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Is it ok to eat meat based on your religion?

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Is it ok to eat meat based on your religion?

One is allowed to eat fresh flesh from the seafood also, though there is no compulsion in this connection:

Quran [16:15] And He it is Who has subjected to you the sea that you may eat therefrom fresh flesh, and may take forth therefrom ornaments which you wear. And thou seest the ships ploughing through it, that you may thereby journey and that you may seek of His bounty and that you may be grateful.
The Holy Quran - Chapter: 16: Al-Nahl
Right, please?

Regards
 

Segev Moran

Well-Known Member
Do you know any vegetarians who will eat meat that died naturally?
You gave a debate about meat that was handed by the angels to Adam.
This is not what i mean when i say meat.

And yes, I'm a vegetarian that would eat meat if there was no suffering involved.
Most of my vegetarian friends do not eat meet because of the suffering involved and not because they don't like it. (This goes for eggs and dairy also)
 

Tumah

Veteran Member
You gave a debate about meat that was handed by the angels to Adam.

That is one of the sources. The other source says that Adam was allowed to eat meat from animals that died on their own. The point of both was to show that eating meat was allowed from the start and not a concession.

So you fixed your argument to say - not eating meat, but killing animals for meat was the concession. I agree that it was only allowed then, but I don't agree that it was a concession. A concession might be something like slavery or captured women about whom the Torah provides a framework for, but doesn't require one to do. Eating animals on the other hand the Torah requires multiple times. Why would the Torah require us to do something that it doesn't really want us to do?

I also don't agree that the reason killing animals for meat prohibited previously out of concern for animals. I also don't agree that the Rabbis thought eating meat was forbidden for everyone as it says here.
Do you have any arguments proving your point?
 
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wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
And yes, I'm a vegetarian that would eat meat if there was no suffering involved.
Most of my vegetarian friends do not eat meet because of the suffering involved and not because they don't like it. (This goes for eggs and dairy also)
How do you plan on removing any suffering in eating another sentient being, who has a family? :confused:

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
Adam was permitted meat (and ate) meat
So instead of like Genesis where it matches human biology, where we're designed to be frugivores, and suffer illnesses from eating meat...

The Rabbinic literature decided to rewrite the Law to make it fit with their own ideologies, as Jeremiah 7:21-23, Isaiah 66:3 suggests that mankind makes up their own Laws, regardless of what has been instructed.

The Messianic Age is going back to being vegan (Isaiah 65:25), and the Ravenous Beings are to be removed (Isaiah 34).

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

Segev Moran

Well-Known Member
That is one of the sources. The other source says that Adam was allowed to eat meat from animals that died on their own. The point of both was to show that eating meat was allowed from the start and not a concession.
You are not correct.
This is my claim in a nut shell:

Based on the Torah, At first, God only gave permission to eat from the fruits of the earth.
Meat is not mentioned and not allowed.
Again, When i say meat i mean actual animal's meat.
Once the people cried and asked for meat, they were allowed to eat meat as a compromise that was condemned and not accepted in a good eye.
As time passed, the restrictions of meat were lowered until it became so that instead of not allowing eating meat, the use of meat was to honor the Sabbath with more meat that usual (As a way of making the Sabbath unique from other week days).

I still stand behind the argument that at the beginning there was no where to be told that man can eat animals.

If you want the full references just watch the lecture i attached here.
So you fixed your argument to say - not eating meat, but killing animals for meat was the concession. I agree that it was only allowed then, but I don't agree that it was a concession. A concession might be something like slavery or captured women about whom the Torah provides a framework for, but doesn't require one to do. Eating animals on the other hand the Torah requires multiple times. Why would the Torah require us to do something that it doesn't really want us to do?
Where does the Torah requires you to do such thing as eating meat?
It was never demanded rather allowed.
Look in the Torah for the first time god permits meat.
I also don't agree that the reason killing animals for meat prohibited previously out of concern for animals. I also don't agree that the Rabbis thought eating meat was forbidden for everyone as it says here.
Do you have any arguments proving your point?
Just watch the lecture.
It is too long to detail here:

 

Tumah

Veteran Member
You are not correct.
This is my claim in a nut shell:

Based on the Torah, At first, God only gave permission to eat from the fruits of the earth.
Meat is not mentioned and not allowed.
Again, When i say meat i mean actual animal's meat.
Once the people cried and asked for meat, they were allowed to eat meat as a compromise that was condemned and not accepted in a good eye.
As time passed, the restrictions of meat were lowered until it became so that instead of not allowing eating meat, the use of meat was to honor the Sabbath with more meat that usual (As a way of making the Sabbath unique from other week days).
You've got a bunch of things confused here.
First of all, if you check that tosafot I linked to you earlier, he explained that Adam was allowed to eat meat of animals that were already dead. That's actual animal meat.
The people didn't cry for meat when meat was allowed. You're confusing it with when they were complaining for meat in the desert and were given some type of poultry. Meat was allowed about about 1,500 years before that after Noah left the ark.
Meat is used to honor the Sabbath and holidays were there is a requirement to be happy (whenever there is a commandment of ושמחת בחגיך). This is from a statement from the Talmud that eating meat brings joy.

The correct order based on Jewish sources is that Adam was only allowed to eat animals that died on their own. Noah was permitted to kill animals for food. And Jews were restricted to the types of animals and method of slaughter. Additionally, G-d commanded we eat animals at certain times, generally in celebration. A long while later, after the nation had been eating manna for a while, they complained that they also wanted to eat חולין meat. They were given some type of poultry and punished severely.

I still stand behind the argument that at the beginning there was no where to be told that man can eat animals.
I linked you the source in the tosafot earlier.

If you want the full references just watch the lecture i attached here.
That's way too long.

Where does the Torah requires you to do such thing as eating meat?
It was never demanded rather allowed.
Look in the Torah for the first time god permits meat.
It is required that we eat from the animal sacrifices that we bring to the Temple. Parts of the korban Hatat and Asham were eaten by the kohanim as was part of the Bechor b'heima tehora. The Pesah, Shelamim and Ma'aser b'heima were all eaten by the people as part of the process of bringing these sacrifices. If you were capable of eating a korban Pesah but didn't, you are מבטל מצוות עשה דאורייתא which is a sin. The same for all of them.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Is it ok to eat meat based on your religion?

I belong to Ahmadiyya peaceful Islam, I quote from Quran on the issue:

Quran [5:4]

Forbidden to you is the flesh of an animal which dies of itself, and blood and the flesh of swine; and that on which is invoked the name of one other than Allah; and that which has been strangled; and that beaten to death; and that killed by a fall; and that which has been gored to death; and that of which a wild animal has eaten, except that which you have properly slaughtered; and that which has been slaughtered at an altar. And forbidden is also that you seek to know your lot by the divining arrows. That is an act of disobedience. This day have those who disbelieve despaired of harming your religion. So fear them not, but fear Me. This day have I perfected your religion for you and completed My favour upon you and have chosen for you Islam as religion. But whoso is forced by hunger, without being wilfully inclined to sin, then, surely, Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful.

The Holy Quran - Chapter: 5: Al-Ma'idah
This is one aspect of the issue.

Regards


 
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