Is Jesus a golden calf?

[blood-lord14]

Is Jesus a golden calf?

Golden Calves? Sounds like a basketball team.

and you sound like a broken record...
jesus a golden calf
i recall god saying
you shouldnt worship anything or anybody other then him
you people can be so mentally challenged when you ask these questions
think rational and debate academic and religous lies then you come too truth.

 

[Tek]

but you are thinking inside the box [] you need to expaned around it for Jesus is Him and the Father is Jesus it is a part of the trinity

 

[Khale]

Wow, I'd forgotten that this thread had ever existed. So, Blood-Lord:

and you sound like a broken record...
jesus a golden calf
i recall god saying
you shouldnt worship anything or anybody other then him
you people can be so mentally challenged when you ask these questions
think rational and debate academic and religous lies then you come too truth.

I'm not sure I follow what you are trying to say here. You obviously have a beef with something as your statement about "mentally challenged" question implies. Could you elaborate?

 

[LAGoff]

G.C. to J.C.​

In suzerain-vassal covenants from the Ancient Near East, love meant loyalty to the ruler. Therefore, to "love Hashem with all ones heart, soul and might" means to be loyal to Him.
Hashem is a 'jealous God', which means He demands exclusivity.
Jewish tradition holds that if you forsake idolatry you fulfill the whole of the Tora(Talmud Hor.8a), and vice versa(Sifra Deut.54).
But what is idolatry?​

It is known that most ancient cultures had a concept of a 'Most High God'. The only problem was that He was seen as too distant and remote to be of any use. Hence, the creation of intermediaries(see Maimonides, M.T. Laws of Idolatry ch.1).
When man looks to 'heaven' and 'sees' anything between him and Hashem, that is idolatrous ("You shall have no other gods before Me").
The archetype of the intermediary in Tanakh is the Golden Calf(see also Jeroboam's Calves- 1Kings12:25-33). But why construct a calf(a baby bull)? Why not a grown bull?
Rabbi David Fohrman taught that because of the awesomeness of the Sinai revelation("Let not God speak with us lest we die"), and the fact that Moses hadn't returned yet, the people feared he was destroyed by the encounter. So they created something that could stand between them and God.
Making a molten(lit. "masking") calf is really quite logical. A calf sucks from its mother(read:'God'), and through identifying with this 'Sucker' a quite touching relationship with 'God' ensues.
We witness this in Christianity. It is- in essence- Calf worship. Jesus is the "Son of the Father", and "no one can come to the Father except through the Son".
The calling of Jesus the "Lamb of God"(Jn.1:29) should remind us of the Passover lamb in Egypt. Its slaying signaled Israel's willingness to forsake such touching- yet forbidden- relationships.
This act [of slaughter] began- on a national level- the 'cleaning out'(think matsa and leaven) of the space between man and the 'Most High God'.​

 

[CMike]

Most people know the story of the Israelites and the golden calf. What a lot of people don't know is that the calf that was created was a sphinx like creature who's most prominent feature was its calf body. These creatures were believed to carry God down to earth. After a length of time people forgot God and began worshipping these sphinxes as God. Essentially they elevated something to a deific level because it was so close to the Holy One.

My Question then is this: Is it possible that Jesus might have been a good prophet (as many people believe) that was turned into a deity by his followers?

This question assumes that Jesus was at the very least a real person so answer accordingly.

No. He wasn't a good prophet. He wasn't a prophet...period.

No jewish prophet would ever try to claim he has divine power.

In Judaism the only being/person who has power is G-D.

 

[CMike]

Is that it?

Do we have the lineage of Mary anywhere?

(But I do think we are off topic here).

I know this is an old thread.

It doesn't matter.

Tribal lineage goes solely through the biological father.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Most people know the story of the Israelites and the golden calf. What a lot of people don't know is that the calf that was created was a sphinx like creature who's most prominent feature was its calf body. These creatures were believed to carry God down to earth. After a length of time people forgot God and began worshipping these sphinxes as God. Essentially they elevated something to a deific level because it was so close to the Holy One.

Did not know that. Actually it doesn't sound very certain to me. Anybody know where this information comes from? The Jewish Encyclopedia doesn't think that it was a sphinx. I think such a claim ought to have provided a source.

CALF, GOLDEN - JewishEncyclopedia.com
CALF-WORSHIP - JewishEncyclopedia.com

Jesus could-have become a 'Golden calf' though or a brass serpent etc.

No. He wasn't a good prophet. He wasn't a prophet...period.

You seem to think he existed as a real person. Why wasn't he a prophet?

No jewish prophet would ever try to claim he has divine power.

...and you think that he did because of what specifically? Was it something that someone said to you in an internet forum?

In Judaism the only being/person who has power is G-D.

Who is that? How do the prophets in your stories do miracles then?

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

I know this is an old thread.

It doesn't matter.

Tribal lineage goes solely through the biological father.

It's tribe lineage the same as being related to someone, as in Jesus could not be related to David through Mary? That doesn't count?

 

[BSM1]

Most people know the story of the Israelites and the golden calf. What a lot of people don't know is that the calf that was created was a sphinx like creature who's most prominent feature was its calf body. These creatures were believed to carry God down to earth. After a length of time people forgot God and began worshipping these sphinxes as God. Essentially they elevated something to a deific level because it was so close to the Holy One.

My Question then is this: Is it possible that Jesus might have been a good prophet (as many people believe) that was turned into a deity by his followers?

This question assumes that Jesus was at the very least a real person so answer accordingly.

At first I thought your topic may be a little silly but I think you have made a good point. It seems that most "Christians" today do worship Yeshua as opposed to what Yeshua taught. I think that for the most part this has been ingrained into today's Christian by the organized church. It sure seems to keep them in line. Many, or even most, mainline Christians either do not have the ability or desire to seek their own truth; they're evidently very comfortable toeing the party line.
We all know the story of a Buddhist monk who was sure that if he met the long-dead Buddha on the road the only thing The Buddha would say to the monk is "Kill me". I think Yeshua would say the same thing.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

We all know the story of a Buddhist monk who was sure that if he met the long-dead Buddha on the road the only thing The Buddha would say to the monk is "Kill me". I think Yeshua would say the same thing.

Could you provide a reference. My recollection corresponds to ...

If You Meet The Buddha On The Road, Kill Him​

The 'Buddha' would not say anything; the whole point of the saying is that what you believe you've met is an illusion?

 

[nash8]

Most people know the story of the Israelites and the golden calf. What a lot of people don't know is that the calf that was created was a sphinx like creature who's most prominent feature was its calf body. These creatures were believed to carry God down to earth. After a length of time people forgot God and began worshipping these sphinxes as God. Essentially they elevated something to a deific level because it was so close to the Holy One.

My Question then is this: Is it possible that Jesus might have been a good prophet (as many people believe) that was turned into a deity by his followers?

This question assumes that Jesus was at the very least a real person so answer accordingly.

This is exactly what I think happened.

 

[BSM1]

[

quote=Jayhawker Soule;3543907]Could you provide a reference. My recollection corresponds to ...

If You Meet The Buddha On The Road, Kill Him​

The 'Buddha' would not say anything; the whole point of the saying is that what you believe you've met is an illusion?

[/QUOTE]

I am trying to remember which book I read this in. As soon as I find it I'll let you know, along with the name of the monk.

 

[Brickjectivity]

The proof the Jesus has become like a golden calf at least for some people is that there are bitter divisions among Jesus followers. If they were all following one God, then they wouldn't be bitterly divided. Its like someone said to them "Here are your gods, Oh Israel, who brought you up out of Egypt" (Exodus 32:4) Bitter divisions among the Christians really ought to prove that things are not ok. Who are they following? They're following various people who they all call 'Jesus', lots of different Jesus-es.

 

[psychoslice]

Yes I also agree that Jesus became an idol, the golden calf is a good way of putting it also.

 

[halokitty]

Jesus is the golden calf. I see it more as a prophecy. Jews will not worship the golden calf. Not that they should not. But they will not. Also, a direct blood line doesn't mean that Jesus will be a religious Jew since they mix a lot. Jesus was born to die. The third temple will happen when he comes back. Judaism is the first temple, the church is the second, and the third will happen when he returns. Prophecy. Also, I think the promised land is America and that's where the church of latter day saints is a prophecy as well. Joseph Smith didn't claim to witness Jesus in America. So I feel he was seeing into the future, not the past. America is all of our promised land.

 

[halokitty]

Jesus was forsaken. The job of the church is to spread the message that a man named Jesus existed, he is the son of God, and he will come back. So now that everyone knows who he is, he is sure to come back soon. He was meant to die and not rule back then. He was only meant to make a very dramatic appearance.

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

Jesus is the golden calf. I see it more as a prophecy. Jews will not worship the golden calf. Not that they should not. But they will not. Also, a direct blood line doesn't mean that Jesus will be a religious Jew since they mix a lot. Jesus was born to die. The third temple will happen when he comes back. Judaism is the first temple, the church is the second, and the third will happen when he returns. Prophecy. Also, I think the promised land is America and that's where the church of latter day saints is a prophecy as well. Joseph Smith didn't claim to witness Jesus in America. So I feel he was seeing into the future, not the past. America is all of our promised land.

Why not Africa? It's big enough for everyone...

 

[Caladan]

My Question then is this: Is it possible that Jesus might have been a good prophet (as many people believe) that was turned into a deity by his followers?

This question assumes that Jesus was at the very least a real person so answer accordingly.

How do you go from this:

"You lack one thing; go, sell what you own, and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then come, follow me." (Mark 10:21)

Or this:

"Split a piece of wood and I am there, lift a stone and you will find me" (Gospel of Thomas)

To that:

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Hellenism?

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

How do you go from this:

"You lack one thing; go, sell what you own, and give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then come, follow me." (Mark 10:21)

Or this:

"Split a piece of wood and I am there, lift a stone and you will find me" (Gospel of Thomas)

To that:

Good salesmenship.