Is life suffering?

[Valjean]

Well I talked about contraceptives already... and seems next year a new male contraceptive will be released. Which will mean the end of Mankind (because us men don't usually like to have kids, LOL!).

The end of mankind, indeed the entire sixth extinction, will more likely be achieved by maintaining our numbers than by curbing them.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

What if the old-age, disease and death problems are solved by Science someday?

Boredom is a kind of suffering too.

 

[psychoslice]

I see no problem, disease and old age is natural, to go against this would be unnatural.

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram agorman ji

My conclusion is, if Science would solve those 3 problems (and "birth", with contraception, although a World without kids would probably be too sad), life would be "less suffering" and we'd only have the disadvantages of living in the physical plane, which is of limited possibilities of enjoyment compared to higher planes.

here you have it , ....it is only desire and attathment in human kind that causes them to seek or desire to extend life , this inturn would only cause a new set of problems , ....

But I wondered what a Buddhist would answer, since the main problems of life; birth, old-age, sickness and death, were seen as unsolvable in the days of Siddharta, 2500 years ago, but not now. I even dare to say that neither are unsolvable in other planets with more technologically advanced people.

if we could live for ever we would just live to witness the destruction of this earth planet and the suffering caused by dwindeling of natural material recorces , ....this it self would cause another form of suffering , ...

But the little detail is: Is the mind of most humans today prepared for such blessings as immortality, lack of old age and disease? There's even people that gets sick on purpose, just to be taken care of!

Personaly I dont think that imortality alone is the answer to the ceasation of suffering , imortality itself would be a form of suffering as one would never gain release from the material platform and as you said , ...''its limitations''

So maybe the problem is not lack of technological advancements, but lack of illumination. So I think that "life is suffering" maxim only applies to people who don't do their spiritual homework.

exactly , ....even if all forms of physical suffering were to be removed , we would be left in a state of limbo , we would never progress , as there would be no catalist to cause us to look beyond the physical realm and strive for any form of enlightenment , ....

suffering in itself can be very usefull , without understanding of its nature we canot rise above it , therefore suffering is a natural part of our spiritual progression , without it we would simply stagnate , ..we would become traped in the physical realm with no means of escape , ....this it self would be another form of suffering !

Medicine and technology have already resulted in a population exceeding the planet's carrying capacity.

again ....exactly !...

then what , ...we then desire to find another planet so that we can strip it of its recorces , ....and so material desire goes on and on allways trying to solve the unsolvable , ...Material matter by its very nature is Finite I dont see that we can change this , ..all we can change is our desire and perception .

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I see no problem, disease and old age is natural, to go against this would be unnatural.

That's right. But those aren't the only types of suffering.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sacca/sacca1/dukkha.html

 

[Banjankri]

That's right. But those aren't the only types of suffering.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sacca/sacca1/dukkha.html

It is good to notice that "dukkha" is expressed as "stress" which is the basis of every intentional activity (and not only). Whatever we do, we do it through stress. From being angry, to moving a finger.
Stress is perceivable, so it is not difficult to observe how it arises and passed.

 

[agorman]

It is good to notice that "dukkha" is expressed as "stress" which is the basis of every intentional activity (and not only). Whatever we do, we do it through stress. From being angry, to moving a finger.
Stress is perceivable, so it is not difficult to observe how it arises and passed.

So, you think being a good Buddhist is being lazy.

 

[psychoslice]

That's right. But those aren't the only types of suffering.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/dhamma/sacca/sacca1/dukkha.html

I think suffering is suffering, where ever it is.

 

[Banjankri]

So, you think being a good Buddhist is being lazy.

Absolutely lazy .

 

[crossfire]

It is good to notice that "dukkha" is expressed as "stress" which is the basis of every intentional activity (and not only). Whatever we do, we do it through stress. From being angry, to moving a finger.
Stress is perceivable, so it is not difficult to observe how it arises and passed.

Back to the 4 Noble Truths
1 The Truth of Dukkha (unskillful result)
2 The Truth of the Origin of Dukkha (unskillful cause/intention)
3 The Truth of the Cessation of Dukkha (skillful result)
4 The Truth of the Path to the liberation of Dukkha (skillful cause/intention)

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Back to the 4 Noble Truths
1 The Truth of Dukkha (unskillful result)
2 The Truth of the Origin of Dukkha (unskillful cause/intention)
3 The Truth of the Cessation of Dukkha (skillful result)
4 The Truth of the Path to the liberation of Dukkha (skillful cause/intention)

That's an interesting take, like a variation on kamma?

 

[crossfire]

That's an interesting take, like a variation on kamma?

It makes the most sense to me when you boil it down to the logical elements. The thing Buddha stressed is identifying dukkha, contemplating how dukkha arises, contempating how it ceases, and developing a skillful path of practice leading to the ending of dukkha, which parallels my annotation to the four noble truths.

 

[crossfire]

Back to the 4 Noble Truths
1 The Truth of Dukkha (unskillful result) Identify dukkha
2 The Truth of the Origin of Dukkha (unskillful cause/intention) Watch how dukkha arises
3 The Truth of the Cessation of Dukkha (skillful result) Watch how dukkha ceases
4 The Truth of the Path to the liberation of Dukkha (skillful cause/intention) Develop path of practice (skill) leading to ending of dukkha

added the parallels in blue above

 

[Vishvavajra]

Who said life was suffering? The actual Buddhist teaching is that sentient beings are generally afflicted with a sort of illness that can be described as vexation, dissatisfaction, or existential angst. That illness of the mind is intimately tied up with seemingly fundamental aspects of life, such as birth, old age, sickness, and death. However it's not true that suffering of this kind is an inevitable result of those things, as posited by the Buddhadharma itself, which purports to provide the means to break that correlation. Nor is it true that that sort of suffering only comes from those factors.

It would be good to "fix" the unpleasant parts of life. However, people will still find things to feel dissatisfied about, and hopefully Buddhadharma will be there to help them.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

What if the old-age, disease and death problems are solved by Science someday?

There's an interesting train of thought I heard on this- what if we ran technological advancement to it's logical conclusion-

We ultimately 'fix' every problem, cure every disease, aging, achieve immortality, no pain, no grieving- and what if technology made food and every other material object limitless and free-

any person could literally have any thing they could ever dream of- instantly

It doesn't take long to see the problem, a world like this could only function, and people be happy, where people had the purest souls, the desire to do only good, to love, desiring only these purest minimalist pleasures- far above mere material objects and physical desires..

Yet how does any person achieve this, without first knowing what greed, evil, sin is, in order to choose to reject them completely?

This super advanced civilization might invoke a proving ground for it's citizens/ souls, where every evil, sin, temptaion must be experienced and fully rejected by personal choice before being accepted

I.e. by this model, heaven is the real world, and Earth the virtual reality

Not something I think I subscribe to, but an interesting perspective.