ISIS is repeating what Mohammed did a 1400 years back.

[morphesium]

Isis is slaughtering and torturing Yazdies for their religious beliefs. Every other religions are their targets.
Mohammed too did the same -mercilessly butchered other then existing peaceful and more morally developed civilizations. Raped even kids. Many islamic countries say Isis is not muslim - but for me it is like saying "Prophet Mohammed" is not islamic.

Freedom of thought is suppreseed under islamic rules with a thousand restrictions and uncivilized and barbaric punishments.

Today i doubt - Did islam truly had a golden age? or did it stole the science and technology and arts from other civilizations and marketed as theirs?

If in the future and if their strategy works and the world is ultimately populated with muslims alone and a few hundred years after they achieve this "feat" - when things are as civilized as 400 AD, they would be claiming that they sent a man to the moon back in 1969.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Many Muslim countries had a golden age, but 'Islam' did not. Also Islam does not steal science and technology, because its a religion not a country.

Is ISIS Muslim? I suppose that it is a Muslim cult or denomination much like Lutherans are a cult or a denomination of Christians. In their formative period Lutherans were very violent, too. The ISIS group is a lot like a doomsday cult in some ways, but in other ways its a lot like a group of pirates. I think they have a ridiculous belief that they are going to fulfil some prophecy or other but that among them are unbelievers who are just plain cut-throats, and they have very little chance of fulfilling anything. When they realize failure (as I personally think they must) I am not sure what direction they will take, whether there will be a crisis of faith or a transition or what. There are a lot of ways that it could end, but it could simply transition into another state with the usual instability and tensions keeping person X or Y in power.

 

[RAYYAN]

OP
Your whole post is based on ignorance about Islam, and clearly, your information is sourced by the media.
can you show your evidence on Mohammed killing innocents?

 

[icehorse]

OP
Your whole post is based on ignorance about Islam, and clearly, your information is sourced by the media.
can you show your evidence on Mohammed killing innocents?

The Hadith?

 

[RAYYAN]

can you Quote that Hadith?

 

[icehorse]

can you Quote that Hadith?

I can, but experience tells me it would be a waste of time. You would undoubtedly say some combination of:

- "oh, you're quoting a "weak" Hadith" - or -
- "oh, you're taking that Hadith out of context" - or -
- "oh, you misinterpreted those actions or sayings"

In other words, I will end up debating your personal interpretations as opposed to letting the words speak for themselves.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Today i doubt - Did islam truly had a golden age? or did it stole the science and technology and arts from other civilizations and marketed as theirs?

Yeah. They actually did come up with many advances and technologies that we enjoy today. Instead of killing each other like Christian Europe was, the Islamic Ottoman Empire was busy advancing our medical knowledge and inventing things like the toothbrush.

In other words, I will end up debating your personal interpretations as opposed to letting the words speak for themselves.

Sometimes words don't speak for themselves. Such approaches drive things such as the controversies of heavy metal. No one in Slipknot really wants to "slit your throat and **** the wound," and they do not condone their fans doing so, thus you have to look deeper. The Quran isn't perfect, but often times when someone quotes a passage of violence it is a passage of self defense. It's why you have to take in the whole to better understand the parts.

 

[psychoslice]

I don't know if they are repeating what Mahmud did or not, but they certainly are backward in their thinking, just because their life is miserable they try to drag the rest of the world don't to their miserable level, and that goes for any religion, that sticks their nose into other peoples lives.

 

[RAYYAN]

I can, but experience tells me it would be a waste of time. You would undoubtedly say some combination of:

- "oh, you're quoting a "weak" Hadith" - or -
- "oh, you're taking that Hadith out of context" - or -
- "oh, you misinterpreted those actions or sayings"

In other words, I will end up debating your personal interpretations as opposed to letting the words speak for themselves.

so why mention it if you are not brave enough to show where your information is coming from!
anyway, it is also waste of time addressing you.

Good day Sir.

 

[icehorse]

so why mention it if you are not brave enough to show where your information is coming from!
anyway, it is also waste of time addressing you.

Good day Sir.

Okay, let's try one and see how it goes: Explain why Muhammad beheaded ~800 Qurayza men and young boys and took their women as sex slaves. And explain why ISIS's actions don't closely mirror those of Muhammad?

Next, explain Surah 8:12, which in the extremely popular translation I read says: "...so strike them over the necks, and smite over all of their fingers and toes."

 

[RAYYAN]

Okay, let's try one and see how it goes:

Stop this childish attitude and man up

Explain why Muhammad beheaded ~800 Qurayza men and young boys and took their women as sex slaves.

This is taken from "Sirah and Maghazi" book which is written 200 years after the death of the Prophet PBUH, what We have in the Quran Chapter 33 is, He killed some and let some go....etc. without mentioning the number. saying 800 were killed is a lie, We know this happened after the battle of the trench, after the Muslims were tired digging the trench after that their battle with the enemy. after all these, they go to the trouble of killing 800 Jews!

even if We assume it happened, where are they buried? the logical thing to do is burry then in the trench that was dug already, but the report says, they were buried in the market place...... can you see the countless conflicts in the story? not to mention that the source is not reliable?

And explain why ISIS's actions don't closely mirror those of Muhammad?

Because Mohammed didn't kill any innocent person?

explain Surah 8:12, which in the extremely popular translation I read says: "...so strike them over the necks, and smite over all of their fingers and toes."

.
Did you disregard the the first part of the verse for a reason? or you are just hiding it so the reader will not see your ignorance? I will post the complete verse:

"[Remember] when your Lord inspired to the angels, "I am with you, so strengthen those who have believed. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved, so strike [them] upon the necks and strike from them every fingertip"

I highlighted what you are missing. in this verse God is talking to the angels, He is addressing the angels who were fighting along side of Muslims in the Battle of Bader and ordering them to kill the enemy of the Muslims in the battle field. This has nothing to do with Mohamed, it is an order to the angels.

 

[kalyan]

i kind of agree with the OP, there are numerous verses in hadith that point out the violence of muhammad . Islam is a recent religion and ordering others to kill those who are not moslems is barbaric to say the least and is that not what ISIS is doing now ?

 

[icehorse]

Hey RAYYAN,

The version of the Quran that I read is extremely popular around the world - as I understand it, this translation has been reprinted over 260 million times. In my translation, it is ambiguous whether or not this command was directed ONLY at angels, or whether it was intended for Muslims as well.

Please stop with the insults.

 

[dust1n]

Muhammad certainly killed innocent people (indirectly, at least), unless political dissent is just assumed to be a guilty action in any and all cases. I don't imagine writing poetry qualifies as being guilty enough to merit assassination.

That being said, to pretend like there is any connection between the founding of Islam, and ISIS, is trolling at best...

 

[Augustus]

instead of killing each other like Christian Europe was, the Islamic Ottoman Empire was busy advancing our medical knowledge and inventing things like the toothbrush.

Ottomans were much later. Golden age relates to the Abbasid Caliphate.

Muhammad certainly killed innocent people (indirectly, at least), unless political dissent is just assumed to be a guilty action in any and all cases. I don't imagine writing poetry qualifies as being guilty enough to merit assassi

Saying anything about Muhammad with certainty, other than he was a real leader, is problematic.

The sirah is a much later creation, thus such stories are of dubious historicity.

That being said, to pretend like there is any connection between the founding of Islam, and ISIS, is trolling at best...

They certainly think they are recreating his actions.

This is why it is important to look at the history of what actually happened, not what is traditionally assumed by both Muslims and non Muslims.

 

[icehorse]

Muhammad certainly killed innocent people (indirectly, at least), unless political dissent is just assumed to be a guilty action in any and all cases. I don't imagine writing poetry qualifies as being guilty enough to merit assassination.

That being said, to pretend like there is any connection between the founding of Islam, and ISIS, is trolling at best...

The contention is that ISIS is using Islamic scripture as a war manual.

 

[icehorse]

Ottomans were much later. Golden age relates to the Abbasid Caliphate.

Saying anything about Muhammad with certainty, other than he was a real leader, is problematic.

The sirah is a much later creation, thus such stories are of dubious historicity.

They certainly think they are recreating his actions.

This is why it is important to look at the history of what actually happened, not what is traditionally assumed by both Muslims and non Muslims.

I disagree. What's important is to be honest about how people are currently converting what they believe into actions.

 

[dust1n]

The contention is that ISIS is using Islamic scripture as a war manual.

As opposed to a war manual?

 

[icehorse]

As opposed to a war manual?

??

 

[dust1n]

Saying anything about Muhammad with certainty, other than he was a real leader, is problematic.

The sirah is a much later creation, thus such stories are of dubious historicity.

Well, that's true, but certainty is tricky. Why would I think the three independent sources of penned by Muslim scholars, including the earliest known biography of Muhammad, all have some reason to misrepresent the killing of poets who opposed Muhammad? There's more historical evidence to suggest that Abu 'Afak was killed at the wishes of Muhammad then there is that Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist... Unless there is some source I'm unaware of (probably the case).

They certainly think they are recreating his actions.

Seems weird, since Muhammad never took over apart of the world that ISIS is currently engaged in.

This is why it is important to look at the history of what actually happened, not what is traditionally assumed by both Muslims and non Muslims.

Yes, yes it is. Or else your apt to look silly like myself.