Let's not talk about the Big Bang

[Polymath257]

Yes, I ignored your references, because they were meaningless concerning whether there is continuous time/space at the smallest scale of the behavior of Quantum particles.

Of course there is movement of Quantum particles, but NO continuous time/space nor gravity.

Reference to the Hydrogen atom IS NOT at the Quantum level of particles.

OK, how about Peskin&Schroder's book on quantum field theory that is specifically about particle physics?

At no point in the entire book do they even consider anything other than a continuous spacetime. And that is an absolutely standard textbook in the subject.

So, yes, the standard references do have continuous spacetime. Thos that discuss gravity do so on a continous spacetine background OR are pure speculation.

 

[Polymath257]

Still not addressing the issue here. Duck Bob and Weasel You made aclaim back it up Cite one source that proposes that continuous space/time and gravity as in the universe exists at the quantum smallest scale.

Weinberg's book on Quantum Field Theories.

Your ignorance is appalling. I cited references and they were ignored. I may cite more.

Please cite some that show any backing by actual observations.

 

[shunyadragon]

OK, how about Peskin&Schroder's book on quantum field theory that is specifically about particle physics?

At no point in the entire book do they even consider anything other than a continuous spacetime. And that is an absolutely standard textbook in the subject.

So, yes, the standard references do have continuous spacetime. Thos that discuss gravity do so on a continous spacetine background OR are pure speculation.

Not meaningful without specific citation and quotes..

 

[shunyadragon]

Another evidence-free assertion. The entire analysis uses continuous space and time. Every single analysis in standard QM does the same. There is no quantisation of space and time in the theory of quantum mechanics. That is a simple fact. Go check. If you find something that claims otherwise, then stop with the empty assertions and post it.


This doesn't make any sense. The quantum nature of particles is exactly what allows us to understand and analyse atoms. The hydrogen atom being the simplest.

You have never actually studied this, have you?


Patently false. It is you who is doing anything but address the issue. You have not cited a single reference that backs up your claim about current accepted science having anything other than continuous space-time. Not one solitary reference. Your continued demands that other people cite evidence both ignores what has already been done, and is a clear case of trying to shift the burden of proof.

ETA:

And this is patently false, as well. The references you did supply were not ignored, it was pointed out that they were about hypotheses, and not current science. We are still waiting for the any reference at all that backs up your claim.

Your references failed miserable to address the subject as specifically described. Neither demonstrated continuous time at the Quantum scale as in the large scale world as you described concerning the Hydrogen atom.which is NOT at the Quantum scale.

 

[Audie]

1. quantum physics is irrelevant to whether the Earth hangs or not.
2. The description was not due to Moses.
3. The description is not apt. If fails to point out the very relevant fact that the Earth moves.

Yes, this is your claim. but the quality of the text shows it to be written by a person, not a deity. And not even a person inspired by a deity: just an ordinary person showing the ignorance of the time.

Seriously.

Personally, I was disappointed with the Bible,
The way its talked up you'd think it was
going to read like what a Master of the Universe
would write.

It's really quite boring, among other things.

If it were first published this year, it woul have
to be a vanity press thing.

Nobody would read it.

 

[YoursTrue]

1. quantum physics is irrelevant to whether the Earth hangs or not.
2. The description was not due to Moses.
3. The description is not apt. If fails to point out the very relevant fact that the Earth moves.

Yes, this is your claim. but the quality of the text shows it to be written by a person, not a deity. And not even a person inspired by a deity: just an ordinary person showing the ignorance of the time.

Nothing you can say (not just you, but you also in the plural) can make any sense in reference to downing the Bible. Thanks for the discussions though, much appreciated. Hope things work out well for you. Bye for now...

 

[YoursTrue]

First, although the books were traditionally ascribed to Moses, he wrote none of them. None of the books exist in the Late Bronze Age (c 1590 - c 1100 BCE),

The earliest inscriptions is the Silver Scrolls found in the cave at Ketef Hinnom, dated to somewhere between 630 and 590 BCE, before the final destruction of Jerusalem in 587 BCE, by Nebuchadnezzar’s forces. The inscriptions is of the priestly blessings passage in Numbers 6. There are no mention of Moses or Aaron in these inscriptions.

But no Genesis (as well as the Exodus) exist before the 6th century BCE. Moses was likely invented hero by the priesthood during the Exile, as were Adam to Jacob in Genesis.

Second.

Genesis 1:1-2 described the Earth being void covered in water. There are no mention of rocks anywhere in these 2 verses. It never described rocky planet, just a primeval watery beginning, just like the Egyptian myths of Atum and Ra, where the primeval water or abyss is called Nu, and like the like the two primeval waters Engur (Nammu, Akkadian Tiamat) and Abzu (Akkadian Apsu) in Sumerian and Akkadian myths.

Nothing in the verses mentioned there being sun or stars.

And void means “empty space”, which contradicted verse that say the Earth was nothing but water. Water isn’t a void.

Clearly, you don’t know how to read, don’t know how interpret & understand your own scriptures.

Nothing can be construed in various ways. As I have said, and I thank you for the conversation,
Nothing you can say (not just you, but you also in the plural) can make any sense in reference to downing the Bible. Thanks for the discussions though, much appreciated. Hope things work out well for you. Bye for now...

 

[YoursTrue]

It's not hanging. It's moving in a geodesic because of gravity but things don't hang in space. They are at rest or in motion. You hang something in your closet because gravity is pulling it down. When in space there are no forces acting on it to "hang".
There is also no firmament or cosmic water above heaven. Or doors that open to allow the cosmic water to fall to Earth for rain or floods. The firmament divided the cosmic waters from Earth and all the stars and planets are under it. None of that exists. Except in Genesis.

Biblical cosmology - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Just in case you missed my recent posts, I'll say thank you for offering your thoughts and opinions on things. After reading as much as I could about your views (your being in the plural), I have concluded that the Bible is the best book in the world. Thank you, though.

 

[YoursTrue]

That is an unproven hypothesis.

Let me be clear on this matter. After reading many posts by many here, I have concluded that the Bible is the best book in the world. So take care. Thanks again. I've offered my thoughts, you've offered yours. Take care again and many thanks.

 

[YoursTrue]

Life has likely been erupting and ceasing long before the big bang elsewhere for eternity which clearly dosent require any God for it to happen.

At risk of repeating what I've said to others, I would like to thank you for offering your opinions and thoughts. I have concluded, based on these discussions, that the Bible is absolutely the best book in the world. Take care.

 

[shunyadragon]

At risk of repeating what I've said to others, I would like to thank you for offering your opinions and thoughts. I have concluded, based on these discussions, that the Bible is absolutely the best book in the world. Take care.

No matter how great the book it might bt it dtill lacks science.

 

[We Never Know]

At the Quantum smallest scall there is momentary Quantum time and appearance and decay of individual Quantum events involving particles. There is no continuous time/space or gravity at the Quantum scale. This has been confirmed by the research at the Hadron collider. Continuous time/space and gravity are considered emergent properties from the Quantum scale.

I'm done with the discussion.(its near equivalent to talking about a god with believers)

It is because "it just is".(that's real science)

Good luck.

 

[YoursTrue]

No matter how great the book it might bt it dtill lacks science.

The writers were not "scientists." Thanks, and have a great day. Bye for now. The Bible is the greatest book ever written. That's it. that is my conclusion after reading the objections to what the Bible says. again -- have a good day/evening/24 hours, hours of daylight, etc. Take care.

 

[We Never Know]

The writers were not "scientists." Thanks, and have a great day. Bye for now. The Bible is the greatest book ever written. That's it. that is my conclusion after reading the objections to what the Bible says. again -- have a good day/evening/24 hours, hours of daylight, etc. Take care.

That you think and/or accept that is great!
Not everyone sees it that way.
Let it guide and help you in your life but don't expect others to share your belief or you may be let down.

 

[YoursTrue]

That you think and/or accept that is great!
Not everyone sees it that way.
Let it guide and help you in your life but don't expect others to share your belief or your may be let down.

You're right, although I am surprised at many of the supercilious attitudes here. As well as the projections as to 'how' it all happened. Frankly, for this I am grateful. It was interesting though.

 

[We Never Know]

You're right, although I am surprised at many of the supercilious attitudes here. As well as the projections as to 'how' it all happened. Frankly, for this I am grateful. It was interesting though.

Here's the kicker....
The one's you think are supercilious and/or projecting..... They probably think the same about you....
That's why IMO discussing a god, which can neither be proven or disproven is pointless.
Its all about choice..one chooses to believe or chooses not to believe.

 

[YoursTrue]

Here's the kicker....
The one's you think are supercilious and/or projecting..... They probably think the same about you....
That's why IMO discussing a god, which can neither be proven or disproven is pointless.
Its all about choice..one chooses to believe or chooses not to believe.

That could be true about attitudes, or how one perceives them. On the other hand, I have stated more than once that I used to be an atheist. I even understand an atheist's argument against God and the Bible. A person said to me long ago, and I was astounded, but afterwards it made sense to me -- "Only God can give you the gift of faith."

 

[We Never Know]

That could be true about attitudes, or how one perceives them. On the other hand, I have stated more than once that I used to be an atheist. I even understand an atheist's argument against God and the Bible. A person said to me long ago, and I was astounded, but afterwards it made sense to me -- "Only God can give you the gift of faith."

Optimistic frubal.

Best wishes in your journey's

 

[YoursTrue]

Optimistic frubal.

Best wishes in your journey's

Thank you. My journey is just beginning, even though I started on it years ago. Take care.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That could be true about attitudes, or how one perceives them. On the other hand, I have stated more than once that I used to be an atheist. I even understand an atheist's argument against God and the Bible. A person said to me long ago, and I was astounded, but afterwards it made sense to me -- "Only God can give you the gift of faith."

You may have been an atheist. But that is highly doubtful. You do not appear to be a rationalist at all. Rational arguments are something that you tend to run away from.


People can be "atheists" for bad reasons. The classis is of an "atheist that hates God". If God does not exist it makes no sense to be mad at him. If a person loses a loved one they can become that sort of "atheist". They tend to go back to the faith that they came from. For Christians when they realize that the God of the Bible is immoral no matter how you look at it that is the start to realizing that the God of the Bible is just a man made creation which of course has man made mistakes in its dogma.