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Just Accidental?

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Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
OK, how did whoever or whatever design and create the different kinds? Did he sit down and say "I need a hobby. I will now design and create different "kinds" of animals. I will take atoms and molecules and I will personally put together cells containing different kinds of DNA strings and let them loose. I will put in blocks in the DNA so that every animal can't change and become a different "kind". Or maybe he just put together atoms and molecules and created some animals of every "kind" and sat back and watched what would happen? Or did he tweak the DNA from time to time? Please give us the latest research creationists have done shedding light on this.

LOL....if evolution is more appealing to you than a powerful Creator who can assemble matter in any way he wishes, then that is up to you. You cannot say with any certainty that a Creator does not exist...all you can say is that you don't believe he exists. Doesn't that prove that we have each chosen a belief system? You can't prove yours any more than I can prove mine. So the choice is based on which one you choose to believe and what is presented as evidence to facilitate that choice.

What if only ugly ducks existed?

Ugly creatures do exist, but their mates still seem to find them attractive, whether we do or not.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
No, it does NOT confirm what you said at all.

You said there were NO cases of someone dying of marijuana overdose.
The fact is there are.
Second, there has still never been a documented overdose death due to marijuana. Cannabis may have triggered an underlying heart problem in the three recent cases, but the amount of marijuana those individuals consumed was not the issue.

The initial report of a cannabis death came last month, when 31-year-old Gemma Moss was found by a U.K. medical examiner to have died from cardiac arrest triggered by cannabis. Moss, reportedly a regular marijuana user who had suffered from depression, had smoked only half a joint the night she died. Doctors could find no other cause for her death, so the coroner concluded it was “more likely than not that she died from the effects of cannabis.”
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/28/marijuana-deaths_n_4868209.html
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
No, it does NOT confirm what you said at all.

You said there were NO cases of someone dying of marijuana overdose.
The fact is there are.
You didn't read the details Mestemia.....the 18 people who supposedly died due to cannabis may well have had an allergic reaction to it...it happens sometimes.

Would you like to compare the alcohol or tobacco related deaths, both of which are legal and unrestricted to the general public.
 

Monk Of Reason

༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
LOL....if evolution is more appealing to you than a powerful Creator who can assemble matter in any way he wishes, then that is up to you. You cannot say with any certainty that a Creator does not exist...all you can say is that you don't believe he exists. Doesn't that prove that we have each chosen a belief system? You can't prove yours any more than I can prove mine. So the choice is based on which one you choose to believe and what is presented as evidence to facilitate that choice.
There is no evidence of a creator god that you describe. There is sufficent evidence that he is simply one of many attempts at early man to describe the world around them. Evolution on the other hand has been a plethora of evidence for. Evidence that can be looked up right now this very second by anyone willing to read it. Even if you don't want to read I"m sure there is plenty of video source. Don't believe the information? Luckily if you are on anything credible it will have sources. Go to the sources and read there. IF you are not convinced of those sources then look at the sources of those sources.
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Please don't hold your breath waiting for me to confirm what you have been persuaded to believe.
What science is "suggesting" is not true just because they think that "this plus this must equal that". The suggestions can continue ad nauseum, but they still don't "prove" that what is suggested ever happened. Do you understand that all you are doing is building on a foundation that I don't believe exists in the first place. The very first premise is flawed IMO. Nothing you build on this invisible foundation will stand. Its assumption masquerading as fact.

The fossil record has holes that you can drive a Mack truck through.....if the links are all missing....do you have a chain?
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Your prejudices makes you blind to the evidence. But this is not about convincing you at all. It about me not letting your reality denying positions based on your particular theological presuppositions go unchallenged. It about me (and others) explicitly showing that at the end of the day all you have is rhetoric based on deliberate misrepresentation of scientific evidence. I will do what I consider is my duty, to present the facts and truths as they are when I see you misrepresent them, and that's it. You and other readers can choose what to believe and what not to believe by themselves.

Regarding the fossil record, I present plenty of evidence explictly showing that the fossil record is exceptionally good to track the evolution of hominin lineage to modern humans. That you refuse to accept it without rhyme or reason is your problem. Not mine.

For example, here is the actually measured brain sizes of all human ancestor fossils laid out in time. Please show the gap. Thank you,

F1.large.jpg
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
There is no evidence of a creator god that you describe. There is sufficent evidence that he is simply one of many attempts at early man to describe the world around them. Evolution on the other hand has been a plethora of evidence for. Evidence that can be looked up right now this very second by anyone willing to read it. Even if you don't want to read I"m sure there is plenty of video source. Don't believe the information? Luckily if you are on anything credible it will have sources. Go to the sources and read there. IF you are not convinced of those sources then look at the sources of those sources.
LOL.....This is a long thread MoR....this has all been covered a gazillion times. Try to keepup...OK?
SEVeyesB08_th.gif
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Your prejudices makes you blind to the evidence. But this is not about convincing you at all. It about me not letting your reality denying positions based on your particular theological presuppositions go unchallenged. It about me (and others) explicitly showing that at the end of the day all you have is rhetoric based on deliberate misrepresentation of scientific evidence. I will do what I consider is my duty, to present the facts and truths as they are when I see you misrepresent them, and that's it. You and other readers can choose what to believe and what not to believe by themselves.

Regarding the fossil record, I present plenty of evidence explictly showing that the fossil record is exceptionally good to track the evolution of hominin lineage to modern humans. That you refuse to accept it without rhyme or reason is your problem. Not mine.

For example, here is the actually measured brain sizes of all human ancestor fossils laid out in time. Please show the gap. Thank you,

F1.large.jpg

All I see is a bunch of individuals who have been deluded by science to accept a theory as if it were proven fact. You have not been able to establish anything as true.....the "science" that supports evolution (as opposed to adaptation) is all suggestion.....you have no facts. Nothing you have presented so far doesn't involve supposition in order to reach conclusions...why can't you admit that? No one was there to document anything so they guess about what they think "might have" happened to support their view. The graphics just make me laugh.
There is more fantasy attached to what you believe that what I do.
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Monk Of Reason

༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ
LOL.....This is a long thread MoR....this has all been covered a gazillion times. Try to keepup...OK?
SEVeyesB08_th.gif
Oh I've kept up. I"ve kept up and lapped you a few times I bet. I've been through a thousand threads like this one. All the same. Still no evidence for a creator. Still evolution remains a solid fact of science. Got a personal favorite challenge to this observation?
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Oh I've kept up. I"ve kept up and lapped you a few times I bet. I've been through a thousand threads like this one. All the same. Still no evidence for a creator. Still evolution remains a solid fact of science. Got a personal favorite challenge to this observation?

Yes, actually....the first premise that humans had to evolve from lower primates. When you start with a false premise, you look for confirmation in your "evidence" to support your premise. You can make it fit if your power of suggestion is persuasive enough. Just the same as you can deny a truth if the opposite premise you operate from is also flawed. If you see the existence of a Creator as somehow beneath your dignity because your peers have presented him as myth and no self respecting scientist would subscribe to such nonsense....and religion has falsely misrepresented him by denying the facts that science CAN actually establish, then its up for grabs really. The truth is lost in human egos and peer pressure.

Supporters of evolution appear to be swapping myth for fact.....but if the Creator is real, then the proposition science is presenting is the real myth, backed up by nothing more that the power of suggestion with artificial facts, by those who are influential in the world of science. At the end of the day, its a choice of belief systems....
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
All I see is a bunch of individuals who have been deluded by science to accept a theory as if it were proven fact. You have not been able to establish anything as true.....the "science" that supports evolution (as opposed to adaptation) is all suggestion.....you have no facts. Nothing you have presented so far doesn't involve supposition in order to reach conclusions...why can't you admit that? No one was there to document anything so they guess about what they think "might have" happened to support their view. The graphics just make me laugh.
There is more fantasy attached to what you believe that what I do.
zthinking2.gif
You are completely deluded by your prejudices. If you say that the sky is green because your faith tells you to why expect others to agree with your nonsense? The situation here is even more egregious. Denying facts and data all you want, does not make them go away.

I find it gratifying that you are now reduced to nothing other than childish grumbling. Evidence from the fossil record matches with the predictions of the theory of evolution exactly when it comes to human evolution (and I can show this for bird and whale evolution as well). You have no answer, and that is the jist of all your replies now.
 
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Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
You are completely deluded by your prejudices.
Aren't you just as completely deluded by your own prejudices?

If you say that the sky is green because your faith tells you to why expect others to agree with your nonsense?
You don't seem to realize that this is what you yourself are doing.
My sky is just as blue as yours but why is it blue when outside our atmosphere is nothing but black? Just another fortunate accident?

You say that the universe just happened and that life appearing on this planet is just by chance, followed by millions (maybe billions) of other chance happenings that no one controlled or designed. My life experience tells me that whatever I see as an effect, has a cause, and I see that whatever is designed requires a designer. I also know that science can prove that all life comes from pre-existing life...yet you want us to put all of that "childish" (though scientifically provable) logic aside and believe your fairy story.....sorry, no can do.
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The situation here is even more egregious. Denying facts and data all you want, does not make them go away.

"Egregious"......I wanted to look up the word so that I fully understood its meaning.....
Its not one I use in everyday speech, but one I am sure that academics use all the time to sound important and educated.
SEVeyesC08_th.gif


Here is the definition.....

"outstandingly bad; shocking"......
or the archaic meaning....."remarkably good"

Which definition would you like....the second one is hilarious. Funny how the meanings of words can change to become the opposite of what they meant originally.......you know, like the word "theory".
89.gif

Whodathunk that if enough people believed in something, you could turn theory into fact?

I find it gratifying that you are now reduced to nothing other than childish grumbling. Evidence from the fossil record matches with the predictions of the theory of evolution exactly when it comes to human evolution (and I can show this for bird and whale evolution as well). You have no answer, and that is the jist of all your replies now.

"Evidence from the fossil record matches with the predictions of the theory of evolution exactly when it comes to human evolution" I am sure is another way of saying "we matched our suggestions ("facts") to our pre-conceived conclusions and called it science, even when we had no real evidence that our conclusions were right." People with degrees said it was true, so it must be.
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It isn't the evidence that proves anything at all...its the interpretation of the evidence that you accept. Who said that their interpretation is correct? Science cannot prove evolution anymore than I can prove a Creator, so I think you need to stop protesting that it can.

I hope I have given the readers here at least the alternative view and exposed evolutionary science for what it really is. A con of mammoth proportions.

There is not a single thing that you have presented here that backs up your first premise.
All your "facts" are suggestions and all the "evidence" is guesswork......and I think that has become very evident.
 

sayak83

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Aren't you just as completely deluded by your own prejudices?

No I am not. There are no presuppositions that I have at all. Very little of my worldview (Hinduism) depends on whether evolution is true or not, so I simply present the evidence as I and all scientists see it.

You don't seem to realize that this is what you yourself are doing.
No i am not.

My sky is just as blue as yours but why is it blue when outside our atmosphere is nothing but black? Just another fortunate accident?
Now you are drifting into hilarity. Blue light has shorter wavelength and hence gets preferentially scattered by the atmospheric gases. That is why the sky is blue. Basic physics. In vacuum, there is no gas that can scatter and hence the sky is black. Now you have demonstrated your complete ignorance of even basic science.

How much science education do you have? Be truthful.

You say that the universe just happened
Please quote me saying this? I consider the universe to be eternal. Always existed in some form or the other through eternity of time while the specific current phase of this universe started at the Big Bang expansion.

and that life appearing on this planet is just by chance,
Laws of physics and chemistry that resulted in the emergence of early life. So how is it by chance. In fact, given the regularities of the universe, I consider the emergence of life in earth like planet to be as inevitable as the freezing of water to ice at 0 Celsius. So no, not by chance.

followed by millions (maybe billions) of other chance happenings that no one controlled or designed.
No further patterns other than the regularities and the stochastic processes of nature are necessary to explain the emergence and diversification of life.
My life experience tells me that whatever I see as an effect, has a cause, and I see that whatever is designed requires a designer. I also know that science can prove that all life comes from pre-existing life...yet you want us to put all of that "childish" (though scientifically provable) logic aside and believe your fairy story.....sorry, no can do.
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Carry on with your childish gut feelings then...


"Egregious"......I wanted to look up the word so that I fully understood its meaning.....
Its not one I use in everyday speech, but one I am sure that academics use all the time to sound important and educated.
SEVeyesC08_th.gif


Here is the definition.....

"outstandingly bad; shocking"......
or the archaic meaning....."remarkably good"

Which definition would you like....the second one is hilarious. Funny how the meanings of words can change to become the opposite of what they meant originally.......you know, like the word "theory".
89.gif

Whodathunk that if enough people believed in something, you could turn theory into fact?
I mean the modern usage of course. Theory is considered more well established than facts in scientific usage.

Theory of Quantum Mechanics
Theory of General Relativity
Germ Theory of Disease
Theory of Electrodynamics
Theory of Evolution

etc.
Theories are the pinnacles of science, the most well established and wide-ranging explanations of Reality in Science are called Theories. You cannot better them. Take it or leave it.



"Evidence from the fossil record matches with the predictions of the theory of evolution exactly when it comes to human evolution"
I am sure is another way of saying "we matched our suggestions ("facts") to our pre-conceived conclusions and called it science, even when we had no real evidence that our conclusions were right." People with degrees said it was true, so it must be.
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It isn't the evidence that proves anything at all...its the interpretation of the evidence that you accept. Who said that their interpretation is correct? Science cannot prove evolution anymore than I can prove a Creator, so I think you need to stop protesting that it can.

I hope I have given the readers here at least the alternative view and exposed evolutionary science for what it really is. A con of mammoth proportions.

There is not a single thing that you have presented here that backs up your first premise.
All your "facts" are suggestions and all the "evidence" is guesswork......and I think that has become very evident.

I have amply demonstrated the extent of your delusions and your sheer inability to sift truths from fictive beliefs based on evidence. I will continue to do so for any further claims you make. The readers will decide who is being faithful to evidence, logic and rationality.
 

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
Whoa there OB...please don't get the idea that I am against the use of anti-biotics per se. Anti-biotics stopped a worrying infection from a cat bite I had several years ago. Myself, along with a lot of other people, see the "over-prescription" of anti-biotics to be the problem. It was seen as the "be-all and end-all" of medicine there for a while...the "cure for what ails you"...."the thing to swallow just in case you get an infection"....wouldn't you think science would have issued a warning on the over-use of this treatment, knowing the propensity of living things to adapt in order to survive? It's not like they didn't know this could happen, is it?
Deeje, so, let me get tgis right.... ... when you need an antibiotic course it's reasonable, but when others need one it's just a ridiculous over-prescription? We do know that misuse of medecines is bad because bacteria and viri can EVOLVE to be immune to them, but to suggest that your natural remedies (which I do support) are the panacea for all illness is...... wobbly! :p


No, I do not believe that a bird is an evolved dinosaur and I have never seen any scientist prove that this is true. I've seen it "suggested" though...like everything else they propose. :D
Oh dear...... you do not believe, eh? Let me see, you read a load of Pauline spin (I'm being polite there) about a man whom he never knew, and you not only gulp it down, hook, line, sinker and all, but you quote it to the world, and I have never 'seen' any evangelist or other PROVE that this is true. Trust in my truth when I tell you that Yeshua BarYosef initiated a vocation for his own folks, and not you (unless you happen to be a dowtrodden mistreated Galilean working-class person) .......... and the evidence for evolution is there, in the ground, in the dna, and in the laboratories. Not your Pauline stuff, but solid evidence. :p
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Without going into too much detail, politics (and only rarely) seems the only other thing which can unite a group to common action in so dynamic a fashion.

Who can trust politics to accomplish anything? They promise the world and deliver a few pebbles. What use is a group united by empty promises?

That we are charming and incorrigible rascals?

Of course.
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You might have misunderstood me there. I don't know. That's why I'm an atheist. I leave the knowing to others.

I don't trust "others" to know anything for me....I have to know for myself, and not just take someone's word for it. If it makes no sense to me I can't accept it. If I can't explain it to myself, I can't expect anyone else to understand it.

I could say the same about various religions. And following them all is ridiculous and self defeating in any case. So I make my best choice based on the evidence to hand. Suffice to say it's not a topic I've neglected to think about.

I must admit, the beliefs I was raised with did nothing to inspire my confidence in God but when I was of an age to investigate for myself, I was hungry for knowledge, not doctrine or performance. I knew a little about God (sort of) but I didn't "know" God. Someone introduced me to him and I realized that He was a complete stranger to me, even though I thought I had known him all my life. Learning about him and forming a relationship with him has been an awesome experience. I am sad that unbelievers never get to even an introduction. Too many form their opinions of him from others who have never met him....often pawing over negative parts of the Bible as a reason for rejecting him.

It also helps if you are a spiritual person to begin with.....I am not sure why some people are more spiritually minded than others.
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Maybe its in the genes?
I have always believed in God and always respected his word. Even when I lost faith in the church, I never threw the baby out with the bathwater.

I chose that example because they are largely atheists. To be clear though, I find state-sponsored atheism odious.
I find governmental interference in worship that is harmless and peaceful to be odious. Persecuting people who are law abiding and non violent makes no sense, yet my brotherhood still experience hardship and imprisonment in some countries for no apparent reason other than the fact that they are preachers who won't fight in their wars.

But anyway, that second daughter born in China won't be Christened. She may just get a formaldehyde injection in her skull, but assuming she lives, she won't hear the message of God in the way that I have. Say she makes it to 20, and dies an atheist. What does your God do with her? Is it the same as what he'd do with me?

The Bible holds out the promise of a resurrection for all who have died prior to the judgment. Death is the highest penalty anyone can pay for any crime.

According to the Bible, death is death (an unconscious condition) but it isn't a permanent condition. Jesus and his apostles performed resurrections and healing to demonstrate what will take place when God's kingdom will take back control of earth's rulership. In Eden, there was no natural cause of death. We were never designed for heaven, we were designed for this earth and the earth was designed for us. This is why evolution is such nonsense to me. The symbiosis we can observe is no accident. The natural cycles of the earth are geared to support life....this to me is obvious.
Water is the most miraculous substance on the planet, yet we take it completely for granted.
snoozer_11.gif

There is not a drop of water present today that wasn't here when the earth was created.....it is just constantly recycled. Nature is a recycler......only man, who alienated himself from the education provided by his Maker, is a polluter. That is soon to be rectified.

God judges the dead on the condition of their heart, not just on their former conduct or beliefs. If someone has never had an opportunity to lean about him, he will not punish them, but he will educate them so that they can choose to serve him or not.

Metaphorically I like to let my kids fall. They learn from it. .

As the quintessential parent, God allows us to experience the consequences of our own actions.
Experience is the best teacher.
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He could be better looking though.....

The law of gravity is a good example I think. Disobey this law and it will become painfully and immediately obvious that you don't flout this law and get away with it. The consequences can range from bruising or a bit of skin off...to a serious injury...or even death. God will not prevent the consequence. If death results, it is reversible in the new world to come, hence we don't see it as permanent loss.
Tragic as the loss is, we see it as a temporary separation. The dead sleep peacefully in their graves, waiting for the call to return to life. God never meant for families to be separated.

But witholding salvation from them if they didn't worship me is fairly extreme on the tough love scale if you ask me

God never withholds salvation from anyone. We withhold it from ourselves by our own choices.
If God lays down his rules for life (which are very reasonable) and tells his children to follow these rules in order to be happy and to enjoy a peaceful life, but then warns them that if they go down the other track, in order to do things their way, he says that road end in certain death. If we choose it anyway, knowing where it leads.....whose fault is our choice?
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Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Deeje, so, let me get tgis right.... ... when you need an antibiotic course it's reasonable, but when others need one it's just a ridiculous over-prescription?

Is there a reason for you to twist my words OB?
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I didn't say that.....I said that the over-prescription of anti-biotics is the cause of the problem. This is the fault of doctors who over-prescribed it without regard for the consequences. Science knows that living things have the capacity to adapt themselves to new circumstances. Adaptation is not "evolution" in my definition, but it is microevolution in science's definition. Adaptation is designed into life itself so that creatures on this planet can survive in a change of circumstance. It is not guided or designed unintelligently.

Can someone show me a giraffe's neck in the process of evolution?
There are fossils of various types of flying creatures—birds, bats, extinct pterodactyls. According to ToE, they must have evolved from transitional ancestors. But none of those transitional forms have ever been found. There is not even a hint of them.
Are there any fossils of birds evolving a beak from a reptile jaw?
Darwinian evolution has not shown the scientists how birds descended from reptiles, mammals from earlier quadrupeds, quadrupeds from fishes, nor vertebrates from invertebrates. They seek stepping-stones across the gaps between, but they seek in vain. The missing links are all still missing....because they never existed.

Please produce the evidence for your claim that does not involve assertions or suggestions or educated guessing. I'll just go and busy myself whilst I am waiting...
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We do know that misuse of medecines is bad because bacteria and viri can EVOLVE to be immune to them, but to suggest that your natural remedies (which I do support) are the panacea for all illness is...... wobbly!

I didn't say that either. I said that alternative medicines can work well without the awful side effects and that cannabis has shown itself to be a very useful medicine for people with many different health problems.

Oh dear...... you do not believe, eh? Let me see, you read a load of Pauline spin (I'm being polite there) about a man whom he never knew, and you not only gulp it down, hook, line, sinker and all, but you quote it to the world, and I have never 'seen' any evangelist or other PROVE that this is true. Trust in my truth when I tell you that Yeshua BarYosef initiated a vocation for his own folks, and not you (unless you happen to be a dowtrodden mistreated Galilean working-class person) ..........

Since I believe in the power of the Creator to bring the universe into existence, it is not a difficult thing for him have his word recorded, and to also preserved down to the present, virtually unaltered for thousands of years......Paul's writings are a part of that book....that is good enough for me. I have no authority from God to discount portions of his word because certain people have a problem with one or more of his secretaries. You can deny Paul's writings if you like....I have no problem with them.

and the evidence for evolution is there, in the ground, in the dna, and in the laboratories. Not your Pauline stuff, but solid evidence.
I would question your research on all of that, but you are welcome to believe whatever you like.
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oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
Is there a reason for you to twist my words OB?
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I didn't say that.....I said that the over-prescription of anti-biotics is the cause of the problem.
Yes..... a problem, but quite irrelevant to this thread, apart from the fact that evelving life forms can change to survive.

Can someone show me a giraffe's neck in the process of evolution?
.... no....don't specialise in anything like that..... but I can show you that Paul knew nothing about Jesus, wrote nothing about Jesus's life, job, or reall vocation. And I can suggest that you rethink your decsions and discover that the first paragraghs of Genesis were brilliant metaphor to satisfy stone and bronze age human minds. ;)

Please produce the evidence for your claim that does not involve assertions or suggestions or educated guessing.
Oh.... pleeease! ..... please produce evidence for your claim that the bible is one book, and all within it completely, literally, absolutely true! :shrug:

Since I believe in the power of the Creator to bring the universe into existence, it is not a difficult thing for him have his word recorded, and to also preserved down to the present, virtually unaltered for thousands of years......
My guess is that you have never read the bible, not in it's manuscripted original form, untranslated, un-messed-about-with.

Paul's writings are a part of that book....that is good enough for me. I have no authority from God to discount portions of his word because certain people have a problem with one or more of his secretaries. You can deny Paul's writings if you like....I have no problem with them.
I know....... I believe that Paul is your prophet, and Cephas, and some others, his letters (and possibly the 'quasi' ones) make up the majority of many Christian Creeds and Canons. And all those books, all collected together by people who burned reverything else, or who tried to.

And you just have faith in it all. To me that translates into 'hopes it's true'.... Faith. Yet you cling to amazing beliefs, despite the evidence which builds up, higher and higher, day by day.

I would question your faith, but you are welcome to believe whaever you like.

:p
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
LOL....if evolution is more appealing to you than a powerful Creator who can assemble matter in any way he wishes, then that is up to you. You cannot say with any certainty that a Creator does not exist...all you can say is that you don't believe he exists. Doesn't that prove that we have each chosen a belief system?
No I haven't chosen a belief system. I don't believe in any god and I don't believe in evolution but it's the best theory we have at the moment given that you can't give us any evidence for the existence of any god(s) much less any evidence that any god(s) created anything. You have nothing. At least the evolutionists have something. Like we know that DNA changes. If you want to persuade people that a god or an Intelligent Designer exists you must at least stop whining and complaining about what evolution doesn't have when you have even less to support your theory.
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
@Deeje

Pretend that none of us has ever heard of the Theory of Evolution and that it doesn't exist. But you have this theory that some god(s) exist and that this/these god(s) made the animals and us. Now, present your evidence for the existence of this/these god(s) and that they made anything.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
All I see is a bunch of individuals who have been deluded by science to accept a theory as if it were proven fact. You have not been able to establish anything as true.....the "science" that supports evolution (as opposed to adaptation) is all suggestion.....you have no facts. Nothing you have presented so far doesn't involve supposition in order to reach conclusions...why can't you admit that? No one was there to document anything so they guess about what they think "might have" happened to support their view. The graphics just make me laugh.
There is more fantasy attached to what you believe that what I do.
zthinking2.gif
You must have a strange definition of the word fantasy then.

What have these individuals been deluded by? Empirical evidence? Demonstrable facts of life? As opposed to your empty assertions lacking any evidence whatsoever? Don't make me laugh.

Sorry, you're not making any sense. You are capable of taking in new information and learning from it, right?
 
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