It's Not About Belief

[uss_bigd]

That Christ=God=Love

I guess we meant the same thing then...

 

[lunamoth]

Was Jesus being counter-productive/love when He admonished sinners?

BTW, it seems he was admonishing them about what they do.

 

[Scott1]

That Christ=God=Love

Isnt the opinion that Christ=God most CERTAINLY one of those "specific details of belief" that cause people to tell others "they are not 'saved' if they don't believe a certain doctrine"?

Soooooo....... what gives?

 

[lunamoth]

I guess we meant the same thing then...

OK then!

 

[lunamoth]

Isnt the opinion that Christ=God most CERTAINLY one of those "specific details of belief" that cause people to tell others "they are not 'saved' if they don't believe a certain doctrine"?

Soooooo....... what gives?

What is the important thing about believing that Christ = God = Love? That you give this your intellectual assent, or that you live it?

Anyway, I think you already said that you agreed with the main point of my OP, that eternal life is not based upon giving intellectual assent to Christian dogma.

Most certainly.... but one does not be a Christian or know "the Way" to participate in God's work in the world or attain eternal life, wouldn't you say?

 

[lunamoth]

Time for this moth to go to bed now. Thank you for the exchange Scott. And ussbd.

In His Peace,
luna

 

[Scott1]

What is the important thing about believing that Christ = God = Love? That you give this your intellectual assent, or that you live it?

You are correct... and I stand by that quote you provided... but let me add that I believe it applies to NON-CHRISTIANS.

As for Christians, to those who have been given much, much is required.

Christians are held to a bit higher standard than those who have not embraced the Gospel... and intellectual assent is most certainly required for Christians... for example my still unanswered question to you:

What BELIEF could they deny that would cause Christ to deny them before the Father?

Thanks for the chat.

 

[lunamoth]

What BELIEF could they deny that would cause Christ to deny them before the Father?

What BELIEF did Jesus ask of his disciples?

6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7 If you really know me, you will know [b] my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him." 8 Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us."




9 Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? 10 Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, all who have faith in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.


15 "If you love me, keep my commands. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be [c] in you. 18 I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21 Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. Anyone who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them."

22 Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, "But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?" 23 Jesus replied, "Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24 Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me. (John 14)

What is His command? What is his teaching?

12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one's life for one's friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command. 15 I no longer call you servants, because servants do not know their master's business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you. 16 You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you so that you might go and bear fruit—fruit that will last—and so that whatever you ask in my name the Father will give you. 17 This is my command: Love each other.

 

[Wandered Off]

It's Not About Belief

This is a good thing, because if it were about belief, that could pose a problem... I'm not convinced we have as much control over our beliefs as we'd like to think, and I'd hate to be judged for something I can't effectively control.

 

[lunamoth]

This is a good thing, because if it were about belief, that could pose a problem... I'm not convinced we have as much control over our beliefs as we'd like to think, and I'd hate to be judged for something I can't effectively control.

Right, but you do have choice about your actions.

As far as I can discern, Jesus was saying that God is about loving one another. Love is an action, found in the choices we make each day. Love is not about belief, although our beliefs do shape our choices.

 

[Phasmid]

It's about what you do, following the Way.

What do you think?

34 "Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'

37 "Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?' 40 "The King will reply, 'Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.'

I think that's lifted my mood. It makes more sense that way. I know many good people who are atheists, but it doesn't stop them caring for other people. I'm sure if God's up there, then He understands that there are people who simply can't believe, but still uphold Christian values.

 

[Random]

I know many good people who are atheists, but it doesn't stop them caring for other people.

:biglaugh:

So...

Man, that reads totally wrong...

 

[Phasmid]

:biglaugh:

So...

Man, that reads totally wrong...

Don't read it again then... oh wait... I get it now

 

[lunamoth]

...and what does the Lord required of you
but to do justice, and to love kindness,
and to walk humbly with your God?

Micah 6