JW's Preach A Different Gospel

[JFish123]

Yes. I agree with that. I dont want to knowingly seek out apostates to hear what they have to say. They are like a poisoned well... its best not to drink.

You believe apostates (those that don't agree with The Watchtower organization) to be mentally diseased? Wow Pegg. That's real Sick.

 

[JayJayDee]

I think some people need to look up 1 Tim 6:3-5.

 

[JFish123]

These are the things you are to teach and insist on.
3 If anyone teaches otherwise and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching,
4 they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions
5 and constant friction between people of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.
6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.
-1 Timothy 6:3-6
Umm... #1: sound instruction and Godly teaching. You sure the JW's have it or is this part talking against you? Considering all the evidence against the Watchtower I'd really be careful what verse you quote.
#2: Don't see "mentally diseased" anywhere. Saying or agreeing with those words is not only in VERY poor taste but of the spirit not of God. It rather shows the inside heart of some JW's who claim to be spiritually superior to "Christendom."
#3: there are Many JW's who get disfellowshipped not for unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions or having a "corrupt mind" but that they merely believe what the Bible teaches that Jesus is God or that you don't need an organization for Salvation. That's hardly "mentally diseased." It would be laughable if not so tragic you think of people that way.

 

[psychoslice]

I think some people need to look up 1 Tim 6:3-5.

Does it really matter, it only means what it means to you, or you organized belief system.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

No where does it teach that the great multitude go to heaven--it says they will be standing before the throne of God--at that point in time, no matter if one is on earth, the moon, or in heaven, they will be standing before the throne of God. Gods kingdom rule will be the only ruling power in existence( Daniel 2:44)
Now at Rev 14:3--we find a small group-numbered= 144,000= the little flock( Luke 12:32) only these are said to be bought from the earth--to heaven. these are the anointed=the bride of Christ--bought with Jesus' blood.

No where in the Bible does it say the 144,000 are in or going to heaven either. The 144,000 are only symbolically mentioned standing on Mount Zion with Jesus. If the great crowed are not really before the throne "IN" heaven, where are the angels and elders?

Rev 7:10-12 (ESVST) !" 11 And all the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures, and they fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God, 12 saying, " Amen! Blessing and glory and wisdom and thanksgiving and honor and power and might be to our God forever and ever! Amen."

Apparently the elder and the crowd are in the same place, because he asked John, "who are "THESE" clothed in white robes", he didn't say, "who are those" clothed in white robes as referring to people afar off on earth. He is referring to people in his presence.

Rev 7:13 (ESVST) 13 Then one of the elders addressed me, saying, " Who are these, clothed in white robes, and from where have they come?"

If you claim that Jesus' sacrifice was only for the 144,000, that is a false claim. Jesus giving His life as a ransom, paying a ransom, buying back what was His, He did for "ALL" not just 144,000.

1Ti 2:5-6 (ESVST) 5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all.

What does the word "ALL" mean? Can you say "ALL" and exclude something? If only the anointed are bought with the ransom, why did Paul stop at "ALL" instead of saying "who gave himself as a ransom for all anointed"?

Rom 5:15 (ESVST) 15 But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man's trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many. Did only a 144,000 die?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

The great multitude will be brought through Har-mageddon. Prov 2:21-22,,Matt 24:22---

No where does it teach that the great multitude go to heaven--it says they will be standing before the throne of God--at that point in time, no matter if one is on earth, the moon, or in heaven, they will be standing before the throne of God. Gods kingdom rule will be the only ruling power in existence( Daniel 2:44)
Now at Rev 14:3--we find a small group-numbered= 144,000= the little flock( Luke 12:32) only these are said to be bought from the earth--to heaven. these are the anointed=the bride of Christ--bought with Jesus' blood.

Its impossible with Gods justice scales applied that eternal hellfire is literal.
But if one actually believes Jesus he said--those who walk the broad and spacious path to destruction---not eternal suffering.
Only a sadist would throw a little no nothing mortal into eternal suffering for 70-90 years of sin--NEVER would a God of LOVE.

I think I understand, not really! So, I'm in Kansas and the President is the rule of the United States, so I can actually say that I am standing before the desk of the President, correct? Anyone in the United States can say, wherever they are at this moment, they are standing before the desk of the President because at this point and time he is the only rule in the US?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

1Co 6:16-20 (ESVST) 17 But he who is joined to the Lord becomes one spirit with him. 18 Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, 20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.

JW's, is this verse speaking to 1 group of people or 2 different groups of people?

 

[Yoshua]

Hi there,

Jehovah's Witnesses teach a different gospel. From their NWT Bible, wordings were changed to conform with their doctrine. Do Jehovah's Witnesses acknowledge and recognize their founder?

Thanks

 

[JayJayDee]

Jehovah's Witnesses teach a different gospel. From their NWT Bible, wordings were changed to conform with their doctrine.

Who told you that? It isn't true.
Actually the words were changed long before we came on the scene. We just changed them back to what the original words meant. We eliminated all the false doctrines of Christendom and started from scratch. I will match the NWT against any translation, any day.

Do Jehovah's Witnesses acknowledge and recognize their founder?

Of course! Our founder is Jesus Christ. It was he who appointed a "faithful and discreet slave" to feed his household of fellow slaves, their "food at the proper time" (Matt 24:44-46) Just as Jesus used humans to preach the good news about his kingdom in the first century, so he has used men today in this "time of the end" to dispense spiritual food to his disciples, to help them preach his message "in all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations" before the foretold "end" comes. (Matt 24:14)

 

[katiemygirl]

Yes. I agree with that. I dont want to knowingly seek out apostates to hear what they have to say. They are like a poisoned well... its best not to drink.

That is called spiritual manipulation and is in no way taught in the Scriptures.

The Scriptures teach disfellowship, not shunning as JW's do.

Shunning is not the same as disfellowship.

Jesus taught us how to treat our brothers and sisters who are doing wrong in Matthew 18:15-17.

"Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go lay bare his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, in order that at the mouth of two or three witnesses every matter may be established. If he does not listen to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen even to the congregation, let him be to you just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector."

Jesus did not say to never utter a word to an unrepentant wrong doer but to treat them as a tax collector. He himself spoke to and ate with tax collectors.

Jesus told us to treat the offender as a pagan or tax collector. This means to consider such a one as unsaved. How are we to treat the unsaved? With love and grace! Not shunning! They need to be brought back to the fold. We are to love even our enemies. (Matthew 5:44).

JW's will even shun their own family members, which results in the breaking up of families. Nowhere is this condoned in the Bible.

To remove someone from the membership roll of a church is not the same as shunning him. Close fellowship may be broken, but we are not commanded to break ALL ties with those in sin. We should never get to the place of writing someone off for good.

2 Thess. 3
Now we are giving YOU orders, brothers, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, to withdraw from every brother walking disorderly and not according to the tradition YOU received from us . 14 But if anyone is not obedient to our word through this letter, keep this one marked, stop associating with him, that he may become ashamed. 15 And yet do not be considering him as an enemy, but continue admonishing him as a brother.

Did you catch that? CONTINUE ADMONISHING HIM AS A BROTHER. It is impossible to admonish someone you are shunning.

Tell me, do you even pray for those you have shunned both privately and as a congregation every chance you get?

 

[katiemygirl]

You believe apostates (those that don't agree with The Watchtower organization) to be mentally diseased? Wow Pegg. That's real Sick.

Where's the love in that?

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Just as Jesus used humans to preach the good news about his kingdom in the first century, so he has used men today in this "time of the end" to dispense spiritual food to his disciples, to help them preach his message "in all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations" before the foretold "end" comes.

This is "TRUTH" the JW's teach. Jesus used humans in the "FIRST" century to preach the Gospel and now in the "LAST" century, but He didn't need or use any humans for the centuries in between.

 

[katiemygirl]

The great multitude will be brought through Har-mageddon. Prov 2:21-22,,Matt 24:22---

No where does it teach that the great multitude go to heaven--it says they will be standing before the throne of God--at that point in time, no matter if one is on earth, the moon, or in heaven, they will be standing before the throne of God. Gods kingdom rule will be the only ruling power in existence( Daniel 2:44)
Now at Rev 14:3--we find a small group-numbered= 144,000= the little flock( Luke 12:32) only these are said to be bought from the earth--to heaven. these are the anointed=the bride of Christ--bought with Jesus' blood.

Its impossible with Gods justice scales applied that eternal hellfire is literal.
But if one actually believes Jesus he said--those who walk the broad and spacious path to destruction---not eternal suffering.
Only a sadist would throw a little no nothing mortal into eternal suffering for 70-90 years of sin--NEVER would a God of LOVE.

2 Corinthians 12:2
I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago – whether in the body I do not know, or out of the body I do not know, God knows – such a man was caught up to the third heaven.

Paul parallels the third heaven with the word ‘paradise’ (v4) which is only used in two other New Testament passages (Luke 23:43; Rev 2:7). If you look at these two passages, the word ‘paradise’ is clearly equated with heaven as Jesus tells the the man who was crucified next to him “today you will be with me in paradise”. Elsewhere, Revelation 2:7 talks about the “tree of life” being in “the paradise of God” which can also be found in Revelation 22:2, 14, 19 and is equated with Heaven.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

Who told you that? It isn't true.
Actually the words were changed long before we came on the scene. We just changed them back to what the original words meant. We eliminated all the false doctrines of Christendom and started from scratch. I will match the NWT against any translation, any day.



Of course! Our founder is Jesus Christ. It was he who appointed a "faithful and discreet slave" to feed his household of fellow slaves, their "food at the proper time" (Matt 24:44-46) Just as Jesus used humans to preach the good news about his kingdom in the first century, so he has used men today in this "time of the end" to dispense spiritual food to his disciples, to help them preach his message "in all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations" before the foretold "end" comes. (Matt 24:14)

Another example of how the GB changes words to fit their teachings. The question Jesus asked, that the GB calls prophecy says that the master "HAS" set a servant over his household. But the GB likes to teach that Jesus indicated that He "WOULD" appoint a slave. I am unaware of any other prophecy that was posed in the form of a question.


Mat 24:45 (ESVST) 45 " Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom his master "HAS" set over his household, to give them their food at the proper time?


*** w10 12/15 p. 10 par. 14 Be Zealous for True Worship ***
14 In prayer to God, Jesus clearly stated: “Your word is truth.” (John 17:17) And before leaving the earthly scene, Jesus indicated that he "WOULD" appoint “the faithful and discreet slave” to provide spiritual food for his people. (Matt. 24:45)

 

[Wharton]

Who is Jesus? Specifically, how did he get from heaven to earth? Describe the process in detail. Any JW is welcome to answer.

No takers?

Let me simplify the question.

Where does Jesus get his human nature?

 

[katiemygirl]

Every eye did see him, they just didn't know it. You weren't there, but every one alive saw satan cast to the earth and he came as a devouring lion, angry, knowing his time was short, he thusly filled mens hearts with hatred all over the earth and they began slaughtering one another--millions died out of hatred--the false religious teachers allowed the young men of the same religion( supposed brothers in Christ) to stand on both sides and blow each others heads off while the teachers prayed to the same god on both sides( pure hipocrosy) pure darkness) while The JW teachers applied Jesus and refused to let the young men kill each other standing on both sides--they were branded cowards for standing up for Jesus. But the real reason satan did that was to try and stop the preaching of the good news of Gods kingdom that had begun--it worked until 1919 then came back in full force--he tried again at ww2. The same results as the first ww. They even killed their own brothers in Christ for Adolf Hitler( doesn't get any darker than this)
Gods kingdom was established in heaven in 1914( Rev 6) he received his crown)

Either the Watchtower is wrong in that Jesus was exalted as king in 1914, or the Bible is wrong in Ephesians 1.

18 I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in his holy people, 19 and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is the same as the mighty strength 20 he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, 21 far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is invoked, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. 22 And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, 23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.

Watchtower explains in the following quote when Eph. 1:20 occurred..

*** w64 8/1 p. 478 Why Two Covenants for Kingdom Power? ***

"So after Jesus had faithfully finished his earthly ministry, God “raised him up from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above every government and authority and power and lordship and every name named, not only in this system of things, but also in that to come.” (Eph. 1:20, 21) At that time, in the year 33 C.E., Psalm 110:1 applied, which says: “The utterance of Jehovah to my Lord is: ‘Sit at my right hand until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet.’”

If the Watchtower is correct that Jesus’ exaltation as King didn’t occur until 1914, then they would have to deny that this passage in Ephesians is not referring to Jesus’ exaltation as king since they have already established that it is in reference to 33 C.E.

*** w73 2/15 p. 103 Why Does “Faith in the Name” of Jesus Christ Bring Life? ***

"This helps us to understand why it is that, at Ephesians 1:21, the apostle Paul links ‘names’ with ‘governments, authorities, powers and lordships.’ We can also see that it is because God has put his Son at the head of the Kingdom government and given him all authority to carry out the divine will that Philippians 2:9-11 says that God exalted Jesus to “a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every other name, so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground, and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.”

If verse 20 occurred in 33 C.E., then it would naturally follow that the rest of the passage occurred then as well,

And what does the Watchtower quote above declare? “God has put his Son at the head of the Kingdom government and given him all authority to carry out the divine will.”

This sounds a lot like one who is exalted as king. But how can this be when the Watchtower has declared that his exaltation as king didn’t happen until 1914?

Here is the dilemma:

1. According to the Watchtower, Jesus was exalted as King in 1914 (w08 2/15 p. 21 par. 3)

2. ” ” Ephesians 1:20-22 took place in 33 C.E. (w64 8/1 p. 478)

3. ” ” Ephesians 1:20-22 refers to Christ’s exaltation as King (w73 2/15 p. 103)

So which is wrong?
Jesus was exalted as king in 1914, or Ephesians 1:20-22.

 

[Wharton]

Actually the words were changed long before we came on the scene. We just changed them back to what the original words meant. We eliminated all the false doctrines of Christendom and started from scratch. I will match the NWT against any translation, any day.

So the gates of hell prevailed against Jesus' Church until JW's came along to correct false doctrine? Jesus abandoned his sheep to Satan and to "eternal destruction" for 1800 years?

 

[savagewind]

So the gates of hell prevailed against Jesus' Church until JW's came along to correct false doctrine? Jesus abandoned his sheep to Satan and to "eternal destruction" for 1800 years?

People won't believe anything in The Bible is wrong but then they say the JW Bible wrong.

 

[katiemygirl]

The name of the thread--The JW,s preach a different gospel

6 major teachings from Jesus

Matt 6:33-- Therefore keep on seeking first the kingdom and his( Jehovah) righteousness, and all these other things will be added( sustenance, covering, spirituality)

Matt 5:5--Bleassed are the meek for they( great multitude) will inherit the earth.

The Lords prayer--Hallowed be thy( Father) name( Jehovah)--last line--the KINGDOM, POWER, and GLORY all belong to the Father.

Jesus teaches he has a God-his Father--John 20:17, Rev 3:12-- so do his real teachers--2Cor 1:3, 1Cor 8:6, 1Cor 15:24-28--- 1Peter 1:3--- Rev 1:6

At John 17:1-6,26-- Jesus teaches--the one who sent him( Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD-- verse 6 = Jehovah, 26= Jehovah

John 4:22-24--- the bottom line reality of all truth accomplished daily by the true followers= Jehovah.

its easy to see who is preaching the correct gospel--one just has to believe Jesus.

Too bad you left out all of the false teachings Watchtower promotes such as Jesus came in 1914.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

So the gates of hell prevailed against Jesus' Church until JW's came along to correct false doctrine? Jesus abandoned his sheep to Satan and to "eternal destruction" for 1800 years?

Well of course, Jesus didn't have anyone on earth to proclaim the Gospel for centuries. From the first century until 1918 there was no one on earth to proclaim the Gospel and to fix what Christendom had messed up. Jesus just let the world and everyone in it go to hell until the "PROPER TIME" when He appointed the slave. Just think of the millions of people between the first century and this present century that never got to hear the true Gospel. It is a sad thing.

Of course! Our founder is Jesus Christ. It was he who appointed a "faithful and discreet slave" to feed his household of fellow slaves, their "food at the proper time" (Matt 24:44-46) Just as Jesus used humans to preach the good news about his kingdom in the first century, so he has used men today in this "time of the end" to dispense spiritual food to his disciples, to help them preach his message "in all the inhabited earth as a witness to all the nations" before the foretold "end" comes. (Matt 24:14)