Salvation and renewal is something that has to be freely accepted and chosen.
No, Adam and Eve weren't naive. Much like Satan before them, they chose to rebel against God and usurp His authority.
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It's said Jesus' sacrificed himself to save us...
- Thread starter Mycroft
- Start date
No, Adam and Eve weren't naive. Much like Satan before them, they chose to rebel against God and usurp His authority.
Christian religion wants people to be Christ- like, but on the other hand they make sure you know Christ had an advantage because he was God and you aint. It doesn't make sense and its just a money making Guilt Trip.
Thank you, I appreciate that some do commemorate Jesus' sacrifice with reverence, without the trappings that the world likes to add to what have become very 'commercial, occasions.
Easter is however, a four day holiday. Each of the days have their own religious significance and some even add the preceding period they call "Lent" or the preceding Wednesday and Thursday to the mix. This is not what Jesus told us to do.
Going "beyond what is written" has always been a trap for humans. They tend to have the attitude that "if a little is good, a lot must be better".....but often that just leads to the introduction of human ideas that do not belong. And if the churches themselves do not stop the rot before it takes hold, then you end up with something that is so far removed from the original, that it is no longer acceptable to the one who commanded it.
What you say about Easter is true, in that many do celebrate it differently. I can't say I agree with the strength of your convictions. Many do celebrate Easter as it should be. People like my mom and her family. If they find solace in that and truth, I guess I don't understand why it would be a problem for anyone. I believe that we are each here to walk our own path. I am not wise enough nor vain enough to think I can know what anyone else should do with their lives. If you tell me you are an atheist, a satanist, a buddhist, a Jew, etc, I respect and honor your path. It would not be mine nor is there any reason for it to be mine. And finally, if someone else's choice in a religion, or lack thereof, bothers someone, I would suggest that person look at why it bothers them. Does it effect them in some way or are they simply so unsure in their own path that anyone not following that path makes them wonder what is wrong.
JayJayDee
Avid JW Bible Student
Well, I guess it bothers me when people are travelling down a road that I believe leads to disaster.
If I am a Christian, and I read in the Bible that those who do not worship God in the way he tells us to, will not inherit his kingdom, I am faced with a dilemma. There I am sitting on my front porch reading my Bible, cars whizzing by, knowing full well that the bridge is out just around a blind corner. Should I just sit there reading my Bible feeling sorry for them, or should I be down on that road waving my arms like a mad person?
If I am commanded by Jesus to point people in the right direction and I don't do it, God will hold me accountable.
God's instruction to his prophet Ezekiel is interesting....
"17 “Son of man, a watchman is what I have made you to the house of Israel, and you must hear from my mouth speech and you must warn them from me. 18 When I say to someone wicked, ‘You will positively die,' and you do not actually warn him and speak in order to warn the wicked one from his wicked way to preserve him alive, he being wicked, in his error he will die, but his blood I shall ask back from your own hand.19 But as for you, in case you have warned someone wicked and he does not actually turn back from his wickedness and from his wicked way, he himself for his error will die; but as for you, you will have delivered your own soul. 20 And when someone righteous turns back from his righteousness and actually does injustice and I must put a stumbling block before him, he himself will die because you did not warn him. For his sin he will die, and his righteous acts that he did will not be remembered, but his blood I shall ask back from your own hand. 21 And as for you, in case you have warned someone righteous that the righteous one should not sin, and he himself does not actually sin, he will without fail keep on living because he had been warned, and you yourself will have delivered your own soul.”
As Christians, we have responsibilities.....not to force people to believe or to coerce them, but simply to warn them. If they accept the warning and act on it, all well and good but if they choose not to, we have nevertheless done our job.
Jesus likened it to the days of Noah and said that people would not take any more notice of us than they did of him. (Matt 24:14, 36-39)
If I sat back and just let people travel down that road to disaster....what would God think of me? What would I think of myself?
I hear you about this because my mother's church people annoy her all the time to convince me to come back to,the fold, as it were. What I tell her is that those people don't hve the right to tel me how, when, where, etc, to worship God. Their path simply makes no sense to me. I understand that you believe that people who are not Christian will be damned but I do not. It isn't up to you to live my life. If I am wrong and your view is correct, I have no one to blame but myself. But the simple facts are that I cannot believe God is going to damn billions of Musilms, Hindus, Jews, etc. I believe God can be big enough to make itself known to everyone, each in their own way. I hope you understand that.
I understand. Went through much the same as you and realized if "God" is Love, peace, joy, compassion, all inclusive then these are not describing some being, but principles that humankind have and can demonstrate to enjoy. Those humans who cant demonstrate those principles are IMO missing out. Threats really don't change people.
I totally agree awoon. For me, all of those faiths that use threats or coersion to browbeat people don't understand God. At least from my POV. From my view, God is energy and it is a path of enlightenment to strive to be like that concept. While I consider myself as following eastern faiths, that is not quite true too. I walk a spiritual path with no organized religion at the apex. It makes the most sense to me.
Mycroft
Ministry of Serendipity
Except that 'Jesus is Alive!' they say. So no death could have taken place.
Apparently you haven't heard the Good News ... a dead man got up and walked!
I am alive, but few people celebrate the fact.
'Jesus is Alive!' because he died and resurrected himself.
Wait until you hear the REALLY good news ... Jesus said that he would do it for you, too.
(ask around, someone will fill you in on the details)
Mycroft
Ministry of Serendipity
a dead man got up and walked!
Then he's not dead?
Nope.
But you said "no death could have taken place", which is not true.
A death did take place, because Jesus did die ... he just did not stay dead.
According to the Gospels, two other people died right next to him on the same day ... you don't see many bumper stickers that "The Thieves are Alive!" ... mostly because they were not resurrected.
Mycroft
Ministry of Serendipity
So where's the sacrifice?
There isn't any.
Mycroft
Ministry of Serendipity
So why should I believe/have faith in Jesus at all? He made no sacrifice and he didn't die for me, so he's just some dude.
When Paul wrote that Christ "died" for us in King James English, Strongs Concordence 1063 "gar" the word (because) is the meaning before the word (for). So when Paul says say Christ died because of us, he is writing to Jews in Rome, not American Christians. Hence Christ wasn't a Sacrifice for any bodies Sins.
In His death.
Except his Crucifixion.
(Good thing you didn't ask me ... I am a Calvinist.
)Only for Western Christians.
From "The Fundamental Teachings of the Eastern Orthodox Church" by Rev. George Mastrantonis
The Church of the faithful embodies the "Conscience of the Church" in its pronouncements and missions. Jesus Christ, the cornerstone of the Church, is "the Lord God, who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty" (Rev. 1:8), Who has erected, established, and bequeathed to the Church the divine Grace which is the almighty power. Therefore, the Militant Church on earth is a part of the Kingdom of Heaven, for the King is ever present to lead and sanctify the members of His own Mystical Body. He is "Jesus Christ, Who is the faithful witness, and the first-begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood" (Rev. 1:5).
[emphasis mine]
Sounds like Eastern Orthodox Christians believe in a sacrifice as well.
So to whom were you referring?