Is religion logical

[Rational Agnostic]

I am starting out on a general basis. Certainly one may argue about certain elements as to how logical they are but I am looking for whether it makes any sense for any kind of religious activity to exist.

My beginning argument for it being logical is that religion is like tradition. A person fiinds something that works so it becomes something worth repeating.

Fod instance the chant of "om" is believed to work as a way to enter into meditation.

I believe that all religion is based upon feeling and emotion rather than logic. This is not necessarily a bad thing. Many people seem to need the emotional comfort found in religion, or the perceived assurance of immortality, whether or not it is based upon any factual evidence or can be demonstrated to be true. For the most part, I like to view the universe as it actually is and not how I would like it to be, although there are exceptions in my case I am sure as well. We all delude ourselves to some extent--some more than others.

 

[Rational Agnostic]

I believe it makes a lot more sense to believe an intelligence exists than to believe a whole logical system of nature exists. The intelligence behind nature makes more sense than it just existing.

In my opinion, not necessarily. Believing in an intelligent overlord hiding in another realm behind the physical only raises more questions? Where did it come from? Certainly a deity would be at least as complex as the universe it created, leading to questions about the origin of the deity that are even harder to answer than the original question about the origin of the universe.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Not always. Bizarre coincidence is a normal feature of huge numbers of events. I could simply draw 4 royal flushes in a row. If I drew cards a billion times it becomes very likely that I will a time or two. I don't play cards much, so I probably won't. Assuming that I am cheating will still be wrong.
Tom

we 'know' beyond any reasonable doubt

"If I drew cards a billion times it becomes very likely that I will a time or two."

not even close, it's hundreds of billion of trillions to one. around 1 in 1,700,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 near the number of stars in the universe....

If you work in the fraud dept, are you going to say to your boss, hey- maybe he's just lucky?!


Let's put it this way, that's also close to the odds of rolling a die and getting the number SIX. 30 times in a row. No reason to suspect the die might be loaded at this point?!

 

[Cephus]

If a gambler plays 4 royal flushes in a row, what's your bet? luck or cheating? What odds do you give atheism being true?

Atheism is just not believing the crap that theists say because they haven't demonstrated it to be true. So long as that's the case, atheism has very high odds because nobody in their right mind should believe anything without it being shown to be factually correct.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Atheism is just not believing the crap that theists say because they haven't demonstrated it to be true. So long as that's the case, atheism has very high odds because nobody in their right mind should believe anything without it being shown to be factually correct.

Likewise, until I see some evidence of this naturalistic mechanism that created everything we see around us for no particular reason, I think it's a safe bet there is no such thing!

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

But can you explain why it makes more sense to anybody who doesn't share your unevidenced opinions about god?
I am 58, and nobody has done that yet. When they fail the attempt, the explanation is usually some form of "You must first believe in my opinions before they will make sense."
Tom

Just out of curiosity - I like these sort of challenges - what are you asking for here?

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

If Yahweh were as close to Abraham, Moses, and the prophets as the Scripture describes they would have known about the Trinity. Instead, Moses brought down the 10 Commandments starting with "No other Gods! I am the One and Only and I am a jealous God." Nothing about Jesus or Holy Ghost or any of that.

Technically it says not to worship other gods before him. That could mean before him in order (Yahweh first, Thor second, for example) or in his presence (no worshiping Thor in Yahweh's temple.) It was the KJV, I believe, that translated "strange/foreign gods" to "false gods".

 

[Cephus]

Likewise, until I see some evidence of this naturalistic mechanism that created everything we see around us for no particular reason, I think it's a safe bet there is no such thing!

Then you're not paying attention because that's where every shred of objective evidence points. And even if there wasn't, not having an answer is not a license to just make up some emotionally-comforting nonsense because you feel like it. That's just idiotic.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Then you're not paying attention because that's where every shred of objective evidence points. And even if there wasn't, not having an answer is not a license to just make up some emotionally-comforting nonsense because you feel like it. That's just idiotic.

Which naturalistic mechanism are you talking about, multiverses? something else? any objective evidence for it that you care to share with us?

 

[shmogie]

Of course you can. Listen to a Jew.

If Yahweh were as close to Abraham, Moses, and the prophets as the Scripture describes they would have known about the Trinity. Instead, Moses brought down the 10 Commandments starting with "No other Gods! I am the One and Only and I am a jealous God." Nothing about Jesus or Holy Ghost or any of that.
The most fundamental premise of Christianity is irrational.
Ask @Flankerl, or @RabbiO or any of the other Jews on this forum alone.
Tom

Another that doesn't understand logic. Logic isn't what you think or believe. It is a system for determining the veracity of a proposition by using a set of universal rules. "Irrational" ? So now you are applying a description based totally on yours and a minority of people's subjective beliefs to condemn a much larger group of people in what they believe. Certainly your right. But it ain't logic, it simply another opinion. Like rectums, everybody has one

 

[shmogie]

Then you're not paying attention because that's where every shred of objective evidence points. And even if there wasn't, not having an answer is not a license to just make up some emotionally-comforting nonsense because you feel like it. That's just idiotic.

No, there is no evidence as to how the universe created itself, or how chemicals turned themselves into living organisms. Not having an answer is not a license to just make up some emotionally comforting nonsense because you feel like it. To believe those things is just idiotic. Your idiocy is no less absurd than mine.

 

[columbus]

Logic isn't what you think or believe. It is a system for determining the veracity of a proposition by using a set of universal rules.

What universal set of rules determines the veracity of Christianity?
Looks more like a batch of irrational legends to me.

Feel free to explain yourself in terms that the large majority of humans will understand. Or not. Most Christians don't. I have never met one who did. That's why I am not particularly theist. Religion isn't rational.
Tom

 

[columbus]

Not having an answer is not a license to just make up some emotionally comforting nonsense because you feel like it.

So why do religionists continue to do so?
Tom

 

[psychoslice]

Well Santa and the Easter bunny make a lot of sense to many, and also sounds logic.

 

[shmogie]

So why do religionists continue to do so?
Tom

The point is that it cuts both ways. But of course Christianity isn't about emotion nor is it "made up"

 

[shmogie]

What universal set of rules determines the veracity of Christianity?
Looks more like a batch of irrational legends to me.

Feel free to explain yourself in terms that the large majority of humans will understand. Or not. Most Christians don't. I have never met one who did. That's why I am not particularly theist. Religion isn't rational.
Tom

Let me make this as simple as I can, please follow carefully. The laws of logic applied to Christianity aren't about it's "veracity", it is about whether it is a logical construct. It is. Using those same laws, that all logicians use, Christianity cannot be proven to be illogical. You obviously have no familiarity with logic, I suggest you take a class. Your subjective opinion says that religion isn't rational, mines says that believing the universe created itself is irrational, believing nothing is the same. You have your opinion, I have mine. We WILL find out in the end as to who is right. Lets just leave it there

 

[shunyadragon]

They certainly must have practical benefits otherwise they wouldn't have survived so long.

Fallacy of popularity. Peanut Butter has practical benefits.

 

[shunyadragon]

The point is that it cuts both ways. But of course Christianity isn't about emotion nor is it "made up"

Actually the Roman non-Jewish Chriatianity is possibly "made up."

 

[shmogie]

Actually the Roman non-Jewish Chriatianity is possibly "made up."

Thar's what some people think, others don't

 

[MonkeyFire]

Pacifism is best radicalized. Religion makes sense for peace, and virtues.