LDS: for all of you who disagree with a Prophet of God regarding Proposition 8

[want to be hindu]

You've never heard of Joseph Smith?

"And they had all things common among them; therefore there were not rich and poor, bond and free, but they were all made free, and partakers of the heavenly gift. . . . Neither were there Lamanites, nor any manner of -ites; but they were in one, the children of Christ, and heirs to the kingdom of God." (4 Nephi 1:3,17)

"But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin." (D&C 49:20)

"Nevertheless, inasmuch as they receive more than is needful for their necessities and their wants, it shall be given into my storehouse." (D&C 70:7)

"And you are to be equal, or in other words, you are to have equal claims on the properties, for the benefit of managing the concerns of your stewardships, every man according to his wants and his needs, inasmuch as his wants are just — and all this for the benefit of the church of the living God, that every man may improve upon his talent, that every man may gain other talents, yea, even an hundred fold, to be cast into the Lord’s storehouse, to become the common property of the whole church — every man seeking the interest of his neighbor, and doing all things with an eye single to the glory of God." (D&C 82:17-19)

Of course, Joseph Smith lived before Marx, so he couldn't be a Marxist. And of course, these words came through Joseph Smith rather than from Joseph Smith. It's possible that he personally disagreed with them.

Nevertheless, there's good scriptural justification for any member of the Church to believe in the fundamental Marxist principle: "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs!"

Wow the LDS church sounds Great.

 

[Katzpur]

Wow the LDS church sounds Great.

Somebody wake me up. I'm obviously dreaming.

 

[want to be hindu]

Somebody wake me up. I'm obviously dreaming.

I dont understand.

 

[Katzpur]

I dont understand.

It's just that I haven't heard someone describe my church as "great" for so long that to say it took me by surprise would be a huge understatement. People have been so quick to criticize us lately that I'm just kind of cowering in a corner hoping not to be noticed. Those on the forum who have known me for awhile know that that's not a typical response from me. I've just really been hurt by the attacks from both sides. Now, someone is sure to lay into me for saying that, but it's true. So, your saying, "Wow! The LDS Church sounds great!" was just what I needed to hear.

 

[want to be hindu]

It's just that I haven't heard someone describe my church as "great" for so long that to say it took me by surprise would be a huge understatement. People have been so quick to criticize us lately that I'm just kind of cowering in a corner hoping not to be noticed. Those on the forum who have known me for awhile know that that's not a typical response from me. I've just really been hurt by the attacks from both sides. Now, someone is sure to lay into me for saying that, but it's true. So, your saying, "Wow! The LDS Church sounds great!" was just what I needed to hear.

I am glad that I could help.

 

[Katya]

Ao what would you do if the Lord asked you to vote for Prop 8 directly? would you? or would you disagree with God and do your own thing?

What would be the outcome of doing something that the Lord asks and absolutely resenting it? If the Lord asked me to do it, I most likely would, But I would hate it. Maybe eventually I would end up hating Him?

I am so glad I don't live in the US.

 

[deseretgov]

What would be the outcome of doing something that the Lord asks and absolutely resenting it? If the Lord asked me to do it, I most likely would, But I would hate it. Maybe eventually I would end up hating Him?

I am so glad I don't live in the US.

Isn't there a scripture about if you do commandment but hat ei ththen it's worse than if you didn't do it?

I'm glad I don't live in California.

 

[madhatter85]

Isn't there a scripture about if you do commandment but hat ei ththen it's worse than if you didn't do it?

I'm glad I don't live in California.

There's a scripture in D&C that states that those who are compelled to do things are not a wise, but a slothful servant.That we, as members of the church, should seek to do all sorts of righteous things without being asked.

It's sad that the prophet even HAD to ask the members to do this, we should have been doing it automatically to begin with.

 

[deseretgov]

It's sad that the prophet even HAD to ask the members to do this, we should have been doing it automatically to begin with.

Intersting point.

 

[Watchmen]

N o S a n c t i o n

 

[Katya]

It's sad that the prophet even HAD to ask the members to do this, we should have been doing it automatically to begin with.

Why did he?

 

[madhatter85]

Why did he?

because the Lord knew the saints are not yet united in purpose. It's a sad fact that is proven here on this forum.

 

[Worshipper]

There's a scripture in D&C that states that those who are compelled to do things are not a wise, but a slothful servant.That we, as members of the church, should seek to do all sorts of righteous things without being asked.

But that means we should things that we understand to be righteous, right? We should be personally seeking out opportunities to carry out righteousness. Since it's on our own initiative, we are the ones who determine the righteousness of our own actions that we are anxiously engaged in.

Some of us see the righteousness in liberty and in retaining our liberty from governmental interference. There are many scriptures and many words from modern prophets that direct us to support liberty. Many such Latter-day Saints have been anxiously engaged in the good cause of spreading liberty, including spreading liberty to people who seek same-sex marriages. Not a few of those Latter-day Saints were opposed to Proposition 8 and have been opposed to similar legislation in other jurisdictions.

For some reason, the leadership of the Church felt a need to ask members in California to support Proposition 8, something they had not done for any other jurisdiction facing a similar referendum. This put many Californian Mormons in a bit of a moral dilemma: should they be anxiously engaged in the good cause of spreading liberty, or should they follow the Brethren and be commanded in all things?

It became a situation not of choosing good over evil, but of discerning between good and better. Many Saints in California, no doubt prayerfully, determined that the better course was to support Prop 8. Many Saints in California, no doubt just as prayerfully, determined that the better course was to oppose Prop 8. Saints in both groups were serving God — some by seeking to spread liberty, others by following counsel from the Brethren. Each group took the initiative to do what they felt it was better for them to do.

So that direction in the Doctrine and Covenants was followed on both sides.

 

[Katya]

because the Lord knew the saints are not yet united in purpose. It's a sad fact that is proven here on this forum.

That makes sense. :yes:

Been wondering why it is that I oppose prop 8. I see it as it takes the away their free agency. They have the right to choose whatever lifestyle they want. We all do, so I don't ever want to take that away from anyone.

 

[madhatter85]

we are not taking away thier free-agency. they can feel free to love whomever they want. why is it such a big deal to them since it's only till death to they part anyways. they have no opportunity together in the afterlife. homosexuality does not exist in the hereafter.

 

[zippythepinhead]

I did not vote for Prop 8 as I am not in California. But I did vote for the Utah Constitutional Ammendment a few years back. It was more of a battle here than people think.

But I always vote my conscience. I never vote a certain way because the "bretheren have told me to".

If I have a conflict with anything coming from the First Presidency or other high church officials, I ponder and pray about the issue at hand, and hope that my mind is open enough to support the church leaders if I initially disagree with them AND if it is revelation from God and not just a church leader's opinion, which is not divinely inspired. May be good counsel, but opinions of even men of God are not always inspired.