Islam and Being Homosexual

[Jimmy]

Weird nobody on this website knows the truth if gay people are being executed by governments or local law enforcement in the world. I guess everybody would know that it's happening by terrorists but when it comes to governments doing it nobody seems to know the truth.
That's odd considering there's a lot of intelligent people here.

 

[eik]

So how is the religion of peace compatible with 21th century liberal values?

Why should Islam be compatible with 21th century liberal values? Won't 21st century liberals all go to Jahannam (i.e. Islamic hell)?

Actually the Islamic hell was "borrowed" from the Christian hell, just as other Islamic ideas came originally from Christianity.

 

[eik]

Weird nobody on this website knows the truth if gay people are being executed by governments in the world. I guess everybody would know that it's happening by terrorists but when it comes to governments doing it nobody seems to know the truth.
That's odd considering there's a lot of intelligent people here.

If they're not doing it, it's generally because they prefer the riches that come with the world trade in oil etc to the purity of their Islamic "faith."

Showing off in their supercars in London in summer is more conducive to muslim felicity than executing homosexuals back home (unless you're in some central african islamic republic like Mali where they don't go in for fast cars but only pick up trucks with machine guns).

 

[danieldemol]

any evidence to support that understanding?

‘It is necessary to note that ISIS’ ideology is not different from the ideology of any Jihadi Salafi or Awakening organization. A quick return to the doctrinal teachings on ISIS’ websites will reveal the ideological identity of the group. Needless to say, the writings of Mohammed bin Abdel Wahhab such as The Book of the Unity of God, Clarification of the Doubts, Nullifiers of Islam and others are distributed in the areas under ISIS’ control and are taught and explained in private religious classes that the organization’s educational department holds.’

Read more here: Why ISIS is a threat to Saudi Arabia: Wahhabism’s deferred promise

As you are surely aware Wahhabism is a Sunni sect, not a Shia sect

 

[Piculet]

‘It is necessary to note that ISIS’ ideology is not different from the ideology of any Jihadi Salafi or Awakening organization. A quick return to the doctrinal teachings on ISIS’ websites will reveal the ideological identity of the group. Needless to say, the writings of Mohammed bin Abdel Wahhab such as The Book of the Unity of God, Clarification of the Doubts, Nullifiers of Islam and others are distributed in the areas under ISIS’ control and are taught and explained in private religious classes that the organization’s educational department holds.’

Read more here: Why ISIS is a threat to Saudi Arabia: Wahhabism’s deferred promise

As you are surely aware Wahhabism is a Sunni sect, not a Shia sect

What is 'jihad Salafi'? Nothing. It's not a thing. My simple question is: what makes them similar? ISIS does so many things unlawful in Islam. It isn't logical to say they're the same. Unfortunately I don't have the patience to read your link as I'm quite certain it will not answer my question or teach me anything useful.

I'm aware there is no such a sect as 'wahabbism'.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

(I'm still waiting for the OP to give his reasoning, but that may never happen...) No, Islam has no such teaching that homosexuality in itself was either wrong or punishable.

Not being an Islamic scholar, I can't speak to your assertion. However, if what you say is true, is it not rather surprising that very nearly all nations that adhere to Islam also retain the harshest punishments for homosexuality?

 

[Piculet]

Weird nobody on this website knows the truth if gay people are being executed by governments in the world. I guess everybody would know that it's happening by terrorists but when it comes to governments doing it nobody seems to know the truth.
That's odd considering there's a lot of intelligent people here.

The governments that execute homosexuals for homosexual acts just don't happen to be the most trustworthy in the way they inform the world about what they do.

 

[Piculet]

Not being an Islamic scholar, I can't speak to your assertion. However, if what you say is true, is it not rather surprising that very nearly all nations that adhere to Islam also retain the harshest punishments for homosexuality?

I have not come upon verified information on that being a homosexual was punishable by the capital punishment by any government, but even if it was, I am certain it is not so according to Islam.

 

[danieldemol]

What is 'jihad Salafi'? Nothing. It's not a thing. My simple question is: what makes them similar? ISIS does so many things unlawful in Islam. It isn't logical to say they're the same. Unfortunately I don't have the patience to read your link as I'm quite certain it will not answer my question or teach me anything useful.

I'm aware there is no such a sect as 'wahabbism'.

They call themselves “Salafis” which is a hijacked term, and are known perjoratively as Wahhabis.

The things ISIS does may be unlawful according to your sect. All that does is highlight how contradictory and conflicting the warring sects of Islam are.

To deny that they are following their own interpretation of Islam would be to deny reality.

 

[Jimmy]

The governments that execute homosexuals for homosexual acts just don't happen to be the most trustworthy in the way they inform the world about what they do.

What about incarcerating gay people? Does anybody know anything about countries doing that or is that not knowing either?

 

[Tambourine]

Actually the Islamic hell was "borrowed" from the Christian hell, just as other Islamic ideas came originally from Christianity.

Just like Christian beliefs originated in Judaism, Neoplatonism, and Gnosticism. Religious beliefs generally do not win any originality contests, there is a reason why religions have spoken to so many people over thousands of years after all.

 

[danieldemol]

My simple question is: what makes them similar?

I’d argue that they are more similar than they are different. You could probably list the differences on one hand.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I have not come upon verified information on that being a homosexual was punishable by the capital punishment by any government, but even if it was, I am certain it is not so according to Islam.

I suspect, I have to confess it, that you are playing word games with me. Are you making a distinction between "being a homosexual" and "homosexual acts" without bothering to be open about it?

 

[Piculet]

I suspect, I have to confess it, that you are playing word games with me. Are you making a distinction between "being a homosexual" and "homosexual acts" without bothering to be open about it?

I am making a distinction and try to make it every time I refer to one or the other.

I’d argue that they are more similar than they are different. You could probably list the differences on one hand.

I haven't paid so much attention to ISIS I could name all the crimes they commit, but here's a few:

1. Rape
2. Violation of the rights of wives
3. Torture
4. Unlawful killing
5. Unlawful war
6. Unlawful enslavement

 

[Piculet]

What about incarcerating gay people? Does anybody know anything about countries doing that or is that not knowing either?

No country excuses crimes of gay people, that call for imprisonment.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I am making a distinction and try to make it every time I refer to one or the other.

Let's see if we can get a little clarity, then, shall we?

I am a homosexual. Have been since the first time I had my first understanding of myself. The same is true of my lover, with who I have been in a relationship for decades -- a relationship that includes the fact that we express our love for one another sexually.

Now...where does YOUR Islam come down on that? Try to duck a little less...we can talk openly here.

 

[Piculet]

Now...where does YOUR Islam come down on that? Try to duck a little less...we can talk openly here.

That's haram... I don't know what you want me to say.

 

[Piculet]

They call themselves “Salafis” which is a hijacked term,

Hijacked? It's a word that refers to the early followers of Islam. It makes no sense to claim that some who followed this one individual's ideas (the actual ones btw - not just anything someone said he said) was automatically a Salafi. You would have to define what makes them a Salafi.

The things ISIS does may be unlawful according to your sect

According to Islam.

To deny that they are following their own interpretation of Islam would be to deny reality.

That is denying that terrorism has more to do with social circumstance than with any specific ideology.

 

[Mike.Hester]

(I'm still waiting for the OP to give his reasoning, but that may never happen...) No, Islam has no such teaching that homosexuality in itself was either wrong or punishable.

I have annotated two sources where you can see for yourself. I think that any person suggesting that being homosexual is accepted by Islam, is disingenuous.

 

[mojtaba]

Indeed. They are publicly hanged on cranes.

This is not for all gays. It is for those who kidnap a male (specially , kids or youths) and rape him. It also depends on the judge's decision that it is nessecery or not ( I mean public execution).