.....

Absolute dating is false therefore Evolution is to.... comments?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

What do we suggest gravity is?

 

[Engyo]

I can't answer your question directly. I keep seeing evidence that suggests to me that evolution is a theory which describes what we see happening in the world around us.

I was watching a documentary about birds this past weekend, they were focusing on some bird colonies on the South African shoreline. The area waters are heavily overfished and it is hard for the birds to find food. So, some of the species have been evolving new ways of keeping fed.

For the first time in 2008, they documented two different changes in behaviors. One bird species, for the first time, had both parents out fishing instead of one staying to defend their nests, in order to have enough food for the chicks. In response, they have also documented for the first time, a pelican species that are now raiding the undefended nests and eating the young of the other birds, instead of eating fish.

These changes in behavior due to environmental pressures are the first steps of evolution in action, at least as I understand the theory.

 

[tumbleweed41]

So what is the verdict. The more I read, listen too and talk with those who are authorities on evolution, I sense the certainty is just as great as us suggesting gravity is what it is.

The Theory of Evolution has more supporting empirical evidence than the Theory of Gravity.

 

[Falvlun]

prove the fossils weren't 'place there'

I have to get back to studying, but I couldn't resist this one line.

Prove that the universe didn't come into existence last Thursday.

You can't. If you are going to hypothesize a God that tricks us into thinking that the Earth is old when it really is not, then what's stopping the same God from simply creating us, fully formed with memories, just last Thursday? That line of reasoning is pointless-- and ultimately unprovable.

It's like wondering whether you are simply a brain in a vat, being fed information to make you think you're alive. There's no point in worrying about it, because you can't tell the difference anyway.

Science simply observes, documents, and explains the universe at face value. Ravens might actually be bright pink, and a tricky God is just making us think they're black. But since science is explaining the world as we experience it, and we have no reason to believe that ravens aren't black, it's just better to assume that they are.

 

[tumbleweed41]

.....let's start with carbon and aboslute dating.....

Absolute dating is false therefore Evolution is to.... comments?

No, lets start with all the dating methods currently in use in archeological, biology, geology, cosmology, botany, and oceanography.
Chronometric Dating
Dendrochronology.
Florine absorption.
Oxidizeable carbon dating.
Rehydroxylation dating.
Iodine-xenon dating
Obsidian hydration dating
Radiometric dating
Argon–argon dating
K–Ar dating
Helium dating
Isochron dating
Radiocarbon dating
Rubidium-strontium dating
Samarium-neodymium dating
Uranium-lead dating
Uranium-thorium dating
Uranium-uranium dating
Fission track dating
Cosmogenic radionuclide dating
Rhenium-osmium dating
Rubidium-strontium dating
Optical dating
Spectrum analysis.
etc, etc, etc....


Now, the amazing thing is. All these methods confirm each other.
Isn't physics great!!

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Please don't feed the troll.
I thought my question was a good one, go debate evolution in another thread.

Kilgore, I suppose gravity in this context is a law of the universe we believe to constant. If we throw up an apple on Earth anywhere on Earth it will fall at the same rate, etc...

Is evolution to a point we can place it on the shelf, gravity, and other forces are on. It seems to me we can, but was looking for opinion...

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I can't answer your question directly. I keep seeing evidence that suggests to me that evolution is a theory which describes what we see happening in the world around us.

I was watching a documentary about birds this past weekend, they were focusing on some bird colonies on the South African shoreline. The area waters are heavily overfished and it is hard for the birds to find food. So, some of the species have been evolving new ways of keeping fed.

For the first time in 2008, they documented two different changes in behaviors. One bird species, for the first time, had both parents out fishing instead of one staying to defend their nests, in order to have enough food for the chicks. In response, they have also documented for the first time, a pelican species that are now raiding the undefended nests and eating the young of the other birds, instead of eating fish.

These changes in behavior due to environmental pressures are the first steps of evolution in action, at least as I understand the theory.

So is my question a good question? Also, I am not sure why your example would hinder an answer from you? If anything it might support you saying yes, it is as true and faithful as gravity...

 

[Atomist]

Please don't feed the troll.
I thought my question was a good one, go debate evolution in another thread.

Kilgore, I suppose gravity in this context is a law of the universe we believe to constant. If we throw up an apple on Earth anywhere on Earth it will fall at the same rate, etc...

Is evolution to a point we can place it on the shelf, gravity, and other forces are on. It seems to me we can, but was looking for opinion...

I don't know what you mean by "place on the shelf' because we don't do that with any idea. LIke these theories are "models" better models appear... but evolution the process does occur just like gravity... but the theories are likely not perfect or anywhere near close to perfect.

 

[Skwim]

So far gravity has never let me up. It's been extremely reliable.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I don't know what you mean by "place on the shelf' because we don't do that with any idea. LIke these theories are "models" better models appear... but evolution the process does occur just like gravity... but the theories are likely not perfect or anywhere near close to perfect.

The word perfect has no place in these discussion. I agree with you on that. Hope I didn't imply that.

On the shelf, means only it is not argued it exist. Does anyone argue gravity exists? Anyway that is all I meant...

 

[Kilgore Trout]

So far gravity has never let me up. It's been extremely reliable.

I've been let down by gravity many times.

 

[MaybeSpartacus]

On the shelf, means only it is not argued it exist. Does anyone argue gravity exists? Anyway that is all I meant...

Are you talking about the theory or the fact? The theory is an explanation of the fact. I doubt anyone can argue the fact of gravity. Theories are always open to debate, new discoveries, and reformation. That's what science is. Of course some people see that as "OMGZ CAN'T BE TRUEZ!11!" and then proceed to make convoluted arguments which do the discussion nothing.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Are you talking about the theory or the fact? The theory is an explanation of the fact. I doubt anyone can argue the fact of gravity. Theories are always open to debate, new discoveries, and reformation. That's what science is. Of course some people see that as "OMGZ CAN'T BE TRUEZ!11!" and then proceed to make convoluted arguments which do the discussion nothing.

Not sure, I suppose the "fact"...

I mean it would seem silly to hear someone try to argue gravity doesn't exist. Equally, it seems there will be a day such that evolution is "shelved" in such a way...

 

[ImmortalFlame]

So what is the verdict. The more I read, listen too and talk with those who are authorities on evolution, I sense the certainty is just as great as us suggesting gravity is what it is.

Depends what you mean by "reliable", I suppose.

Gravity is certainly easier to predict, test and measure, so in that sense it is clearly more "reliable", but then evolution theory is extremely reliable when used to produce flu jabs by predicting the evolutionary patterns of the flu virus.

 

[Kerr]

oooo good question my answer is bluntly NO.

Like I said in the past forum..

Evolution believers, 1st. prove absolute dating fact and carbon dating fact,

prove the fossils weren't 'place there'

as regards to big bang theory, prove to us that those 'gases' were there

If evolutionist is true, why can't you recreate the earth,, and prove to my way cant you.

I'm not attacking the evidence but the foundation you build the evidence on. but let's start with carbon and aboslute dating.....

Absolute dating is false therefore Evolution is to.... comments?

I am confused. What do the big bang have to do with evolution?

And I do know of cases where we have observed evolution. Nylon eating bacterias is one example. So we know that life changes and evolves, what the Theory of Evolution is about is how they change.

Do not know that much about dating methods, to be honest, but I do not think that the people who uses them are fools who have decided that they work without any form of proof.

 

[Atomist]

The word perfect has no place in these discussion. I agree with you on that. Hope I didn't imply that.

On the shelf, means only it is not argued it exist. Does anyone argue gravity exists? Anyway that is all I meant...

oh then yes... evolution is more a fact than gravity is fact.

 

[Looncall]

oooo good question my answer is bluntly NO.

Like I said in the past forum..

Evolution believers, 1st. prove absolute dating fact and carbon dating fact,

prove the fossils weren't 'place there'

as regards to big bang theory, prove to us that those 'gases' were there

If evolutionist is true, why can't you recreate the earth,, and prove to my way cant you.

I'm not attacking the evidence but the foundation you build the evidence on. but let's start with carbon and aboslute dating.....

Absolute dating is false therefore Evolution is to.... comments?

You need to do some study of these matters yourself, and not just spout the lies of con men.

 

[LuisDantas]

So what is the verdict. The more I read, listen too and talk with those who are authorities on evolution, I sense the certainty is just as great as us suggesting gravity is what it is.

If you mean in the sense of it being an established fact, then of course yes.