Is the Devil a God ?

[F0uad]

Look it up, the word "Elohim" is used for angels and spirits. The problem is the semantic understanding of the original term and its misappropriation. I mainly blame Trinitarians.

Ok but then when we talk about the devil as a higher being we do not compare him as a God right.. but rather as you said as a un-natural being right?

 

[Shermana]

Ok but then when we talk about the devil as a higher being we do not compare him as a God right.. but rather as you said as a un-natural being right?

No we can still call him a "god" (lowercase), as for un-natural being, I don't know about that, he is still a created being, just not an earthly being, so if by "natural" you mean "born on this earth", then no.

The word "god" only means "higher being". Even though people call Allah/Yah "god", it's just His title. There's a reason why the Hebrew and Greek uses an article before god when describing him but not other gods.

 

[NeedingGnosisNow]

In order for it not to be reinterpretation it would have to predate the Torah.

True. It seems to me that Sethian Gnosticism is just an amalgamation of Sethian Jewish beliefs, Jewish mysticism, Plato's teachings, and Zoroaster.

 

[Oryonder]

Look it up, the word "Elohim" is used for angels and spirits. The problem is the semantic understanding of the original term and its misappropriation. I mainly blame Trinitarians.

There is a reason why the word for "God" was "El". The usage of the term could specify a God .. each town or city had a local God that would be called "El-Yahweh" or "El-Dad". Then names of different Gods were prefixed with El. For Arabs it was Al or Allah.

El was the creator God of mesopotamian civilization and the etymology of this word goes all the way back to the creation stories of the Sumerians Ellil/Enlil.

The use of the term El .. whether it be Elohim (plural - council of El) or in some other form alludes a to the one creator God "El"

Abraham's God was El. Later on Yahwah was associated with El. Yahweh was even shown on reliefs dug up with his consort Asherah (El's consort was Asherah).

The symbol for El was the Bull and it is common to dig up 4 horned alters at ancient Israelite sites.

Whether it was El, his consort Asherah, or his son Baal .. the Israelites spent far more time worshiping these Gods than they did a God called Yahweh.

Elijah himself tells us that in his time there he was the only Prophet to Yahweh in all of Israel. There were 450 Prophets to Baal and 400 to Asherah.

The Yahweh apologists who edited the OT after the Babylonian captivity in during the Persian reign were the ones that gave Yahweh his status.

Yahweh certainly did not have much status prior to this.

Even Aaron the brother of Moses (only a very short time after this wonderful God Yahweh supposedly parted the red sea and did all kinds of other miracles) seemed to not think much of this God. Moses leaves for a few days and he gets a bunch of Jewlery and Gold from the people and makes a "Golden Calf/Bull" (Think El/Asherah) if this light has not already gone off.

Moses returns and is ******. He then turns the calf into powder and makes the children of Israel drink it. Then he asks "who is with God and who is against" . He then has assassins go out and kill those that choose the side against him. We are told that 3000 are killed.

Obviously this story has ben edited. Moses was a military leader. What he was really asking was "Who is with me" Moses was ruthless and he put down the dissent immediately killing over 3000 people.

This would have been no easy task and in fact .. was a revolution against Moses having little to do with God.

It is a mental absurdity to think for a second that folks living at that time that had actually witnessed "a real God" would go against this God's leader in such a short period of time because of a few hardships.

Moses learned his Monotheism from the Egyptian Pharoah Akhenaten. Akhenaten had the idea of monotheism but the Egyptians revolted. Moses lead followers of this cult out of Egypt but they did not remain monotheistic for long nor were they monotheistic prior to Akhenaten.

The Moses story, like most of the Bible stories, comes to us from Sumerian lore.
It was Sargon of Akkad .. Uniter of the city states of Sumeria to form the wolds first empire around 2400 BC..

"My high priestess mother conceived me, in secret she bore me. She set me in a basket of rushes, with bitumen she sealed my lid. She cast me into the river which rose over me. The river bore me up and carried me to Akki, the drawer of water. Akki, the drawer of water, took me as his son and reared me"

Sound familiar ?

In Sumerian lore it is Enlil (with help of the other Gods) that makes "Adamu", the first humans.

Oddly enough this is the exact same as the first Genesis story of the creation of man. It is only in the second story that "El" is changed to Yahweh.

In the first version of the story it is El .. and El says "Let us make man in our image"

 

[Shermana]

There is a reason why the word for "God" was "El". The usage of the term could specify a God .. each town or city had a local God that would be called "El-Yahweh" or "El-Dad". Then names of different Gods were prefixed with El. For Arabs it was Al or Allah.

So then, explain why the Angel that Jacob wrestles with (See Hosea 12) is called an "Elohim". Explain why Psalm 136:2 calls the Father the "god of the gods". Quite clearly, the word "god" means "A superior being". Please explain why the Witch Endor claims to see an "Elohim" when summoning Sameuls' departed soul. The people who promote the views which you are so boldly asserting (and presuming) as matter of fact have never addressed the actual language nuances like this, and that's where their arguments are revealed to be total presumptions: They don't match up with what the text actually says, they're so dogged to write it off for this or that reason that they don't even get the details right and end up tripping over themselves. There's a reason so few scholars take Karen Armstrong seriously. I assume you take her views without question? Anyways, we can see by your entire post you have not in any way proven that "Elohim" does not refer to other beings called "gods" which can include the Evil one.

I am curious, you put your religion as "Christian", but you basically deny the origins of the same text that Jesus refers to. I question your familiarity with what Jesus actually says if you say you're a Christian while buying hook line and sinker into the Karen Armstrong school.

El was the creator God of mesopotamian civilization and the etymology of this word goes all the way back to the creation stories of the Sumerians Ellil/Enlil.

This is a widely misunderstood concept. The word "El" was not his name. It was like saying "The boss", "The god". It still meant "god". The implication was that the other gods were not worthy of the title "god". We see this exact same concept with the articulation of "god" to mean Yah in the Hebrew texts.

The use of the term El .. whether it be Elohim (plural - council of El) or in some other form alludes a to the one creator God "El"

Because you said so? I don't deny that it can and does with contextual indicators in the text, but you're trying to say it EXCLUSIVELY refers, and that's something that you cannot prove.

Abraham's God was El. Later on Yahwah was associated with El. Yahweh was even shown on reliefs dug up with his consort Asherah (El's consort was Asherah)

I'm assuming you're getting your sources from the Wikipedia article on the subject where the talk page is twice as long as the article. This idea is totally presumptive.

The symbol for El was the Bull and it is common to dig up 4 horned alters at ancient Israelite sites.

One of many symbols perhaps.

Whether it was El, his consort Asherah, or his son Baal .. the Israelites spent far more time worshiping these Gods than they did a God called Yahweh.

There is no doubt that the Israelites turned to pagan gods. To deny this means to deny what the scriptures say. There's no reason to assume Baal was his son. Or that Ashterah was his consort. There's no reason to assume the Canaanite version of the Mythos was the exact same. You've been talking to Outhouse too much.

Elijah himself tells us that in his time there he was the only Prophet to Yahweh in all of Israel. There were 450 Prophets to Baal and 400 to Asherah.

Yes, indeed.

The Yahweh apologists who edited the OT after the Babylonian captivity in during the Persian reign were the ones that gave Yahweh his status.

Please prove this or retract.

Yahweh certainly did not have much status prior to this.

You certainly like to state bold assumptive assertions as matter of fact. It's quite common.

E

ven Aaron the brother of Moses (only a very short time after this wonderful God Yahweh supposedly parted the red sea and did all kinds of other miracles) seemed to not think much of this God. Moses leaves for a few days and he gets a bunch of Jewlery and Gold from the people and makes a "Golden Calf/Bull" (Think El/Asherah) if this light has not already gone off.

I think you've lost track of the point of the argument that the word "Elohim" can apply to angels and thus the Devil.

Moses returns and is ******. He then turns the calf into powder and makes the children of Israel drink it. Then he asks "who is with God and who is against" . He then has assassins go out and kill those that choose the side against him. We are told that 3000 are killed.

Yes, I'm well aware that the Israelites turned to Idolatry. When would you like to actually start proving that "El" always was in reference to the creator god isntead of gods in general, especially as opposed to the articulated form? Did you even read anything I said about how "Elohim" can refer to angels?

Obviously this story has ben edited. Moses was a military leader. What he was really asking was "Who is with me" Moses was ruthless and he put down the dissent immediately killing over 3000 people.

I would love to see your proof for your assertions.

This would have been no easy task and in fact .. was a revolution against Moses having little to do with God.

Are you at all interested in actually demonstrating how "Elohim" does not apply to Angels in the text or are you going to keep on spouting presumptions you can't possibly back up which belongs in the land of Karen Armstrong?

It is a mental absurdity to think for a second that folks living at that time that had actually witnessed "a real God" would go against this God's leader in such a short period of time because of a few hardships.

It's a mental absurdity to think your post is in any way cogent or supportable, or on track to the actual subject.

Moses learned his Monotheism from the Egyptian Pharoah Akhenaten. Akhenaten had the idea of monotheism but the Egyptians revolted. Moses lead followers of this cult out of Egypt but they did not remain monotheistic for long nor were they monotheistic prior to Akhenaten.

You must be having some serious cognitive dissonance if you think this somehow proves that "El" and "Elohim" exclusively refers to the Creator god and not Heavenly beings as was my point.

The Moses story, like most of the Bible stories, comes to us from Sumerian lore.
It was Sargon of Akkad .. Uniter of the city states of Sumeria to form the wolds first empire around 2400 BC..

You really should start your sentences with "Some scholars say", unless of course you think you somehow can prove your claims as matter of fact.

"My high priestess mother conceived me, in secret she bore me. She set me in a basket of rushes, with bitumen she sealed my lid. She cast me into the river which rose over me. The river bore me up and carried me to Akki, the drawer of water. Akki, the drawer of water, took me as his son and reared me"

Now of course you'd like to present the source for this, right? You're not gonna squirm when asked for sources are you?

Sound familiar ?

Sure does? But perhaps you'd like to actually like to prove your case that "Elohim" cannot refer to angels and heavenly beings as I stated and stick to the topic instead of trying to preach your Karen Armstrong views which have absolutely no means of being proven?

In Sumerian lore it is Enlil (with help of the other Gods) that makes "Adamu", the first humans.

There is indeed much overlap between the Shemarians (note: Shem was called Sem in Babylonian texts, so Sumerian = Shemarian most likely)

Oddly enough this is the exact same as the first Genesis story of the creation of man. It is only in the second story that "El" is changed to Yahweh.

I do in fact believe the Sumerians had many of the same ideas that the later Biblical writers knew. Perhaps you'd like to explain how that's in any way supportive of your argument that Elohim does not refer to angels?

In the first version of the story it is El .. and El says "Let us make man in our image"[

Yes, because he's talking to the angels. Thus, Elohim means "gods" as in Angels. This is the standard Rabbinical commentary.

Does anyone else want to try and actually attempt to prove that Elohim doesn't mean the Angels in various regards and actually stick to the topic? And if you want to play the Karen Armstrong game, please be more honest and state the facts with sources. That would be great.

 

[Oryonder]

So then, explain why the Angel that Jacob wrestles with (See Hosea 12) is called an "Elohim". Explain why Psalm 136:2 calls the Father the "god of the gods". Quite clearly, the word "god" means "A superior being". Please explain why the Witch Endor claims to see an "Elohim" when summoning Sameuls' departed soul.

After Jacob wrestles with "God" he asks the God "What is your name" God replies "I can not tell you that"


A common belief "back in the day" was that if you knew the name of a God you had power over that God. The simple fact that Jacob did not know the name of God should tell you something. Namely that Jacob did not know which God he was confronting.

We see a repeat of this when Moses meets God. Moses, being raised an Egyptian would also have the belief that if you knew the name of a God you had power over it.

Moses says exactly the same thing as Jacob .. "How shall I call you?/what is your name"

God's response is no different the second time. " I am that I am" in other words . bugger off.

I have never heard of Karen Armstrong ..

Enlil and El are one in the same. The etymology of the word comes from El .. Obviously.

I am curious, you put your religion as "Christian", but you basically deny the origins of the same text that Jesus refers to. I question your familiarity with what Jesus actually says if you say you're a Christian while buying hook line and sinker into the Karen Armstrong school.

I have a good familiarity with the words of Jesus and have never heard of Armstrong. Clearly you are not familiar with Scholarship.

This is a widely misunderstood concept. The word "El" was not his name. It was like saying "The boss", "The god". It still meant "god". The implication was that the other gods were not worthy of the title "god". We see this exact same concept with the articulation of "god" to mean Yah in the Hebrew texts.

You have no clue what you are talking about. El is the name of the Creator God of the Canaanites and this God is the same as the Ancient God of the Sumerians "Enlil"

Because you said so? I don't deny that it can and does with contextual indicators in the text, but you're trying to say it EXCLUSIVELY refers, and that's something that you cannot prove.

I made no such claim of exclusivity. The etymology of the word goes back to El .

Meaning .. the word for God comes from El. This does not mean that the word Elohim refers exclusively to El.

I'm assuming you're getting your sources from the Wikipedia article on the subject where the talk page is twice as long as the article. This idea is totally presumptive.

You assumed wrong. .. here is some good reading material for you to start with.
http://www.jhsonline.org/Articles/article_144.pdf

http://dspace.utlib.ee/dspace/bitst...d=DE641F981BDA06F6C643DC502181A965?sequence=1

The above is a 200 page dissertation .. on Page 33 you can read about Enlil (il-ilu)
as being referred to as God of Gods

One of many symbols perhaps.

Yes .. for the Gods El and Asherah ..

There is no doubt that the Israelites turned to pagan gods. To deny this means to deny what the scriptures say. There's no reason to assume Baal was his son. Or that Ashterah was his consort. There's no reason to assume the Canaanite version of the Mythos was the exact same. You've been talking to Outhouse too much.
Yes, indeed.

You obviously have no clue what you are talking about. That Asherah was El's consort and Baal was his son is not debated.

Please prove this or retract.

Judaism Meets Zoroastrianism

The above link gives a general summary (unlike the Journal and thesis articles give you previously)

It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out the influence of Zoroastrianism on Judaism. Zoroastrianism was the monotheistic religion of the Persians.

Isaiah even claims that the King of Persia was "Annointed by God"

Judaism was Polytheistic (according to the Bible) until the Persians. The Israelites attributed their downfall to having many Gods .. Obviously if the Jews thought that the Persians were blessed by God then their "monotheism" must be right.

EI think you've lost track of the point of the argument that the word "Elohim" can apply to angels and thus the Devil.

Yes, I'm well aware that the Israelites turned to Idolatry. When would you like to actually start proving that "El" always was in reference to the creator god isntead of gods in general, especially as opposed to the articulated form? Did you even read anything I said about how "Elohim" can refer to angels?

I have no idea whether or not "Elohim" applied to the Devil.

You have given zero support for your claim that Elohim refers to Angels.

Mesopotamia knew of El as the creator God ..

I would love to see your proof for your assertions.

Start reading the material I gave you .. there is lots more so get ready. You are going to have to learn some history.

It's a mental absurdity to think your post is in any way cogent or supportable, or on track to the actual subject.
You must be having some serious cognitive dissonance if you think this somehow proves that "El" and "Elohim" exclusively refers to the Creator god and not Heavenly beings as was my point.

When I am finished it is you that will be having fits of cognitive dissonance.

Do you even have a clue cogintive dissonance theory is about because you have not really made a coherent statement in relation to cognitive dissonance theory.

 

[Polymorphic Grass]

technicly hes both but i dont consider him my GOD but hes a diety hisself too just how hades is.

 

[Shermana]

After Jacob wrestles with "God" he asks the God "What is your name" God replies "I can not tell you that"

Did you ignore what I said that Hosea 12:1-2 confirms that it was an angel or did I not post that here?

A common belief "back in the day" was that if you knew the name of a God you had power over that God. The simple fact that Jacob did not know the name of God should tell you something. Namely that Jacob did not know which God he was confronting.

That doesn't negate that Hosea 12:1-2 clearly states it was an Angel he wrestled with. As well, there's the issue of the Witch of Endor calling Samuel's Soul an "Angel".

We see a repeat of this when Moses meets God. Moses, being raised an Egyptian would also have the belief that if you knew the name of a God you had power over it.

This has no scriptural basis.

Moses says exactly the same thing as Jacob .. "How shall I call you?/what is your name"

Except he receives a name.

God's response is no different the second time. " I am that I am" in other words . bugger off.

Wow. You are probably the only person in the world who has this opinion. The meaning of the Holy Name is very important. And it's not just "I am what I am", but "I shall be what I shall be", this is the basic meaning of the Tetragrammaton in another grammar form. Please present a single source that agrees with your interpretation or admit this is your own unique view.

I have never heard of Karen Armstrong ..

Where did you get your facts? Wikipedia? Which sources on the page?

Enlil and El are one in the same. The etymology of the word comes from El .. Obviously.

So obviously, just like how Zeus and Zhu-pater are from the same Sanskrit word right? Got a link that Enlil and El are the same?

I have a good familiarity with the words of Jesus and have never heard of Armstrong. Clearly you are not familiar with Scholarship.

I am. Please present which scholars you are using.

You have no clue what you are talking about. El is the name of the Creator God of the Canaanites and this God is the same as the Ancient God of the Sumerians "Enlil"

Once again, we have another "Nuh uh". There's no proof that El was the name as opposed to the Title, like "THE God".

I made no such claim of exclusivity. The etymology of the word goes back to El .

We don't know that. We don't know if El means a name or a title. To say one way or another with certainty would be dishonest at the least.

Meaning .. the word for God comes from El. This does not mean that the word Elohim refers exclusively to El.

We don't even know if Elohim comes from the name El as opposed to a universal word title for god, or "The god" as in the articulated chief god.

You assumed wrong. .. here is some good reading material for you to start with.
http://www.jhsonline.org/Articles/article_144.pdf

http://dspace.utlib.ee/dspace/bitst...d=DE641F981BDA06F6C643DC502181A965?sequence=1

I'll take a look. Pehraps you'd like to quote anything which supports your claims as if they are matter of fact.

The above is a 200 page dissertation .. on Page 33 you can read about Enlil (il-ilu)
as being referred to as God of Gods

The concept of "God of gods" therefore proves that it's a title and not a name.

You obviously have no clue what you are talking about. That Asherah was El's consort and Baal was his son is not debated.

Okay, so no need to back your claim. Doesn't need to be debated. Typical reaction.

Judaism Meets Zoroastrianism

The above link gives a general summary (unlike the Journal and thesis articles give you previously)

A general summary of an opinion which is disputed.

It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out the influence of Zoroastrianism on Judaism. Zoroastrianism was the monotheistic religion of the Persians.

It does not take a rocket scientist to know that Judaism may have possibly existed before Zoroastrianism, especially when we have references to Israel in 1200 B.C., we have no idea what they believed. Can you kindly admit that all your bold assertions are in fact merely specualative that are not necessarily bolstered by evidence and is all theory?

Isaiah even claims that the King of Persia was "Annointed by God"

\

Relevance? He was the deliverer. Does this mean that Zoroastrianism influenced Judaism? Maybe Judaism influenced Persia instead? How do we know either way? Because you said so? Or is it "not debated"?

Judaism was Polytheistic (according to the Bible) until the Persians.

Henotheistic. I am Henotheistic as well. We see that god is called "god of the gods" in David. Long before the Persians.

The Israelites attributed their downfall to having many Gods ..

Indeed, the Israelites went idolatrous quite often. This is often confused with the idea that they were ALL polytheistic.

Obviously if the Jews thought that the Persians were blessed by God then their "monotheism" must be right.

How do we know that the Zoroastrianism of later years was the same as around the time of Judaism? How was it even that different?

I have no idea whether or not "Elohim" applied to the Devil.

Well it obviously applies to angels, and the devil is called "The god of this age".

You have given zero support for your claim that Elohim refers to Angels.

Psalm 8:5 in the Septuagint, Hosea 12:1. Thanks for playing.

Mesopotamia knew of El as the creator God ..

Right, and "El" is often used for the Israelite god. This does not mean it's his name as opposed to his title.

Start reading the material I gave you .. there is lots more so get ready. You are going to have to learn some history.

Try reading Septuagint version of Psalm 8:5.

When I am finished it is you that will be having fits of cognitive dissonance.

We'll see about that. But as the reader can see, your view is totally based on total speculation.

Do you even have a clue cogintive dissonance theory is about because you have not really made a coherent statement in relation to cognitive dissonance theory.

CD is when you hold on to one view while holding another view.

I can't help but notice you ignored my thing about why you call yourself "Christian" when you deny the very texts that Jesus refers to. Interesting.

 

[Oryonder]

Did you ignore what I said that Hosea 12:1-2 confirms that it was an angel or did I not post that here?

That doesn't negate that Hosea 12:1-2 clearly states it was an Angel he wrestled with. As well, there's the issue of the Witch of Endor calling Samuel's Soul an "Angel".

Jacob thought at first he was wrestling with a man .. he says something different later.

So Jacob called the place Peniel, saying, "It is because I saw God face to face, and yet my life was spared."

Even if Hosea is talking about Jacob's wrestling match (it is certainly not clear from the passage that he is .. you need to support your claim better) .. this is not what Jacob says.

Wow. You are probably the only person in the world who has this opinion. The meaning of the Holy Name is very important. And it's not just "I am what I am", but "I shall be what I shall be", this is the basic meaning of the Tetragrammaton in another grammar form. Please present a single source that agrees with your interpretation or admit this is your own unique view.

Humor .. the meaning of God's response to Moses is one of the most debated topics in the Bible.

Where did you get your facts? Wikipedia? Which sources on the page?
So obviously, just like how Zeus and Zhu-pater are from the same Sanskrit word right? Got a link that Enlil and El are the same?

Wiki is ok sometimes and not others. When the content is references well it can be ok. Since I have not given you any Wiki links .. why do you keep bringing it up.

If you are not going to read the links I gave you then quit asking for them.

El and the Elohim | Suite101.com

El could be seen as an aspect of Enlil, the Sumerian chief god. When spoken in Akkadian Enlil becomes Ellil. Furthermore in Akkadian Ellil is used to designate not only a particular deity but also to indicate any supreme god with the title “Ellil ili;” which literally means "Ellil of the gods" but infers "king of the gods." This connection is strengthened by Ellil’s association with the granting of divine kingship to mortals.


The myths name El as father to several notable deities including Hadad, Yam, and Yahweh. Hadad, the storm god, is often known simply as “The Lord” or “Baal” and his cult formed the basis for the later Greek god Adonis. One of the possible rivals of Baal was his brother Yahweh. Yahweh is usually understood with the Hebrew stem HWH as “He (the god) who is”. However, Yahweh can also be also be viewed in the context of a “son of god” with a G stem which would imply “He who is revealed (as God).”

There are numerous links where you can learn about El and Enlil. This was one of the first ones in the search "after Wiki of Course" which says the same thing and gives a reference


​

Once again, we have another "Nuh uh". There's no proof that El was the name as opposed to the Title, like "THE God".

Try reading the links I gave you to gain more clarity.

We don't know that. We don't know if El means a name or a title. To say one way or another with certainty would be dishonest at the least.
We don't even know if Elohim comes from the name El as opposed to a universal word title for god, or "The god" as in the articulated chief god.

Try reading the links I gave you

I'll take a look. Pehraps you'd like to quote anything which supports your claims as if they are matter of fact.

Yes .. please do take a look.

While YHWH is the speaker, who plays the role of prosecutor of the
gods and advocate of the exploited in vv 2–4, El is the speaker,
who plays the role of high judge in vv 6–8. It is El who appointed
the deities to his council (v 6), and it is he who finally condemns
them to death (v 7). Most important, it is El who calls upon
YHWH at the end of the Psalm to rule the world in place of the

gods

​

Page 7 ​

​

​

​

under the heading.​

SCHOLARLY PRECONCEPTION OF THE SILENCE OF EL

From the link I gave you previously from the Journal of Hebrew Scriptures.
http://www.jhsonline.org/Articles/article_144.pdf

It is quite irritating that I give you such Journal articles and yet you continue to make up stories about wiki sources.

Does this mean that Zoroastrianism influenced Judaism? Maybe Judaism influenced Persia instead? How do we know either way? Because you said so? Or is it "not debated"?

ROFL - Yeah .. I can see the Persians .. at the height of their power saying .. Here is a worthless bunch of people who's God has abandoned them and left them destitude ..Lets adopt that religion.

Henotheistic. I am Henotheistic as well. We see that god is called "god of the gods" in David. Long before the Persians.
Indeed, the Israelites went idolatrous quite often. This is often confused with the idea that they were ALL polytheistic.

I am just going from what the Bible says. Elijah describes the situation pretty clearly as given to you before but this is just one of numerous Biblical references of a similar nature.

I never claimed that they were "All" polytheistic .. but according to the Bible most of them were.

Yahweh was long forgotten for the most part until Persian times when the Jews, following Persian monotheism, decided to make Yahweh their "one God". This new theology no doubt had an impact on the Bible editors at the time.

I can't help but notice you ignored my thing about why you call yourself "Christian" when you deny the very texts that Jesus refers to. Interesting

I believe in much of the message of Christ but also realize that the Bible is not infallable and is a book written by man.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Is the Devil just a fallen angel or is the Devil a God albeit perhaps a lesser one ?

Or, could the Devil be God?