Is Islam the only big religion that condemns everyone else to hell?

[BilliardsBall]

Every time I see Hinduism discussed as if it were a single religion in which there is one set of beliefs, I agree that there is a lot of people who don't really understand it.
The Bhagavad Gita, the Vedas, Upanishads, Puranas and Mahabharata, none of these poems and tales are considered central authorative scripture like the bible. There is no 'strict reading' of Hinduism. There are different schools of thought, but they are vast in range. From polytheistic to monotheistic to atheistic, deistic, pantheistic, panentheistic, and beyond.

I'm sure there are some that believe the way you describe, but I'm sure there's just as many who believe that belief is irrelevant. Belief in the concept of gods or in punyam and paapam is irrelevant. The worst I've seen is that non-believers are at a disadvantage in destroying paapam through practice, but that a non-believer is as likely to get out of bondage as a believer, and that there is no reason to believe one Asiatic or Middle Eastern practice has all of the truth.

Yes, there are a flavor of beliefs in Hinduism. Yes, one cannot be a fundamentalist regarding Hindu scriptures. Yes, most Americans who are "into" reincarnation were royalty in past lives and will never come back as a mosquito or go to karmic hell, but that is a part of Hindu beliefs.

 

[Ingledsva]

And?? I responded to the actual question of the OP, not your off-topic tangents. The answer to the OP's question is no, completely independent of everything else.

I never stated it permitted polytheists. I, as *shocking* as it may be, responded to the OP of the thread instead of tangents.

If you wanted to bring up tangents, why reply to me, when I never made any statements on such tangents??

Discussions of religion on the internet like this makes me wonder why I even bother to try. Respond to talk about one topic out of an interest in theology and people reply to you with tangents on other topics as if those other topics somehow disprove the statement on the first topic!!

I was not talking about polytheists. I was responding to the initial posed question of the thread, which did not specify non-Abrahamic faiths but non-Muslim ones.

You are commenting at me as if I had stated that Islam states that polytheists are going to heaven when I have done no such thing. I did not state such a thing, because that's not the topic of the thread.

When you are done fighting your imaginary strawmen maybe you could actually state something on the topic at hand.

I think you need to go back to page one and read our conversation forward to this point.

You told us - "First, it depends on what your definition of "Sabeans" is. There were many Muslims, historically, who believed the term applied to the followers of the Greek mystic/philosopher Hermes Trismegastus, so if those people were correct, then some Hellenic believers were also saved."

I included information on "Sabean." and that Muhammad was called a Sabean, - so Sabean has no connection of any kind to Hellenistic or polytheistic religions.

As you know very well as you included it in you post, - the Jews and Christian are considered as Muslim = People Of The Book.

Thus as I said, - they have everybody else going to Hell

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[Shia Islam]

So, is Islam the only big religion that holds the firm belief that literally everyone who has heard about Islam and has not become a Muslim will be condemned to eternity in hell, regardless of their actions in this life? Muhammad says that there are no exceptions, not even for his parents.

As far as I'm aware, there are several Christian denominations that accept the idea that non-Christians might be able to find a way to salvation through works alone even if they don't accept Jesus Christ as their savior or if they doubt Him or if they worship different Gods. There are several Bible verses that might be interpreted to support this idea. Some denominations consider that there are different degrees of being saved, that some people will be allowed to be kept in Purgatory or in a place distant from God's presence until Christ's return when they will be given a second chance to accept God, but that place may not necessarily be hell if they have lived righteous lives according to the commandments 2 to 10.

Judaism has no clear doctrine in regards to hell and whether all non-Jews are damned in the afterlife.

Hinduism considers that non-Hindus can make spiritual progress and might luck out being reborn as Hindus in a future life and are not damned to eternal hell.

Buddhism does not hold a belief in hell and does not condemn non-Buddhists to an afterlife in hell.

Shinto's views on the afterlife is diverse and fluctuates between beliefs in a place of the spirits and reincarnation, but it does not state that people of other religions go to hell.

So, is Islam the only big religion that holds the firm belief that literally everyone who has heard about Islam and has not become a Muslim will be condemned to eternity in hell, regardless of their actions in this life? Muhammad says that there are no exceptions, not even for his parents.

In Islam, not all the non-believers will go to hellfire, Only the deniers; i.e. those who know the truth in their inner-self and yet reject it. Some of the non-believers will be "tested" in the hereafter. This include people who did not have the required information or mental capability to distinguish the truth.

In shia islam, the parents and ancestors of the prophet were believers.

 

[Ingledsva]

In Islam, not all the non-believers will go to hellfire, Only the deniers; i.e. those who know the truth in their inner-self and yet reject it. Some of the non-believers will be "tested" in the hereafter. This include people who did not have the required information or mental capability to distinguish the truth.

But of course they don't accept you guys.

In shia islam, the parents and ancestors of the prophet were believers.

I find that, - parent and ancestors - interesting.

Is that a form of going back and saving them, like the Mormons? Is there a ceremony?

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[Shia Islam]

But of course they don't accept you guys.

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It is enough for us that God and his messengers accept us

I find that, - parent and ancestors - interesting.

Is that a form of going back and saving them, like the Mormons? Is there a ceremony?

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God had sent many prophets before Muhammad..The parents and ancestors of Muhammad were following those prophets..

 

[Sanzbir]

I think you need to go back to page one and read our conversation forward to this point.

You told us - "First, it depends on what your definition of "Sabeans" is. There were many Muslims, historically, who believed the term applied to the followers of the Greek mystic/philosopher Hermes Trismegastus, so if those people were correct, then some Hellenic believers were also saved."

I included information on "Sabean." and that Muhammad was called a Sabean, - so Sabean has no connection of any kind to Hellenistic or polytheistic religions.

Wikipedia's article on Sabeans does not change the fact that there was a long-standing tradition of Muslims treating the followers of Hermes Trismegastus as if they were Sabeans.

And as I said "It depends on what your definition of Sabeans is." If you want to define it as an Abrahamic Faith then yes, "non-Abrahamic". If you want to accept a widespread, accepted definition of Sabeans as Hermeticists, then no, some Hellenic too. And note I said "It depends on what your definition of Sabeans is." Not "You're wrong" but "It depends", because the debate over who the Sabeans were is far from settled, and historically the label has been applied by Muslims to many different groups of people.

Not all of which were Abrahamic. So to those Muslims who accept that definition of Sabean, in answer to the OP's question and your own "only Abrahamic" comment, then some non-Abrahamic religious have been accepted as going to heaven by Muslims.

And I think you obviously know very little on the subject because, despite having Hellenic origins, the followers of Hermes Trismegastus were not polytheistic, which was how they were able to convince the Muslims that their Faith had divine inspiration.

You mainly confused me because you seem to refer to the followers of Hermes as if they were synonymous with polytheists, when the religion is monotheistic. I reiterate, I said nothing about polytheists, I mentioned a monotheistic Greek religion, which apparently you don't know the history of. So of what relevance is your quotes on polytheism in discussing a Greek monotheist and the role of his teachings in the Muslim world??

Do you really want to continue debating on the subject of Hermes in Islam throughout history when it seems you didn't know enough to know that the Thrice-Great Hermes was a Monotheist??

As you know very well as you included it in you post, - the Jews and Christian are considered as Muslim = People Of The Book.

Thus as I said, - they have everybody else going to Hell

Modern Christians and Jews are typically considered by Muslims as being non-Muslims, but People of the Book. It is stated that the Christians and Jews before Muhammad count as "Muslims", and it is stated that Christians, Jews, and Sabeans go to heaven. Again I'm getting the feeling you don't know much on the topic, because the fact that Muslims tend to view Christians and Jews as being non-Muslim is kind of a well-known fact.

 

[Ingledsva]

It is enough for us that God and his messengers accept us

I understand this. I meant that they don't.

God had sent many prophets before Muhammad..The parents and ancestors of Muhammad were following those prophets..

The reason I asked about the parents, was because an Islamic site I was on, said not even parents and ancestors will be spared Hell.

So it is interesting that the Shia version has that.

What if the parents are Polytheists, or Atheists?

Muhammad's ancestors would have been Polytheists.

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[The_Fisher_King]

So, is Islam the only big religion that holds the firm belief that literally everyone who has heard about Islam and has not become a Muslim will be condemned to eternity in hell, regardless of their actions in this life? Muhammad says that there are no exceptions, not even for his parents.

I believe that Earth is Hell, so we are all in Hell already! But I also believe that most of us (whatever our current faith or lack thereof) will one day get out of Hell. But that's a minority view within Islaam!

Of more mainstream Muslim views, many (though certainly not all) Muslims believe that Jews, Christians, Sabians (not the Sabaeans), whoever believes in God and the Last Day (of Judgment) will not have to suffer an eternal Hell. Who the Sabians were or are has been discussed and debated since the Qur'aan was revealed. Certain so-called Gnostic groups, particularly the Mandaeans, but also the followers of Bardaisan, have been associated with the Sabians. Hermeticists have sometimes been claimed to be Sabians. And sometimes you will hear talk of the 'Sabians of Harran', who may not have been monotheists at all. I have even heard some Muslims include Hindus and Buddhists within the 'Sabians' category. And this is all before one even touches the 'whoever believes in God and the Last Day' category. Of course, on even the most generous of these readings, it would appear that some non-Muslims will go to Hell for all eternity. Yet I have come across Muslims who believe that there is no such thing as an eternal Hell, i.e. in a notion of universal salvation. So, as always, it's not as simple as 'Islam condemns everyone else to Hell'. The picture's a bit more complicated than that.

 

[Shia Islam]

What if the parents are Polytheists, or Atheists?

Muhammad's ancestors would have been Polytheists.

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God has chosen for his beloved prophet, i.e. Muhammad the best lineage. No one of his parents, grandparents was a polytheist or atheist..
This was the will of God..
He only chooses for his prophet the best!

It's not that because of being the parents of the prophet, that they will go to Heaven, but rather because of their merits..

 

[Patti]

I think hell is a word for a personal form of misanthropy in which some people would certainly like to believe that some people who have offended them will most certainly be punished for that. Like heaven, God, and the afterlife there's not even any verifiable proof that such a place even exists and to fear it might really waste lot's of energy that could be put to better use elsewhere. Almost everyone has someone specific in mind who they hope will end up there, as if the choice were up to us. Anyhow, Christian, Sabean, or Islam, I hope you end up in a nice place. And don't let this interupt the lofty thoughts going on--I learn and think it over in my own way. But yes, while there are humanitarians out there, who have room for non-belIevers in heaven, it does seem like many major faiths do condem the non-believer to hell.

 

[Ingledsva]

God has chosen for his beloved prophet, i.e. Muhammad the best lineage. No one of his parents, grandparents was a polytheist or atheist..
This was the will of God..
He only chooses for his prophet the best!

It's not that because of being the parents of the prophet, that they will go to Heaven, but rather because of their merits..

The reason I asked is because you said saved, but I have read over-and-over - sent to hellfire.

This is from an Islamic site.

"It was narrated from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) that his parents are in Hell. Muslim (203) narrated that a man said: “O Messenger of Allaah, where is my father?’ He said: “In Hell.” When the man turned away, he called him back and said: “My father and your father are in Hell.”

With regard to his mother he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “I asked my Lord for permission to pray for forgiveness for my mother, and He did not give me permission. I asked him for permission to visit her grave, and He gave me permission.” Narrated by Muslim, 976.

Al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said, commenting on the first hadeeth:

This indicates that whoever died during the fatrah (interval between two Prophets) following the way of the Arabs at that time, namely idol-worship, is among the people of Hell. We cannot say that the message did not reach these people, because the message of Ibraaheem and other Prophets had reached these people.

Sharh Saheeh Muslim, 3/79. " Did the parents of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) become Muslim? - islamqa.info

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[Shia Islam]

The reason I asked is because you said saved, but I have read over-and-over - sent to hellfire.

This is from an Islamic site.

"It was narrated from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) that his parents are in Hell. Muslim (203) narrated that a man said: “O Messenger of Allaah, where is my father?’ He said: “In Hell.” When the man turned away, he called him back and said: “My father and your father are in Hell.”

With regard to his mother he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “I asked my Lord for permission to pray for forgiveness for my mother, and He did not give me permission. I asked him for permission to visit her grave, and He gave me permission.” Narrated by Muslim, 976.

Al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said, commenting on the first hadeeth:

This indicates that whoever died during the fatrah (interval between two Prophets) following the way of the Arabs at that time, namely idol-worship, is among the people of Hell. We cannot say that the message did not reach these people, because the message of Ibraaheem and other Prophets had reached these people.

Sharh Saheeh Muslim, 3/79. " Did the parents of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) become Muslim? - islamqa.info

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Maybe i should have used another word than "saved" to describe the fact that the prophet parents and ancestors were believers. But anyhow..As of the Sunni Hadith..I don't want to sound sectarian..But then Sunnis themselves admit that they prohibited writing the Hadith until the second Hijri century! They claim that this was to protect the Quran...They have even burnt the Alexandria library and whatever ancient libraries they found!!!

It's a long story..

The point is that the Sunni Hadith is unreliable..in any matter you will find the contradicting Hadiths..
And they put some rules in order to ensure that the Hadiths supporting their views are considered authentic..

It's is a long story..