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Islam’s teaching on response to abuse and mockery

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
This?

"Show patience under provocation, disregard abuse and politely turn away from abusers. Violence not allowed."

"According to the religion of Islam, Muslims can only respond to verbal abuse, mockery and lampooning of their faith and its sacred figures in the following forms.
1. Any criticism of Islam, or allegations against it, which underlie the abuse must be refuted and answered by means of words and speech.
2. Apart from answering specific criticism, all possible efforts must be made to present the true and accurate picture of Islam in general. With more enlightenment and less ignorance prevailing about Islam and its Holy Prophet Muhammad, the instances of abuse, vituperation and mockery will decrease.
3. As regards the offence or hurt that Muslims naturally feel as a result of such abuse, they are taught to respond by:
a) bearing the provocation with resolute patience,
b) ignoring the abuse,
c) separating themselves temporarily from the company of the abusers while the abuse continues,
d) exercising forgiveness in view of the ignorance of the abusers." -
http://ahmadiyya.org/islam/abuse.pdf

or this?

"Undoubtedly, the States politicians who turn a blind eye to those who mock the prophets are not censure in isolation because Allah s.w.t authorizes the destruction of the cities and villages where they mock the prophet peace be upon him. We can see the darkest injustice is abusing and mocking the Prophet peace be upon him, it violates the divine and it runs counter of rules and systems." - http://en.islamway.net/article/8328...phet-peace-and-blessings-of-allah-be-upon-him

"The Qur'an says that Allah curses the one who harms the Prophet in this world and He connected harm of Himself to harm of the Prophet. There is no dispute that anyone who curses Allah is killed and that his curse demands that he be categorised as an unbeliever. The judgement of the unbeliever is that he is killed." - http://www.masud.co.uk/ISLAM/misc/alshifa/pt4ch1sec2.htm

 
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leibowde84

Veteran Member
This?

"Show patience under provocation, disregard abuse and politely turn away from abusers. Violence not allowed." - http://ahmadiyya.org/islam/abuse.pdf

or this?

"Undoubtedly, the States politicians who turn a blind eye to those who mock the prophets are not censure in isolation because Allah s.w.t authorizes the destruction of the cities and villages where they mock the prophet peace be upon him. We can see the darkest injustice is abusing and mocking the Prophet peace be upon him, it violates the divine and it runs counter of rules and systems." - http://en.islamway.net/article/8328...phet-peace-and-blessings-of-allah-be-upon-him
I would say that anyone who agrees with the second stance is borderline insane.
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
I would say that anyone who agrees with the second stance is borderline insane.
Way to go on insulting a rather large portion of the Muslim world. :)


Option 1 is taken from the Ahmahdiyya Muslim community and frankly virtually no Sunni or Shia "scholars" would even think to quote an Ahmahdiyya "scholar".
So, at best, their ideas are marginal.

Options 2 and 3 are very extreme, but still valid, though I'd like to think the vast majority of Muslims are somewhere between the two obvious camps.
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
Way to go on insulting a rather large portion of the Muslim world. :)


Option 1 is taken from the Ahmahdiyya Muslim community and frankly virtually no Sunni or Shia "scholars" would even think to quote an Ahmahdiyya "scholar".
So, at best, their ideas are marginal.

Options 2 and 3 are very extreme, but still valid, though I'd like to think the vast majority of Muslims are somewhere between the two obvious camps.
Anyone who thinks that violence is an appropriat response to ridicule of a historical figure is insane, holding a very warped view of our global society. How can you defend people who are willing to use violence in reaction to ridicule of any kind, especially a historical figure?
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
Anyone who thinks that violence is an appropriat response to ridicule of a historical figure is insane, holding a very warped view of our global society. How can you defend people who are willing to use violence in reaction to ridicule of any kind, especially a historical figure?
I don't believe I was defending anything. I was pointing out that, as a rule, the Muslim world doesn't give a damn about the Ahmahdiyya perspective on... anything...
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
I don't believe I was defending anything. I was pointing out that, as a rule, the Muslim world doesn't give a damn about the Ahmahdiyya perspective on... anything...
And, imho, that is an unreasonable and insane position to hold.
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
And, imho, that is an unreasonable and insane position to hold.
So, you are good insulting a huge amount of people for one of their most cherished beliefs... about their prophet...

In Muslim majority counties, it would be extremely bad judgment to slander or mock Muhammad. Neither would likely go over too well with the locals.
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
I don't believe I was defending anything. I was pointing out that, as a rule, the Muslim world doesn't give a damn about the Ahmahdiyya perspective on... anything...
It is also pretty much a threat to the well-being of the rest of the world. Obviously, ridicule is part of human existence. The more people complain, the more it will come. That is unavoidable. Thus, the second option in the OP is extremely destructive and dangerous to the rest of the world.
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
It is also pretty much a threat to the well-being of the rest of the world. Obviously, ridicule is part of human existence. The more people complain, the more it will come. That is unavoidable. Thus, the second option in the OP is extremely destructive and dangerous to the rest of the world.
Welcome to the seamy underbelly of Islam, my friend. :)
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
So, you are good insulting a huge amount of people for one of their most cherished beliefs... about their prophet...

In Muslim majority counties, it would be extremely bad judgment to slander or mock Muhammad. Neither would likely go over too well with the locals.
I am ONLY ok with ridiculing those who think they should teach their children that violence is an appropriate recourse to mere words and/or images. It is an immature, destructive, and pathetic ideal, and I have no problem poiting that out.

I think it is very sad that people are not free to express themselves in the Muslim countries you referred to.
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
I think it is very sad that people are not free to express themselves in the Muslim countries you referred to.
Then again we have Imam Barack Obama's message to the UN in 2012:

The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam. But to be credible, those who condemn that slander must also condemn the hate we see in the images of Jesus Christ that are desecrated, or churches that are destroyed, or the Holocaust that is denied.

Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/obamafuture.asp#tylEWAsJQ1ZkhhbT.99


Looks like Muslims aren't the only ones who want to stop mockery of historical figures.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
Way to go on insulting a rather large portion of the Muslim world. :)


Option 1 is taken from the Ahmahdiyya Muslim community and frankly virtually no Sunni or Shia "scholars" would even think to quote an Ahmahdiyya "scholar".
So, at best, their ideas are marginal.

Options 2 and 3 are very extreme, but still valid, though I'd like to think the vast majority of Muslims are somewhere between the two obvious camps.

Well shows my ignorance. I thought maybe it was a difference between the Shia and Sunni, didn't know there was a third branch. I was was about to ask that question.

The 2 and 3 views seem to come more from the Hadiths than the Quran. The Hadiths are also the source for Sharia law?

There is also the Ibadi and the Quranists. The Quranists reject all Hadiths. So one is likely to get very different responses to questions depending on which group one is dealing with.
 

Servant_of_the_One1

Well-Known Member
Anyone who insults islam or prophet Muhammad pbuh within muslim country deserves execution or exile by the state. But i think execution is closer to the truth. Exile is not bad choice either.
 

jeager106

Learning more about Jehovah.
Premium Member
 

Servant_of_the_One1

Well-Known Member
Which sect of Islam do you represent?


I dont represent sunni, salafi, shia or sufi.

I call myself muslim.



So you'd be happy with a Muslim being executed in a Christian country if s/he slandered a Christian historical figure?

I doubt a muslim would insult christian historical figures. In islam its not allowed to insult holy ones of religions. This is why u dont see me badmouthing hindu dieties etc.
 

Looncall

Well-Known Member
I dont represent sunni, salafi, shia or sufi.

I call myself muslim.





I doubt a muslim would insult christian historical figures. In islam its not allowed to insult holy ones of religions. This is why u dont see me badmouthing hindu dieties etc.
Please answer the question.
 
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