Jehovah's Witness leader tells elders to destroy records

[Jose Fly]

I think this falls under the category of "If you've done nothing wrong you have nothing to hide".

I believe when it comes to allegations of sexual abuse, Jehovah's Witnesses have a "two witnesses" rule, where when an alleged victim comes forward with an allegation, unless there is a second witness to the act, no further action is usually taken.

 

[Flame]

I'm honestly not surprised by this.

 

[PureX]

The phony righteousness of religiosity has always been a great mask for pedophiles, adulterers, thieves, and charlatans to hide behind. Every legitimate religious institution should be especially vigilant about this, just as every good policing organization knows to be particularly wary of bullyboys and psychopaths who are endlessly attracted to the power of a badge and a gun.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Didn't the idiots realize that this video was also evidence against them? Facepalms galore. Telling people to destroy records so that they can lie safely destroys what little credibility they have.

 

[Jose Fly]

Didn't the idiots realize that this video was also evidence against them? Facepalms galore. Telling people to destroy records so that they can lie safely destroys what little credibility they have.

My understanding is that the video was taken undercover.

 

[John53]

I think this falls under the category of "If you've done nothing wrong you have nothing to hide".

It looks very damning when he blames the victims by saying it's Satan coming after them but to be fair it is only a small snippet and could be out of context, I'd love to see the entire talk.

I believe when it comes to allegations of sexual abuse, Jehovah's Witnesses have a "two witnesses" rule, where when an alleged victim comes forward with an allegation, unless there is a second witness to the act, no further action is usually taken.

I think (I could be wrong but that's the way I interpret it) that changed after the Australian Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse. In countries that require mandatory reporting of child sexual abuse then the 2 witness rule does not apply. Why anyone would need to be told that they should report child sexual abuse is beyond my comprehension. Isn't that what a decent person would do anyway!

 

[RedhorseWoman]

I think this falls under the category of "If you've done nothing wrong you have nothing to hide".

I believe when it comes to allegations of sexual abuse, Jehovah's Witnesses have a "two witnesses" rule, where when an alleged victim comes forward with an allegation, unless there is a second witness to the act, no further action is usually taken.

Yes, the JWs do adhere to the "two witness" rule. While they have sort of, kind of relaxed that to a degree to include forensic evidence as a "second witness" the vast majority of JWs will go to the elders FIRST rather than to worldly authorities so that they don't "bring reproach" on Jehovah or the congregation.

At one point in time, elders would often threaten victims or their parents with disfellowshipping if they chose to report the molestation to worldly authorities. While that has generally been changed, elders as a rule will NOT urge victims or their parents to report the molestation to authorities, but they do not threaten them with severe negative consequences if they choose to report.

Also, elders are instructed to call the Watchtower legal department FIRST in order to find out how they should handle the matter. If the legal department advises them that they do not live in a state that requires by law that abuse allegations must be reported, they are told to let the matter drop. If the accused then declares that they are innocent (and pedophiles are known to be good liars) nothing is done and the molester remains as a JW in good standing.

In my home congregation, there was a child molester who molested his natural children as well as his stepdaughter and her male cousin (those are the ones we later learned about) but the congregation was totally unaware of what he had done despite the fact that the elders were told about his actions on several occasions. The truth finally came out years later when two of his victims, who had by that time left the JWs, were able to file criminal charges against him. He served time in prison, and because his actions were then openly known, he was finally disfellowshipped for a time.

 

[SomeRandom]

It looks very damning when he blames the victims by saying it's Satan coming after them but to be fair it is only a small snippet and could be out of context, I'd love to see the entire talk.


I think (I could be wrong but that's the way I interpret it) that changed after the Australian Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse. In countries that require mandatory reporting of child sexual abuse then the 2 witness rule does not apply. Why anyone would need to be told that they should report child sexual abuse is beyond my comprehension. Isn't that what a decent person would do anyway!

Apparently decency is in short supply.
It disgusts me when someone closes ranks to cover up allegations of abuse. It's remarkably despicable when it involves children. Not blaming any organisation specifically, just saying in general.

 

[Subduction Zone]

My understanding is that the video was taken undercover.

So not total idiots. Just highly unethical Christians.

 

[RedhorseWoman]

It looks very damning when he blames the victims by saying it's Satan coming after them but to be fair it is only a small snippet and could be out of context, I'd love to see the entire talk.

Having been a JW for thirty years, I can state that I am not at all surprised by the statement that "Satan is coming after them." By and large, when JWs are shown multiple testimonies made by former JWs who were molested (the SilentLambs site contains hundreds of them) they will vehemently declare that those victims are "liars" and that there IS no pedophile problem in the JW organization.

JWs constantly feel that Satan is attacking them when any of their failings (morally or ethically) come to light.

 

[Jose Fly]

It looks very damning when he blames the victims by saying it's Satan coming after them but to be fair it is only a small snippet and could be out of context, I'd love to see the entire talk.

I agree. But I can't think of too many circumstances where "destroy records so the authorities can't get them" isn't damning in itself.

I think (I could be wrong but that's the way I interpret it) that changed after the Australian Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse. In countries that require mandatory reporting of child sexual abuse then the 2 witness rule does not apply. Why anyone would need to be told that they should report child sexual abuse is beyond my comprehension. Isn't that what a decent person would do anyway!

Thanks for that info. And yeah, one would think common decency and humanity would override sheer tribalism, but unfortunately we've seen too many cases where that doesn't happen.

 

[Flame]

In my home congregation, there was a child molester who molested his natural children as well as his stepdaughter and her male cousin (those are the ones we later learned about) but the congregation was totally unaware of what he had done despite the fact that the elders were told about his actions on several occasions. The truth finally came out years later when two of his victims, who had by that time left the JWs, were able to file criminal charges against him. He served time in prison, and because his actions were then openly known, he was finally disfellowshipped for a time.

That reminds me of a JW I knew when I first moved out to the Midwest. He had two young daughters that spent the summer with him and his parents as he was separated but still married. It took both his daughters getting gonorrhea to get him caught however it came out that both his parents and congregation knew about the molestation for a few years prior but said nothing. After the whole town knew that they had hid it, they were quick to expel him and close down their Kingdom Hall.

 

[RedhorseWoman]

That reminds me of a JW I knew when I first moved out to the Midwest. He had two young daughters that spent the summer with him and his parents as he was separated but still married. It took both his daughters getting gonorrhea to get him caught however it came out that both his parents and congregation knew about the molestation for a few years prior but said nothing. After the whole town knew that they had hid it, they were quick to expel him and close down their Kingdom Hall.

These types of situations are sadly not unusual in the JW organization. For years, the Watchtower publications would rail against other religions and point out their horrible failings, all while covering up their own dirty laundry.

Case after case has been coming out where victims have described being molested by JWs--either parents or elders in the congregation--and nothing was ever done even though the crimes were reported to the elder body. Basically, as long as the "sin" wasn't public knowledge, they felt that they didn't have to do anything about it...keep it hidden...no one will know...pretend that it's all good.

They have made some changes in recent years, but nowhere near enough.