Is our present age being devastated by CONSUMERISM?

[Deist David]

I sometimes look at the world (society not physical), in dispair at how greed and the drive of consumerism, the 'need' to collect material things, is perhaps killing us (in a real as well as a metaphorical sense).

But then I wonder; what is the answer ? Communism?! .... I suspect not, too much reliance on people to pass over greed, power, and control.

Are we so obsessed with consumerism and capitalism because there is no real alternative (at least in the secular West) ?

Are what I would deem as (strictly my opinion only) human constructions like the revealed religions, actually things that were created all those years ago, to stifle similar ages of greed?! ......... perhaps they were needed after all ! :angel2:

I believe that poverty could be eradicated overnight, if a huge attitude shift could occur. If every man accepted that $1m was the maximum amount of money that any person needs to enjoy a comfortable, reasonable life, the balance could wipe out poverty around the world, and most probably stop the destruction of the planet through global warming too.

But this is idealism ................ how to we pull even some of this into reality?


Where is the gap, the "middle way", the channel that exists between outright, greed-driven consumerism, and dangerous, religious fundamentalism ??

How can humanity reach this place? What would it look like?

Look forward to hearing people's views.

 

[3.14]

people need greed/desire to advance there understanding without it we could just aswell life in cave's

 

[Deist David]

Mmm.........., that's certainly one view!

Why would greed be the only solitary driver for people to 'advance'. What about the desire for knowledge of say, things like medicine, to be able to help people and reduce suffering?

I am not sure whether a world without greed could ever exist, but if it did, I am sure there would still be 'advancements' in knowledge.

Anyway....... caves are underrated!

 

[gnomon]

I sometimes look at the world (society not physical), in dispair at how greed and the drive of consumerism, the 'need' to collect material things, is perhaps killing us (in a real as well as a metaphorical sense).

But then I wonder; what is the answer ? Communism?! .... I suspect not, too much reliance on people to pass over greed, power, and control.

Are we so obsessed with consumerism and capitalism because there is no real alternative (at least in the secular West) ?

Are what I would deem as (strictly my opinion only) human constructions like the revealed religions, actually things that were created all those years ago, to stifle similar ages of greed?! ......... perhaps they were needed after all ! :angel2:

I believe that poverty could be eradicated overnight, if a huge attitude shift could occur. If every man accepted that $1m was the maximum amount of money that any person needs to enjoy a comfortable, reasonable life, the balance could wipe out poverty around the world, and most probably stop the destruction of the planet through global warming too.

But this is idealism ................ how to we pull even some of this into reality?


Where is the gap, the "middle way", the channel that exists between outright, greed-driven consumerism, and dangerous, religious fundamentalism ??

How can humanity reach this place? What would it look like?

Look forward to hearing people's views.

Consumerism and capitalism had absolutely nothing to do with preventing the world leaders from intervening in Rwanda, Darfur or Somalia. While greed definitely played a role it must be remembered that the societies that caused the problems in all those areas, excepting perhaps Somalia and the role of UN and other world organizations, it was not a capitalist society that caused the problems.

Also, older religions definitely has class structures and some of them, notably European paganism, were societies where both the culture and the religion celebrated warriors over others. Hardly a recipe for peace or an end to poverty.

 

[Wandered Off]

Where is the gap, the "middle way", the channel that exists between outright, greed-driven consumerism, and dangerous, religious fundamentalism ??

I'm not sure I can get myself to see these two as opposite ends of some continuum... That strikes me kind of like asking, 'Where is the gap, the "middle way", the channel that exists between outright, Olympic curling, and dangerous, radon gas??'

 

[BucephalusBB]

the 'need' to collect material things, is perhaps killing us (in a real as well as a metaphorical sense).

I don't see this..

I mean that we as humanity are getting killed ..

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I'm not sure I can get myself to see these two as opposite ends of some continuum... That strikes me kind of like asking, 'Where is the gap, the "middle way", the channel that exists between outright, Olympic curling, and dangerous, radon gas??'

The answer to this is obviously "a bowl of rice crispies".

Next!

 

[Sunstone]

So far as I can figure out, consumerism is driving an ecologically unsustainable lifestyle.

 

[Deist David]

I don't see this..

I mean that we as humanity are getting killed ..

See the response from "Sunstone" above - that is what I was getting at.

Where will we bury all the old (1 year old), iPods that no-one wants anymore?

Perhaps there is a stronger distrust of consumerism, from where I write today, as compared to where most of the forum members are writing from. I don't expect everyone to agree, I just thought the basic principal for discussion was clear.

 

[Deist David]

Consumerism and capitalism had absolutely nothing to do with preventing the world leaders from intervening in Rwanda, Darfur or Somalia. While greed definitely played a role it must be remembered that the societies that caused the problems in all those areas, excepting perhaps Somalia and the role of UN and other world organizations, it was not a capitalist society that caused the problems.

Also, older religions definitely has class structures and some of them, notably European paganism, were societies where both the culture and the religion celebrated warriors over others. Hardly a recipe for peace or an end to poverty.

Hi,

I'm not sure I fully 'get' your response, because you seem to be referencing world conflicts - perhaps that is your point? ...... that conflict will always cause poverty in some areas of the world, even if there was no consumerist greed ?

But doesn't the very conflict that happens is the areas you mentioned, ultimately stem from greed ?

 

[BucephalusBB]

See the response from "Sunstone" above - that is what I was getting at.

Where will we bury all the old (1 year old), iPods that no-one wants anymore?

Perhaps there is a stronger distrust of consumerism, from where I write today, as compared to where most of the forum members are writing from. I don't expect everyone to agree, I just thought the basic principal for discussion was clear.

Ow common, I come from the other side of our little sea.. If I spit really hard you better jump to the side..
And pff, we just break down those i-pods, as we should with all macintoshproducts (Hides).
We are far from unsustainable and my guess is we won't ever come even close to it.

 

[gnomon]

Hi,

I'm not sure I fully 'get' your response, because you seem to be referencing world conflicts - perhaps that is your point? ...... that conflict will always cause poverty in some areas of the world, even if there was no consumerist greed ?

But doesn't the very conflict that happens is the areas you mentioned, ultimately stem from greed ?

I'm talking about the history of world conflicts driven by the conflict for basic resources. Also the conflict centered around different tribal, ethnic or political groups for control over those resources.

There's a difference between a consumer goods within a capitalist society and basic resources such as food and water which can be a source of conflict between or within any society.

The specific conflicts I listed were to represent conflicts that do not involve or partially involve capitalism. The conflicts in Rwanda arose from a colonial period and ethnic division. The ethnic division led to a political conflict. Somalia represents a conflict over the scarcity of resources and tribal groups fighting to gain control over those resources. The cause of that conflict is also rooted in the poor management from world organizations that reflect very little the nature of a capitalist society.

When conflicts divide along ethnic lines there is more than greed involved. Also, greed is not confined to a consumer driven society.