Jesus' Four Failed Prophecies About Him Returning In The Lifetimes Of His Apostles

[Trailblazer]

@ samtonga43

You cannot avoid it. (Read all in context, of course). You can quibble about what these passages might mean, but there is a pattern here of that proves that Jesus was not God.

Jesus claimed to reveal God, Whom He called Father, but Jesus differentiated Himself from God:

John 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself, even so gave he to the Son also to have life in himself:

John 8:40 But now ye seek to slay me, a man that have spoken to you [the] truth, that I heard of God; Abraham did not this thing.

John 14:1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.

John 16:23 And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.

Jesus said that God was greater than He was:

Mark 10:18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

Matthew 4:10 Jesus said to him, 'Away from me, Satan! For it is written: "Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only."

John 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.

How could Jesus pray to and go to the Father if Jesus WAS the God the Father?

John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

John 16:16 A little while, and ye shall not see me: and again, a little while, and ye shall see me, because I go to the Father.

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

Moreover, Jesus said that no man has ever seen God:

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

1 John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

Jesus said He was from God and that God sent Him, again differentiating Himself from God:

John 17:3 And eternal life means to know you, the only true God, and to know Jesus Christ, whom you sent.

John 7:28 Then cried Jesus in the temple as he taught, saying, Ye both know me, and ye know whence I am: and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, whom ye know not. 29 But I know him: for I am from him, and he hath sent me.

Jesus even stated specifically that the Father had knowledge which was not possessed by the Son.

Matthew 24:36 No one knows about that day or hour, not even the Son, but the Father only.

Mark 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

Jesus referred to Himself as a Prophet, and was so regarded. Jesus never referred to Himself as God.

Matthew 13:57 And they were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, save in his own country, and in his own house.

Luke 13:33 Nevertheless I must walk to day, and to morrow, and the day following: for it cannot be that a prophet perish out of Jerusalem.

Matthew 21:11 And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.

Luke 7:16 And there came a fear on all: and they glorified God, saying, That a great prophet is risen up among us; and, That God hath visited his people.

Jesus IS NOT God Bible Quotes... Continued:

2 Corinthians 1:3 Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort;

1 Corinthians 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

2 Corinthians 11:31 The God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which is blessed for evermore, knoweth that I lie not.

Acts 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

Acts 17:31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

Ephesians 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

Romans 15:6 That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Colossians 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

Hosea 11:9 I will not execute the fierceness of mine anger, I will not return to destroy Ephraim: for I am God, and not man; the Holy One in the midst of thee: and I will not enter into the city.

Numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?

 

[samtonga43]

Try again...

This has nothing to do with the Justification by Faith apart from works that the Paul taught.

You asked me to show you any verses where Jesus speaks of Justification at all. I did.
What is it you don’t understand?

 

[samtonga43]

You cannot avoid it. (Read all in context, of course). You can quibble about what these passages might mean, but there is a pattern here of that proves that Jesus was not God.

1. Matthew 1:23
2. Mark 2:5-7
3. John 1:1
4. John 5:18
5. John 20:27-29
6. Philippians 2:5-7
7. Colossians 1:15
8. Colossians 2:9
9. 2 Peter 1:1
10. Hebrews 1:3

Therefore Jesus is God.

 

[samtonga43]

[B]How could Jesus pray to and go to the Father if Jesus WAS the God the Father?[/B]

Jesus was/is [B]not [/B]God the Father.

 

[Trailblazer]

You asked me to show you any verses where Jesus speaks of Justification at all. I did.
What is it you don’t understand?

No, you did not show me where Jesus speaks of Justification according to the Christian doctrine if Justification.

Justification, in Christian theology, either (1) the act by which God moves a willing person from the state of sin (injustice) to the state of grace (justice); (2) the change in a person’s condition moving from a state of sin to a state of righteousness; or (3) especially in Protestantism, the act of acquittal whereby God gives contrite sinners the status of the righteous.
Justification | Christianity

I said: Please show me any verses where Jesus speaks of Justification at all. Now's your chance.

You said:
Certainly.
The Pharisee and the Tax Collector
He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: “Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee, standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.’ But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.”
Luke 18:9-14
* * * * * * * * * * *
The Pharisee prayed about how good he was, but the tax collector asked for God's mercy as he was a sinner. ... Jesus said that it was the tax collector who went home justified before God.

The parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector (Luke 18:9-14)

You and I both know that Jesus was not talking about Justification according the Christian theology.
Why not just come clean and admit Jesus did not say anything about Justification?

You don't think I don't do my homework do you? I know full well where the doctrine of Justification by faith came from, and it did not come from Jesus. It is a Christian doctrine developed much later and does not have any basis in Jesus' words.

What is the doctrine of justification by faith?

According to the doctrine of The New Church, as explained by Emanuel Swedenborg, the doctrine of justification by faith alone is a false belief which forms the foundation of much of Protestant theology. ... Not only must man believe in God, but must love God with all his strength, and his neighbor as himself.

Justification (theology) - Wikipedia

 

[Trailblazer]

1. Matthew 1:23
2. Mark 2:5-7
3. John 1:1
4. John 5:18
5. John 20:27-29
6. Philippians 2:5-7
7. Colossians 1:15
8. Colossians 2:9
9. 2 Peter 1:1
10. Hebrews 1:3

Therefore Jesus is God.

And now I know what @ Subduction Zone meant by "running away."

I proved that those verses do not mean Jesus is God:
#1800 Trailblazer, Yesterday at 8:08 PM

And you failed to respond to my proofs because you could not refute them.

 

[Trailblazer]

Jesus was/is [B]not [/B]God the Father.

Is that the best you can do to "try" to refute my verses that prove that Jesus is not God?
No, Jesus is not God the Father because Jesus is not God, period.
There is only ONE God, God the Father, and Jesus is not part of God.

 

[halbhh]

Jesus WAS the Light of the world, but now Baha’u’llah IS the Light of the world.

Consider: Christ is still alive, since God resurrects those He chooses to resurrect.

So, Christ can't cease, and therefore won't stop being who He is.

Also, truths don't fade out or stop being true of course. They remain present tense, always.

None who God choses can ever become past tense -- because God exists, and God reverses death.

Therefore you'd have to use present tense. Truth already exists, and cannot be replaced.

example: 2 + 2 = 4 won't get replaced with a different truth some day, but will always be 4. Ergo, Christ will always be the light of the world, because God is forever.

If it happens anyone says anything that contradicts what Christ says, I already know they are mistaken in that Christ said only truths, and they remain valid naturally (and I checked on the things Christ said by testing them repeatedly).

So, 40 people can say 40 things that are true. See?

You could have a dozen prophets saying truth, or 30...

They won't replace Christ, but only supplement at most.

 

[Trailblazer]

Consider: Christ is still alive, since God resurrects those He chooses to resurrect.

So, Christ can't cease, and therefore won't stop being who He is.

Also, truths don't fade out or stop being true of course. They remain present tense, always.

I agree that Christ is still alive in heaven in a spiritual body.

I do not believe in the physical resurrection of Christ.

I believe that everyone who dies is resurrected in the following sense:

421. When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world that correspond to the spirit’s thoughts and affections, which the spirit has from the spiritual world, man is said to die. This takes place when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease. But the man does not die; he is merely separated from the bodily part that was of use to him in the world, while the man himself continues to live. It is said that the man himself continues to live since man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life. Heaven and Hell, p. 351

None who God choses can ever become past tense -- because God exists, and God reverses death.

I do not believe that God ever reverses physical death. I believe that when the physical body dies the souls of everyone who ever died/dies passes from one world into another and God gives then a new form, a spiritual body (1 Corinthians 15:40-54)

“The world beyond is as different from this world as this world is different from that of the child while still in the womb of its mother. When the soul attaineth the Presence of God, it will assume the form that best befitteth its immortality and is worthy of its celestial habitation.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 157

“The answer to the third question is this, that in the other world the human reality doth not assume a physical form, rather doth it take on a heavenly form, made up of elements of that heavenly realm.” Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 194

Therefore you'd have to use present tense. Truth already exists, and cannot be replaced.

example: 2 + 2 = 4 won't get replaced with a different truth some day, but will always be 4. Ergo, Christ will always be the light of the world, because God is forever.

I agree that Christ will always be a light of the world, but I do not believe He was ever the only light of the world, as I believe that all the Manifestations of God brought light to the world.

I believe that the light to the world for this age is Baha’u’llah, since He brought the sunshine for today that alone can ripen the fruits which the suns of former days have kissed into life.

“One who does not know God’s Messengers, however, is like a plant growing in the shade. Although it knows not the sun, it is, nevertheless, absolutely dependent on it. The great Prophets are spirits suns, and Bahá’u’lláh is the sun of this “day” in which we live. The suns of former days have warmed and vivified the world, and had those suns not shone, the earth would not be cold and dead, but it is the sunshine of today that alone can ripen the fruits which the suns of former days have kissed into life.”
Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, p. 72

If it happens anyone says anything that contradicts what Christ says, I already know they are mistaken in that Christ said only truths, and they remain valid naturally (and I checked on the things Christ said by testing them repeatedly).

The spiritual teachings of Christ will always be valid because spiritual truth is eternal.

Matthew 24:35 “Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.”

However I do not believe that the message of Jesus of individual salvation is the message that is needed by humanity in this age.

So, 40 people can say 40 things that are true. See?

You could have a dozen prophets saying truth, or 30...

They won't replace Christ, but only supplement at most.

Nobody is trying to replace Christ. Baha’u’llah warns us never to make any distinction between any of the Manifestations of God because they all arise to proclaim the same religion, since there is only one eternal religion of God. Baha’u’llah wrote that the works and acts of all the Manifestations of God were all ordained by God, a reflection of His Will and Purpose, meaning that all the religions are equally true.

“Beware, O believers in the Unity of God, lest ye be tempted to make any distinction between any of the Manifestations of His Cause, or to discriminate against the signs that have accompanied and proclaimed their Revelation. This indeed is the true meaning of Divine Unity, if ye be of them that apprehend and believe this truth. Be ye assured, moreover, that the works and acts of each and every one of these Manifestations of God, nay whatever pertaineth unto them, and whatsoever they may manifest in the future, are all ordained by God, and are a reflection of His Will and Purpose. Whoso maketh the slightest possible difference between their persons, their words, their messages, their acts and manners, hath indeed disbelieved in God, hath repudiated His signs, and betrayed the Cause of His Messengers.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 59-60

I believe that all the Messengers/Manifestations of God are equal in stature because they were all sent down from the heaven of the Will of God and they all proclaimed the same Faith of God.

“The Bearers of the Trust of God are made manifest unto the peoples of the earth as the Exponents of a new Cause and the Revealers of a new Message. Inasmuch as these Birds of the celestial Throne are all sent down from the heaven of the Will of God, and as they all arise to proclaim His irresistible Faith, they, therefore, are regarded as one soul and the same person. For they all drink from the one Cup of the love of God, and all partake of the fruit of the same Tree of Oneness.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 50

All of the Manifestations of God brought Light to the world, although the intensity of the Light they brought did differ.

“Know that the attributes of perfection, the splendor of the divine bounties, and the lights of inspiration are visible and evident in all the Holy Manifestations; but the glorious Word of God, Christ, and the Greatest Name, Bahá’u’lláh, are manifestations and evidences which are beyond imagination, for They possess all the perfections of the former Manifestations; and more than that, They possess some perfections which make the other Manifestations dependent upon Them. So all the Prophets of Israel were centers of inspiration; Christ also was a receiver of inspiration, but what a difference between the inspiration of the Word of God and the revelations of Isaiah, Jeremiah and Elijah!” Some Answered Questions, pp. 149-150

 

[samtonga43]

I proved that those verses do not mean Jesus is God:
#1800 Trailblazer, Yesterday at 8:08 PM

https://www.religiousforums.com/thr...s-of-his-apostles.242463/page-90#post-7170056
You proved nothing of the kind.

And you failed to respond to my proofs because you could not refute them.

I responded to your post in #1803

 

[samtonga43]

Is that the best you can do to "try" to refute my verses that prove that Jesus is not God?
No, Jesus is not God the Father because Jesus is not God, period.
There is only ONE God, God the Father, and Jesus is not part of God.

Correct. Jesus is not part of God. You're getting near the truth, Tb, and I hope you remember what Jesus said? "The truth will set you free". (John 8:32)

 

[Trailblazer]

You proved nothing of the kind.

I proved that your verses do not mean Jesus is not God.
If you could have defended your verses you would have defended your verses.

I responded to your post in #1803

No, you did not. You just repeated what you said before.

And now I understand what happened with @ Subduction Zone

Makes my work easier though, for as Truthseeker9 said, there is no point talking to people who already have their mind made up, especially when there are true seekers on this forum, people who really want to know the Truth about God.

 

[Trailblazer]

Correct. Jesus is not part of God. You're getting near the truth, Tb, and I hope you remember what Jesus said? "The truth will set you free". (John 8:32)

That's right, "The truth will set you free". Too bad you missed it when Baha'u'llah brought it.

John 16:12-14 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

“The Word which the Son concealed is made manifest. It hath been sent down in the form of the human temple in this day. Blessed be the Lord Who is the Father! He, verily, is come unto the nations in His most great majesty.”
Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 84-85

“O kings of Christendom! Heard ye not the saying of Jesus, the Spirit of God, “I go away, and come again unto you”? Wherefore, then, did ye fail, when He did come again unto you in the clouds of heaven, to draw nigh unto Him, that ye might behold His face, and be of them that attained His Presence? In another passage He saith: “When He, the Spirit of Truth, is come, He will guide you into all truth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 246

 

[Alex22]

Do they say "Jesus" or do they say Christ?
There are no verses where Jesus says "He" is going to return to earth, and many verses that show that He isn't going to.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

And no, the Son of man coming in the clouds is not Jesus.

Who is the Son of man who will come in the clouds of heaven?

Isn't Christ a title of Jesus?, what is the difference? Anyways it failed like most things in the Bible and I don't think the title "christ" is your Persian holy man

 

[Trailblazer]

Isn't Christ a title of Jesus?, what is the difference? Anyways it failed like most things in the Bible and I don't think the title "christ" is your Persian holy man

Yes, Christ is a title for Jesus but Jesus is not the only man who ever brought the Christ Spirit.
No, Christ is not a title for Baha'u'llah, but Baha'u'llah brought the Christ Spirit.

Jesus never promised to return to earth in the same body, He promised to send the Christ Spirit who He referred to as the Comforter and the Spirit of Truth. The Bible prophecies did not fail because the Comforter/Spirit of truth did come, in the person of Baha'u'llah.

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

John 16:12-13 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

 

[halbhh]

I agree that Christ is still alive in heaven in a spiritual body.

I do not believe in the physical resurrection of Christ.

I believe that everyone who dies is resurrected in the following sense:

421. When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world that correspond to the spirit’s thoughts and affections, which the spirit has from the spiritual world, man is said to die. This takes place when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease. But the man does not die; he is merely separated from the bodily part that was of use to him in the world, while the man himself continues to live. It is said that the man himself continues to live since man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life. Heaven and Hell, p. 351

I do not believe that God ever reverses physical death. I believe that when the physical body dies the souls of everyone who ever died/dies passes from one world into another and God gives then a new form, a spiritual body (1 Corinthians 15:40-54)

“The world beyond is as different from this world as this world is different from that of the child while still in the womb of its mother. When the soul attaineth the Presence of God, it will assume the form that best befitteth its immortality and is worthy of its celestial habitation.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 157

“The answer to the third question is this, that in the other world the human reality doth not assume a physical form, rather doth it take on a heavenly form, made up of elements of that heavenly realm.” Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 194

I agree that Christ will always be a light of the world, but I do not believe He was ever the only light of the world, as I believe that all the Manifestations of God brought light to the world.

I believe that the light to the world for this age is Baha’u’llah, since He brought the sunshine for today that alone can ripen the fruits which the suns of former days have kissed into life.

“One who does not know God’s Messengers, however, is like a plant growing in the shade. Although it knows not the sun, it is, nevertheless, absolutely dependent on it. The great Prophets are spirits suns, and Bahá’u’lláh is the sun of this “day” in which we live. The suns of former days have warmed and vivified the world, and had those suns not shone, the earth would not be cold and dead, but it is the sunshine of today that alone can ripen the fruits which the suns of former days have kissed into life.”
Bahá’u’lláh and the New Era, p. 72

The spiritual teachings of Christ will always be valid because spiritual truth is eternal.

Matthew 24:35 “Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.”

However I do not believe that the message of Jesus of individual salvation is the message that is needed by humanity in this age.

Nobody is trying to replace Christ. Baha’u’llah warns us never to make any distinction between any of the Manifestations of God because they all arise to proclaim the same religion, since there is only one eternal religion of God. Baha’u’llah wrote that the works and acts of all the Manifestations of God were all ordained by God, a reflection of His Will and Purpose, meaning that all the religions are equally true.

“Beware, O believers in the Unity of God, lest ye be tempted to make any distinction between any of the Manifestations of His Cause, or to discriminate against the signs that have accompanied and proclaimed their Revelation. This indeed is the true meaning of Divine Unity, if ye be of them that apprehend and believe this truth. Be ye assured, moreover, that the works and acts of each and every one of these Manifestations of God, nay whatever pertaineth unto them, and whatsoever they may manifest in the future, are all ordained by God, and are a reflection of His Will and Purpose. Whoso maketh the slightest possible difference between their persons, their words, their messages, their acts and manners, hath indeed disbelieved in God, hath repudiated His signs, and betrayed the Cause of His Messengers.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 59-60

I believe that all the Messengers/Manifestations of God are equal in stature because they were all sent down from the heaven of the Will of God and they all proclaimed the same Faith of God.

“The Bearers of the Trust of God are made manifest unto the peoples of the earth as the Exponents of a new Cause and the Revealers of a new Message. Inasmuch as these Birds of the celestial Throne are all sent down from the heaven of the Will of God, and as they all arise to proclaim His irresistible Faith, they, therefore, are regarded as one soul and the same person. For they all drink from the one Cup of the love of God, and all partake of the fruit of the same Tree of Oneness.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 50

All of the Manifestations of God brought Light to the world, although the intensity of the Light they brought did differ.

“Know that the attributes of perfection, the splendor of the divine bounties, and the lights of inspiration are visible and evident in all the Holy Manifestations; but the glorious Word of God, Christ, and the Greatest Name, Bahá’u’lláh, are manifestations and evidences which are beyond imagination, for They possess all the perfections of the former Manifestations; and more than that, They possess some perfections which make the other Manifestations dependent upon Them. So all the Prophets of Israel were centers of inspiration; Christ also was a receiver of inspiration, but what a difference between the inspiration of the Word of God and the revelations of Isaiah, Jeremiah and Elijah!” Some Answered Questions, pp. 149-150

A question: if God exists (as we both know He does), then He could do impossible seeming things, the miraculous, should He chose to do so, do you agree?

Also, I'd guess we may have a similar understanding that in the afterlife we would not have bodies like these we are in now, but a new kind, immortal. Yes? And that though we don't know every last detail about those new embodiments, we know some things. For instance "At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.", Christ said.

But about here on Earth for these mortal bodies. God can do anything, being above nature, the originator of nature. Having actually had a personal small but dramatic miracle. Or more than 1 actually. I know they happen. So, extrapolating, God could do more dramatic miracles than only the 2 I had, of healing my foot all at once from an old problem, or the other one of rescuing me out of mid air in a dangerous fall. Why couldn't God do anything He chooses? How could He bring us into the afterlife even, if He couldn't reverse a mortal body death (fix the body and restore life)? We can do that ourselves on a modest level, with our modern medical equipment, at least for a few minutes past death, to resuscitate a dead body. So....to me it seems like whether we are...getting that He is God -- able to do what seems impossible to us. Christ came down from heaven, His spirit, to become embodied in a mortal body, to interpose himself between us and our evils, to break the grip of those evils on us. Why shouldn't God resurrect Him in some sense, even if it was then an immortal body or such, unlike these.

 

[halbhh]

“For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“ (Matthew 16: 27, 28)

Notice though:

“For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“

We read in the immediately following verses --->

1 After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.

4 Peter said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters—one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah.”

5 While he was still speaking, a bright cloud covered them, and a voice from the cloud said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased. Listen to him!”

6 When the disciples heard this, they fell facedown to the ground, terrified.

 

[Trailblazer]

A question: if God exists (as we both know He does), then He could do impossible seeming things, the miraculous, should He chose to do so, do you agree?

Yes, I agree.

Also, I'd guess we may have a similar understanding that in the afterlife we would not have bodies like these we are in now, but a new kind, immortal. Yes?

Yes, I agree.

And that though we don't know every last detail about those new embodiments, we know some things. For instance "At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.", Christ said.

Agreed.

But about here on Earth for these mortal bodies. God can do anything, being above nature, the originator of nature. Having actually had a personal small but dramatic miracle. Or more than 1 actually. I know they happen. So, extrapolating, God could do more dramatic miracles than only the 2 I had, of healing my foot all at once from an old problem, or the other one of rescuing me out of mid air in a dangerous fall. Why couldn't God do anything He chooses?

God could do anything He chooses to do.

How could He bring us into the afterlife even, if He couldn't reverse a mortal body death (fix the body and restore life)? We can do that ourselves on a modest level, with our modern medical equipment, at least for a few minutes past death, to resuscitate a dead body. So....to me it seems like whether we are...getting that He is God -- able to do what seems impossible to us.

It is not a matter of what God can do, it is a matter of what God chooses to do. An all-powerful God only does what He chooses to do.

“Say: O people! Let not this life and its deceits deceive you, for the world and all that is therein is held firmly in the grasp of His Will. He bestoweth His favor on whom He willeth, and from whom He willeth He taketh it away. He doth whatsoever He chooseth.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 209

But reversing a mortal body death and making it live forever is not something God chooses to do. God does not make mistakes. There is no reason why God would have made the physical body mortal just to reverse that decision. That is completely illogical and unnecessary because God is going to give us a different kind of body in heaven, a spiritual body. (1 Corinthians 15:40-54)

Christ came down from heaven, His spirit, to become embodied in a mortal body, to interpose himself between us and our evils, to break the grip of those evils on us. Why shouldn't God resurrect Him in some sense, even if it was then an immortal body or such, unlike these.

I believe that God did resurrect Jesus in a body, a spiritual body, a body like we will all have after we die.

 

[samtonga43]

I proved that your verses do not mean Jesus is not God.
If you could have defended your verses you would have defended your verses.

No, you did not ‘prove’ what you think you ‘proved’. You provided what you believe these verses say about Jesus. I have to tell you Tb, that what YOU believe is not proof that you are correct..

No, you did not. You just repeated what you said before.

I did, and that’s because my response IS exactly the same as before. These verses (when read in the context of all of Scripture, strengthened by the guidance of the Holy Spirit) tell me that Jesus is God, just as the Father is God and the Holy Spirit is God.
We have a Triune God. Now, I don’t expect you to understand this,Tb, but then no one does. It would be very strange if someone were to say “Oh! Now I understand what the Trinity is all about!” That is a sure indication that she/he does not understand what the Trinity is all about.

And now I understand what happened with @ Subduction Zone
Makes my work easier though, for as Truthseeker9 said, there is no point talking to people who already have their mind made up, especially when there are true seekers on this forum, people who want to know the Truth about God.

LOL! And you have “The Truth about God”? Is this really what you’re saying, Tb? Well, this forum must be very glad you’re here, with the truth! Have you written that book yet –
“The Truth about God” by Trailblazer…

 

[samtonga43]

It is not a matter of what God can do, it is a matter of what God chooses to do. An all-powerful God only does what He chooses to do.

And an omni-benevolent God cannot, by definition, choose anything but the very best for His people.