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Is Fundamentalism a Religious Movement or a Psychological Disorder?

Sand Dancer

Currently catless
I dont remember how long it took me to get over all that. I'm pretty sure it was weeks, perhaps months of struggling with trying to hold onto a dying faith. Once I did renounce Christianity though I was largely and mostly over the fears of Hell, upsetting god, and all that and it all immediately stopped then and there. But getting there was difficult.

Yes, it's damaging. The 4 or 5 days of terror was just getting over being a fundamentalist and going to mainstream Christianity. I did stay in it about five or six years after leaving fundamentalism. I was mainstream, then progressive before leaving completely. But yeah, the hardest part was leaving fundamentalism. It took many years to get over the fear of hell. Funny how before becoming Christian, I had a positive view of God. After that, my belief was in a punishing and judging god. What a crock of crap. Glad you made it through.
 

Sand Dancer

Currently catless
The deity of Jesus is seen in all four Gospels. And according to the Old Testament only God can save. So it should be a no-brainer to the spiritually-attuned.

Nope. The early views were not him being a god/man. That came later after influence from the mystery cults.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Yes, it's damaging. The 4 or 5 days of terror was just getting over being a fundamentalist and going to mainstream Christianity. I did stay in it about five or six years after leaving fundamentalism. I was mainstream, then progressive before leaving completely. But yeah, the hardest part was leaving fundamentalism. It took many years to get over the fear of hell. Funny how before becoming Christian, I had a positive view of God. After that, my belief was in a punishing and judging god. What a crock of crap. Glad you made it through.
I was born and raised in the Southern Baptist church, and when I was homeschooled through a fundamentalist program in middle school I became one. That's when god went from positive to negative to me, and when I began having nightmares of going to Hell. But fortunately I was put back in public school for high school, and though I hated it, it did get me away from that environment on regular enough basis to see some flaws in what I had been taught about the world, which left me with some cracks in my faith for future information to exploit. I dont remember what caused my crisis of faith, but i began to ask questions church leaders couldn't answer, learned things that where incompatible with fundamentalist beliefs, began doubting and searching for answers. But I found none, clung desperately onto my faith, but when I was 16 of had enough and left it all behind (and went on hating Christians and everything about and related to their religion for a couple years). And once I had left it, there was no doubt, no fear, no second guesses, or other things often mentioned by former christians. Once I left it, I was and still am entirely done with it all. And I know I still am, that fundamentalis beliefs did do that much damage to me, that about a year ago I finally got around to checking out a UU service and ended up wanting time to hurry up and the service to be over with it was basically a protestant service with different labels and concepts.
Really, if religious fundamentalism can cause the things it has been accused of in this thread, how can it not be considered a mental illness? Condemning this group and that group to hell service after service? People show more concern towards imaginary violence in the media, but this specific and believed to be real violence gets a pass? Kicking your own child out of the house? Causing mental illness in adherents? If a diet rich in fast food can wreck your health, how can fundamentalism not be the equivalent of a rich in "processed thought food" that can also cause poor health?
 

Sand Dancer

Currently catless
"That's when god went from positive to negative to me, and when I began having nightmares of going to Hell. But fortunately I was put back in public school for high school, and though I hated it, it did get me away from that environment on regular enough basis to see some flaws in what I had been taught about the world, which left me with some cracks in my faith for future information to exploit. I dont remember what caused my crisis of faith, but i began to ask questions church leaders couldn't answer, learned things that where incompatible with fundamentalist beliefs, began doubting and searching for answers. But I found none, clung desperately onto my faith, but when I was 16 of had enough and left it all behind (and went on hating Christians and everything about and related to their religion for a couple years). And once I had left it, there was no doubt, no fear, no second guesses, or other things often mentioned by former christians. Once I left it, I was and still am entirely done with it all.Really, if religious fundamentalism can cause the things it has been accused of in this thread, how can it not be considered a mental illness? Condemning this group and that group to hell service after service? People show more concern towards imaginary violence in the media, but this specific and believed to be real violence gets a pass? Kicking your own child out of the house? Causing mental illness in adherents? If a diet rich in fast food can wreck your health, how can fundamentalism not be the equivalent of a rich in "processed thought food" that can also cause poor health?

I am so sorry to hear that. The real world does tend to put cracks in the tiny box that is fundamentalism. Not getting honest answers is a red flag. Yep, I am done too. It's cultic in its brainwashing attempts. I will also stay away from spiritual junk food.
 
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Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
I will also stay away from spiritual junk food.
I can say at least all these years later i have come to have a new appreciation for the Bible, especially the OT, because those are the ancient and tradional stories of am entire people. Not viewed as messengers of god but of the images and beliefs people had about themselves and their surroundings. And it's a wildly amusing and entertaining story, songs and poems written in utter reverence for this deity, and narratives that have been founding lore and legend for thousands of years and generations.
 

Spartan

Well-Known Member
Nope. The early views were not him being a god/man. That came later after influence from the mystery cults.

Nope. Jesus was prophesied as God.

"John 1:23 quotes Isaiah 40:3 as saying John the Baptist was to prepare the way for the LORD (Jehovah). John prepared the way before Jesus so Jesus must be LORD (Jehovah)."

More in the link below.

Jesus Must be Jehovah
 

Spartan

Well-Known Member
There are more than four Gospels, and the idea of Jesus being divine didn't really happen and become deeply entrenched in Christianity until the Nicene council decided to "paganize" Jesus by elevating him to the status of god. Before then, a "Jesus as God" would have been seen as a major violation of "thou shalt have no other gods before me."

Nope.

The Deity of Jesus in the Gospels

The Divinity of Jesus Revealed in the New Testament
 

Spartan

Well-Known Member
Nope. Jesus is not God and much of that list is speculative and makes assumptions.
47 Reasons Why Our Heavenly Father Has No Equals or “Co-Equals”

Wrong again.

The Deity of Jesus Christ in the Scriptures (short list):
1. Jesus existed in the beginning (John 1:1; Philip 2:6; Rev. 19:13; Micah 5:2).
2. He was with God (John 1:1).
3. He is God, the Son (John 1:1; Rom. 9:5; Heb. 1:8, 10; I John 5:20).
4. He is God manifest in the flesh (John 20:28; I Tim. 3:16; Col. 2:9; Acts 20:28; Heb. 1:8).
5. He is God foretold (Isaiah 9:6; Psalm 45:6).
6. He is Immanuel, God with us (Isaiah 7:14; Matthew 1:23).
7. He is the true God (I John 5:20 with Titus 2:13; Romans 9:5).
8. He is the great God (Titus 2:13).
9. He is God our Savior (II Peter 1:1).
10. He existed in the form of God before His incarnation and was equal with God the Father (Philippians 2:5-7)
11. He is the only wise God (Jude 25).
12. He is omnipotent over disease. (Matthew 8:1-4; Luke 4:39)
13. He is omnipotent over demons. (Matthew 8:16-17; Luke 4:35)
14. He is omnipotent over nature. ((Matthew 8:26)
15. He is omnipotent over death. (Luke 7:14-15; John 11:25)
16. He is omniscient, knowing the hearts of the Pharisees. (Matthew 12:25; Luke 5:22; 6:8; 7:39-40)
17. He knew the thoughts of the scribes. (Matthew 9:3-4)
18. He knew the history of the Samaritan woman. (John 4:24)
19. He is omnipresent. (Matthew 18:20; 28:20; John 3:13; 14:20)
20. He was worshiped as God by the angels (Hebrews 1:6); worshiped as God by the wise men (Matthew 2:2); worshiped as God by the shepherds (Luke 2:15); worshiped as God by a ruler (Matthew 9:18); worshiped as God by Thomas (John 20:28); worshiped as God by the apostles (Matthew 14:33;28:9)
21. He forgives sins. (Mark 2:5)
22. He saves (only God saves). Matthew 18:11; John 10:28).
23. He judges. (John 5:22)
24. Paul, Peter, Jude, James, and John called Him God. (Galatians 2:20; 1 Peter 3:22; Jude 25; James 2:1; I John 5:20; Revelation 1:18; 19:16)
25. He is God’s Son, who was sent to bring us eternal life. (John 3:16)
26. He arose from death in the flesh (John 20:26-28; Luke 24:39-43; I John 4:2-3).
27. One with the Father (John 10:30).

Link: The Deity of Jesus Christ in Scripture

And if that's not enough, here's more:

Jesus Must be Jehovah

You're busted!
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Wrong again.

The Deity of Jesus Christ in the Scriptures (short list):
1. Jesus existed in the beginning (John 1:1; Philip 2:6; Rev. 19:13; Micah 5:2).
2. He was with God (John 1:1).
3. He is God, the Son (John 1:1; Rom. 9:5; Heb. 1:8, 10; I John 5:20).
4. He is God manifest in the flesh (John 20:28; I Tim. 3:16; Col. 2:9; Acts 20:28; Heb. 1:8).
5. He is God foretold (Isaiah 9:6; Psalm 45:6).
6. He is Immanuel, God with us (Isaiah 7:14; Matthew 1:23).
7. He is the true God (I John 5:20 with Titus 2:13; Romans 9:5).
8. He is the great God (Titus 2:13).
9. He is God our Savior (II Peter 1:1).
10. He existed in the form of God before His incarnation and was equal with God the Father (Philippians 2:5-7)
11. He is the only wise God (Jude 25).
12. He is omnipotent over disease. (Matthew 8:1-4; Luke 4:39)
13. He is omnipotent over demons. (Matthew 8:16-17; Luke 4:35)
14. He is omnipotent over nature. ((Matthew 8:26)
15. He is omnipotent over death. (Luke 7:14-15; John 11:25)
16. He is omniscient, knowing the hearts of the Pharisees. (Matthew 12:25; Luke 5:22; 6:8; 7:39-40)
17. He knew the thoughts of the scribes. (Matthew 9:3-4)
18. He knew the history of the Samaritan woman. (John 4:24)
19. He is omnipresent. (Matthew 18:20; 28:20; John 3:13; 14:20)
20. He was worshiped as God by the angels (Hebrews 1:6); worshiped as God by the wise men (Matthew 2:2); worshiped as God by the shepherds (Luke 2:15); worshiped as God by a ruler (Matthew 9:18); worshiped as God by Thomas (John 20:28); worshiped as God by the apostles (Matthew 14:33;28:9)
21. He forgives sins. (Mark 2:5)
22. He saves (only God saves). Matthew 18:11; John 10:28).
23. He judges. (John 5:22)
24. Paul, Peter, Jude, James, and John called Him God. (Galatians 2:20; 1 Peter 3:22; Jude 25; James 2:1; I John 5:20; Revelation 1:18; 19:16)
25. He is God’s Son, who was sent to bring us eternal life. (John 3:16)
26. He arose from death in the flesh (John 20:26-28; Luke 24:39-43; I John 4:2-3).
27. One with the Father (John 10:30).

Link: The Deity of Jesus Christ in Scripture

And if that's not enough, here's more:

Jesus Must be Jehovah

You're busted!
You need something a lot stronger than the Bible to make that claim. I can show you plenty of fictional books that claim to be true accounts.
 

Shia Islam

Quran and Ahlul-Bayt a.s.
Premium Member
Is fundamentalism a religious movement or a psychological disorder?

The four most studied fundamentalisms by scientists and scholars are the Jewish, Christian, Muslim, and Hindu variations of the phenomenon. There is a wide range of informed opinion about fundamentalism, but most people find fundamentalism remarkably similar regardless of which religion it is associated with.

There is indeed some scientific support for the possibility fundamentalism is more of a psychological disorder than a religion or religious movement. For instance, see Chapters Three (page 75), Four (page 106), and related pages in Robert Altemeyer's introduction to authoritarianism, which can be found here (pdf).

As for myself, I believe calling fundamentalism a "religion" might be like calling Bipolar Mood Disorder a "philosophy". The evidence seems headed in that direction.

Your thoughts?*



*Please read Chapters Three and Four in Altemeyer before responding -- unless you are very familiar with the science on this subject.

EDIT: As I remarked to Dave in a post in this thread: It intrigues me that fundamentalism might be characterized as a religious movement piggybacking on a psychological disorder.

EDIT: To clarify, I am suggesting that -- at the very least -- fundamentalism is most likely significantly more strongly associated with dysfunctional thinking and/or moods than is, say, mainstream Catholicism, Reform Judaism, etc. Beyond that, I suspect fundamentalist ideologies tend to be especially attractive to people suffering from one or more mental illnesses and tend to be just as unattractive to relatively healthy people. In other words, I think it is likely more fundamentalists are mentally ill than members of similar groups, and likely that fundamentalism tends to attract mentally ill people and tends to repulse mentally healthy people.

EDIT: Try thinking of "mental illness" as "thoughts and moods that are conducive to, and/or symptomatic of, dysfunctional behavior."

The problem is not with fundamentalism itself.

The problem is with what is it that you your fundamentalism is attached to.

If you follow a religion that teaches tolerance and piety at the same time, then sticking to that religion won't be a problem.

But if you are following a religion that teaches enmity and hate, then sticking to that religion will certainly be a problem.
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
God alters natural laws via an unnatural law not yet discovered, you know, like what scientists say happened before Planck time.
So God is just a superscientist, eh?

Then you agree science is on the right track, exploring how these things can be done. No magic, just knowledge gained by looking, checking, reasoning and rechecking.
According to natural law, time travel isn't possible for humans who cannot approach the speed of light
Relative to a photon, you and I move at the speed of light all the time. And we have evidence to support the idea that Now is not a point but a smear in time, during which sequences internal to that smear can be what we might call by way of analogy reversed. It's a very very tiny smear, so we're not talking about humans ─ but again, as we keep advancing our understanding of reality, our ability to control previously uncontrolled aspects of it comes into being and increases. Who knows what we'll be able to do with time in another fifty years?
so the Bible's extreme prescience proves a God exists.
Alas, it's not so simple. There's not one credible example of 'prescience' ─ supernatural foreknowledge ─ in the bible. (To be fair, there are no credible examples anywhere else either.) If you'd like to offer a favorite example, I'll take it apart for you.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
Nope. Jesus was prophesied as God.

"John 1:23 quotes Isaiah 40:3 as saying John the Baptist was to prepare the way for the LORD (Jehovah). John prepared the way before Jesus so Jesus must be LORD (Jehovah)."

More in the link below.

Jesus Must be Jehovah

LOLOL.. Do you realize when John was written and the politics in play?
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Nope. Jesus was prophesied as God.
So Jesus WASN'T the messiah then.

Not anointed / Χριστός / Christ at all!

Interesting theology ...

Luckily that argument fails because each of the Jesuses of Paul and the four gospels expressly denies he's God.

But you know this already because you have two degrees in theology, or you've read the NT, I can't recall which.
 
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