Is Healthcare a "right" and should it have limits on how much is consumed and by whom?

[Milton Platt]

Except there are people that do not contribute according to most tax codes.

Yes, some cheat the system, others are in need of help.

 

[Shad]

Yes, some cheat the system, others are in need of help.

Sure. I am willing to help those that need it hence why I do support state covering those expenses.

 

[Milton Platt]

Sure. I am willing to help those that need it hence why I do support state covering those expenses.

I believe in a very robust social safety net. I have issues with how it is often administered.

 

[Shad]

I believe in a very robust social safety net. I have issues with how it is often administered.

I would like some limits on the system regarding who pays when it comes to health issues caused by the individual. Smokers for example can dump a lot of money into a habit which destroys their health.Smokers in the end should be paying something into the system as they caused the problem the system is now addressing.

By administered do you mean the government?

 

[Lyndon]

Health costs for smokers have been shown to be no greater than non smokers because they don't live as long and long life costs a lot in healthcare.

 

[Milton Platt]

I would like some limits on the system regarding who pays when it comes to health issues caused by the individual. Smokers for example can dump a lot of money into a habit which destroys their health.Smokers in the end should be paying something into the system as they caused the problem the system is now addressing.

By administered do you mean the government?

Sorta. I mean that the programs run by the government are poorly implemented and full of waste. People who really need support can't get it and people who don't need it game the system.

 

[Shad]

Health costs for smokers have been shown to be no greater than non smokers because they don't live as long and long life costs a lot in healthcare.

Smoking causes health issues which are avoidable by..... not smoking. So they burden the system more than non-smokers while using a lot of money to support their habit.

 

[Shad]

Sorta. I mean that the programs run by the government are poorly implemented and full of waste. People who really need support can't get it and people who don't need it game the system.

Is this comment about a specific government like the US or a nation with NHS like Canada or UK? I ask as the waste in the US is caused due to different reasons than say in Canada.

 

[Lyndon]

Smoking causes health issues which are avoidable by..... not smoking. So they burden the system more than non-smokers while using a lot of money to support their habit.

you obviously don't comprehend my statement which is based on the actual research, smoking is a net break even in healthcare costs because many smokers live shorter lives, living to 100 costs a lot to the government in healthcare.

 

[Milton Platt]

Is this comment about a specific government like the US or a nation with NHS like Canada or UK? I ask as the waste in the US is caused due to different reasons than say in Canada.

I can only address the U.S. system, as I am largely unfamiliar with other systems.

 

[Shad]

I can only address the U.S. system, as I am largely unfamiliar with other systems.

Yah the US government has done a lot of damage to both the private and public sectors with regulations.

 

[Shad]

you obviously don't comprehend my statement which is based on the actual research, smoking is a net break even in healthcare costs because many smokers live shorter lives, living to 100 costs a lot to the government in healthcare.

Irrelevant as I was talking about who pays and why. More so your point is morbid. It also ignores the stop smoking campaigns by government. It ignores that cancer treatment is not cheap. It ignores COPD is not cheap. Besides if the bottom line includes life expectancy why bother treating anyone over 60? LEt them die. It saves money.....


You also didn't cite a single cost so your claim is an assertion.

 

[Milton Platt]

you obviously don't comprehend my statement which is based on the actual research, smoking is a net break even in healthcare costs because many smokers live shorter lives, living to 100 costs a lot to the government in healthcare.

That’s a very interesting take on things, Lyndon. I haven’t heard that before. Is there a specific study you can reference? I’ll Google around in the meantime, thanks.

 

[Lyndon]

Irrelevant as I was talking about who pays and why. More so you point is morbid

Well obviously the non smoker that lives to 100 costs a lot more to healthcare than the smoker that dies at 50, its just facts, something you seem to have a problem with Shad.

 

[Milton Platt]

Yah the US government has done a lot of damage to both the private and public sectors with regulations.

I don’t know which specific regulations and/or damage you are referring to here. Can you clarify with some examples?

I do not think a completely unregulated system is the answer. A properly regulated and properly run system is best.

 

[Lyndon]

That’s a very interesting take on things, Lyndon. I haven’t heard that before. Is there a specific study you can reference? I’ll Google around in the meantime, thanks.

I read this many years ago, probably they're trying to squash it now, because their whole premise is on smokers being a huge burden to society which just plain isn't true.

 

[Shad]

I don’t know which specific regulations and/or damage you are referring to here. Can you clarify with some examples?

You can not buy insurance across state lines and the government do not pay it's full bill.

I do not think a completely unregulated system is the answer. A properly regulated and properly run system is best.

Some of the regulation hamper the free market such as state lines above

 

[Shad]

I read this many years ago, probably they're trying to squash it now, because their whole premise is on smokers being a huge burden to society which just plain isn't true.

Still not citing anything

 

[Lyndon]

The net effect of smoking on healthcare and welfare costs. A cohort study this should cover it, non smokers cost more in healthcare

 

[Milton Platt]

You can not buy insurance across state lines and the government do not pay it's full bill.



Some of the regulation hamper the free market such as state lines above

yes, I agree with you on that about state lines. what do you mean “the government do not pay its full bill”?