Is the Qur'an an Inferior Copy of the Bible?

[Sha'irullah]

The Aeneid's better than all of them.

Pfft, Dude please I am here smoking a cigarette while wearing sunglasses for no reason. A cool chap like myself knows what good literature is

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Pfft, Dude please I am here smoking a cigarette while wearing sunglasses for no reason. A cool chap like myself knows what good literature is

Well, you've also got crooked ears and tiny eyebrows, so there's that.

 

[Muffled]

I don't believe the Qu'ran is a copy of anything.

I do believe the Bible is better because it contains the Gospel of Jesus.

 

[Aamer]

I don't believe the Qu'ran is a copy of anything.

I do believe the Bible is better because it contains the Gospel of Jesus.

Actually it doesn't. It contains the gospels of Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. Oh and they weren't the actual authors either unless they lived to be about 120-150 years old. Of course there was also the Q Document but that no longer exists. So while there is truth and wisdom in the New Testament, it's not the word of God or even Jesus.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Quran is not a copy of Bible. Bible was a Book revealed for the dispensation of Christianity and Quran was revealed for the dispensation of Islam.
In essence they both teach same spiritual Laws. The difference is that Quran has certain Laws know as Shariah which was revealed according to the Requirements of the Age it had come for.

 

[Sha'irullah]

Quran is not a copy of Bible. Bible was a Book revealed for the dispensation of Christianity and Quran was revealed for the dispensation of Islam.
In essence they both teach same spiritual Laws. The difference is that Quran has certain Laws know as Shariah which was revealed according to the Requirements of the Age it had come for.

But Islam is the perfection of Christianity and the perfection of Monotheism(Tawhid).

 

[Juhurka]

One sentence into reading it all became very predictable, couldn't read any further, got bored, not a fan of replacement theology. The OP is weak and no facts.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

But Islam is the perfection of Christianity and the perfection of Monotheism(Tawhid).

I have to disagree. Islam is not..... Islam WAS......the renewal of the teachings of christ in a sense that it corrected misinterpretations of bible.

 

[Sha'irullah]

I have to disagree. Islam is not..... Islam WAS......the renewal of the teachings of christ in a sense that it corrected misinterpretations of bible.

Why would you say "was"? Islam IS the perfection of monotheism and the continuation of Judaism and the fix for Christianity

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Why would you say "was"? Islam IS the perfection of monotheism and the continuation of Judaism and the fix for Christianity

Well, depends what you mean by Islam.
This word can be understood in different ways.
In one sense it is the Revelation that came to Muhammad. According to Shias this revelation continued till year 260 when the last Imam of Shia left.

In another sense, Islam is a reference to the world of Islam today, that is the worldwide Muslim community. In this sense, there are many school of thoughts or sects in Islamic world today.

Yet, in another sense there is the political Islam, as you see today.

So, when you say Islam IS the perfection of monotheism and the continuation of Judaism and the fix for Christianity, in which sense are you talking about?

 

[Sha'irullah]

Well, depends what you mean by Islam.
This word can be understood in different ways.
In one sense it is the Revelation that came to Muhammad. According to Shias this revelation continued till year 260 when the last Imam of Shia left.

In another sense, Islam is a reference to the world of Islam today, that is the worldwide Muslim community. In this sense, there are many school of thoughts or sects in Islamic world today.

Yet, in another sense there is the political Islam, as you see today.

So, when you say Islam IS the perfection of monotheism and the continuation of Judaism and the fix for Christianity, in which sense are you talking about?

When I say Islam I only mean the Islam mentioned in the Qur'an. The theology taught by the Qur'an and the Qur'an alone.

 

[Monotheist 101]

I couldn't have said it better myself. What these ignorant Hadithers fail to recognize is that they won't be able to hide behind their scholars on the day of judgment. The reason they are so arrogant is because they don't truly believe in the day of judgment. When you die.. Poof! You're gone! Before you realize what happened, you'll be awakened from your sleep and BAM! Day of judgment! That will be the "Oh ****!" moment for all of them. And I don't envy the panic they feel at that moment. May God make that day easy for us monotheists! God bless!

While I agree with not following someone blindly...should I acknowledge someone who is better learnt than I and give them credit if I logically agree with them..or is that also considered following the clergy blindly? I understand that alot of people donot find the Hadith helpful, but I honestly have, I dont consider it hiding behind the scholars or traditions..given alot do, but a Quran alone stance isn't logical, the same people who transmitted the Hadith transmitted the Quran down the generations..or did Allah reveal it to you in person? I dont find logic of disregarding the same chains of transmission..why do you only accept the Quran as being honestly transmitted down the generations in your opinion do you think the "clergy" would transmit the Quran honestly and lie about the Hadith.. I donot know why you are so anti-hadith, most of it goes hand in hand with the Quran..and you are also wrong in telling people that Hadith collection started 300 years after the prophets death, those are the most detailed compilations like Bukhari etc.. There have been instances were manuscipts of hadith dating back to the 1st century where discovered/excavated (google).

I am not a blind follower of the Hadith but I fail to see the logic in disregarding all of it..how can I ignore the obvious good that resonates with Quranic teachings..using the same logic you should also discredit the Quran due to unfaithful "clergy"..

P.S Why call them ignorant Hadithers...as if they are ALL in the same boat..that to me is an ignorant approach looking at it from here..

 

[InvestigateTruth]

When I say Islam I only mean the Islam mentioned in the Qur'an. The theology taught by the Qur'an and the Qur'an alone.

And when you say Christianity, in what sense you are talking about?
Are you talking about the worldwide Christian community? or do you mean the Teachings of Christ as written in New Testament?

 

[Sha'irullah]

While I agree with not following someone blindly...should I acknowledge someone who is better learnt than I and give them credit if I logically agree with them..or is that also considered following the clergy blindly? I understand that alot of people donot find the Hadith helpful, but I honestly have, I dont consider it hiding behind the scholars or traditions..given alot do, but a Quran alone stance isn't logical, the same people who transmitted the Hadith transmitted the Quran down the generations..or did Allah reveal it to you in person? I dont find logic of disregarding the same chains of transmission..why do you only accept the Quran as being honestly transmitted down the generations in your opinion do you think the "clergy" would transmit the Quran honestly and lie about the Hadith.. I donot know why you are so anti-hadith, most of it goes hand in hand with the Quran..and you are also wrong in telling people that Hadith collection started 300 years after the prophets death, those are the most detailed compilations like Bukhari etc.. There have been instances were manuscipts of hadith dating back to the 1st century where discovered/excavated (google).

I am not a blind follower of the Hadith but I fail to see the logic in disregarding all of it..how can I ignore the obvious good that resonates with Quranic teachings..using the same logic you should also discredit the Quran due to unfaithful "clergy"..

P.S Why call them ignorant Hadithers...as if they are ALL in the same boat..that to me is an ignorant approach looking at it from here..

This primarily stems from the fact that most Qur'anists find it untrue that Muhammad did not write the Qur'an

 

[Monotheist 101]

This primarily stems from the fact that most Qur'anists find it untrue that Muhammad did not write the Qur'an

Then I am afraid most Quranists donot agree with the Quran..

Sahih International-
Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel, who enjoins upon them what is right and forbids them what is wrong and makes lawful for them the good things and prohibits for them the evil and relieves them of their burden and the shackles which were upon them. So they who have believed in him, honored him, supported him and followed the light which was sent down with him - it is those who will be the successful.
- Quran 7.157

 

[Sha'irullah]

Then I am afraid most Quranists donot agree with the Quran..

Sahih International-
Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel, who enjoins upon them what is right and forbids them what is wrong and makes lawful for them the good things and prohibits for them the evil and relieves them of their burden and the shackles which were upon them. So they who have believed in him, honored him, supported him and followed the light which was sent down with him - it is those who will be the successful.
- Quran 7.157

REALLY poor translation. I will explain it letter but that ayat is off

REALLY REALLY off

 

[Monotheist 101]

"if had been written by man, you would have found many discrepancies therein". (Qur'an 4:82)

 

[Monotheist 101]

REALLY poor translation. I will explain it letter but that ayat is off

REALLY REALLY off

I have come across different translations of the word Ummi..

can you recommend a better translation?

 

[Sha'irullah]

"if had been written by man, you would have found many discrepancies therein". (Qur'an 4:82)

:biglaugh: You are aware the verse you stated only refers to authorship outside of Muhammad right? You are contradicting yourself with those verses. I know the Arabic words a tad bit better then you perhaps but I at least understand their relevancy which gives me enough insight to say that verse is being entirely misused.

 

[Sha'irullah]

I have come across different translations of the word Ummi..

can you recommend a better translation?

Look in Suwar al-Baqarah and Imran. The word ummi is actually quite clear in other contexts. Essentially it is best explained as gentile unless you belief in the Hanif lineage