Magical Humanitarianism

[1137]

I really have no idea what you're talking about...Why is it considered "fluffy"? Crystals, candle healing, pyramid healing and so forth have been able to work for others. There's crystal workers I know that aren't psychologists and do fairly well. Not to mention there's many healing remedies with plants. I don't see why it should be illegal or what kind of "bad places" it leads to.

Giving someone something to put in their body or manipulating someone's mind should both only be done by trained professionals.

 

[Quintessence]

Giving someone something to put in their body or manipulating someone's mind should both only be done by trained professionals.

And because there's no such thing as a "trained professional" when it comes to those who practice spellcraft, you're against this sort of thing wholesale? Is that the rationale?

 

[1137]

And because there's no such thing as a "trained professional" when it comes to those who practice spellcraft, you're against this sort of thing wholesale? Is that the rationale?

There are trained naturalistic doctors actually. In fact I see one.

 

[Quintessence]

There are trained naturalistic doctors actually. In fact I see one.

What I mean is that there is no such thing as any organization that trains and certifies people in the practice of spellcraft. There's no organization in control of licensure for witches, mages, and wizards. I'm not speaking to their certification in other things.

 

[Theweirdtophat]

Giving someone something to put in their body or manipulating someone's mind should both only be done by trained professionals.

There are trained professionals and of course amateurs wouldn't really do something big like that but they wouldn't "manipulate" so much as change and heal and protect so I don't know where you got the idea of manipulation.

 

[1137]

What I mean is that there is no such thing as any organization that trains and certifies people in the practice of spellcraft. There's no organization in control of licensure for witches, mages, and wizards. I'm not speaking to their certification in other things.

Give the field of psychology a bit longer.

There are trained professionals and of course amateurs wouldn't really do something big like that but they wouldn't "manipulate" so much as change and heal and protect so I don't know where you got the idea of manipulation.

All magic is manipulation.

 

[Theweirdtophat]

Give the field of psychology a bit longer.



All magic is manipulation.

No, not all of it. Such magic, such as the stuff I practice involves working with forces and have a good relationship with it. I'm not submissive nor dominant when it comes to forces. I work with forces not compel them or manipulate them to do my bidding or anything like that.

 

[1137]

I. DEFINITION:
MAGICK

is the Science and Art of causing Change to occur in conformity with Will.*

(Illustration: It is my Will to inform the World of certain facts within my knowledge. I therefore take "magical weapons," pen, ink, and paper; I write "incantations"—these sentences—in the "magical language" i.e. that which is understood by people I wish to instruct. I call forth "spirits" such as printers, publishers, booksellers, and so forth, and constrain them to convey my message to those people. The composition and distribution is thus an act of

MAGICK

by which I cause Changes to take place in conformity with my Will.)

II. POSTULATE:
ANY required Change may be effected by application of the proper kind and degree of Force in the proper manner through the proper medium to the proper object.

(Illustration: I wish to prepare an ounce of Chloride of Gold. I must take the right kind of acid, nitro-hydrochloric and no other, in sufficient quantity and of adequate strength, and place it, in a vessel which will not break, leak or corrode, in such a manner as will not produce undesirable results, with the necessary quantity of Gold, and so forth. Every Change has its own conditions.

In the present state of our knowledge and power some changes are not possible in practice; we cannot cause eclipses, for instance, or transform lead into tin, or create men from mushrooms. But it is theoretically possible to cause in any object any change of which that object is capable by nature; and the conditions are covered by the above postulate.)



Aleister, C. (1954). Magick Without Tears. Retrieved February 4, 2015, from What is Magick? - Chapter I of Magick Without Tears by Aleister Crowley

 

[Theweirdtophat]

I. DEFINITION:
MAGICK

is the Science and Art of causing Change to occur in conformity with Will.*

(Illustration: It is my Will to inform the World of certain facts within my knowledge. I therefore take "magical weapons," pen, ink, and paper; I write "incantations"—these sentences—in the "magical language" i.e. that which is understood by people I wish to instruct. I call forth "spirits" such as printers, publishers, booksellers, and so forth, and constrain them to convey my message to those people. The composition and distribution is thus an act of

MAGICK

by which I cause Changes to take place in conformity with my Will.)

II. POSTULATE:
ANY required Change may be effected by application of the proper kind and degree of Force in the proper manner through the proper medium to the proper object.

(Illustration: I wish to prepare an ounce of Chloride of Gold. I must take the right kind of acid, nitro-hydrochloric and no other, in sufficient quantity and of adequate strength, and place it, in a vessel which will not break, leak or corrode, in such a manner as will not produce undesirable results, with the necessary quantity of Gold, and so forth. Every Change has its own conditions.

In the present state of our knowledge and power some changes are not possible in practice; we cannot cause eclipses, for instance, or transform lead into tin, or create men from mushrooms. But it is theoretically possible to cause in any object any change of which that object is capable by nature; and the conditions are covered by the above postulate.)

Aleister, C. (1954). Magick Without Tears. Retrieved February 4, 2015, from What is Magick? - Chapter I of Magick Without Tears by Aleister Crowley

This is one of many definitions of magic and I don't deny that it causes change, but it depends on HOW you change it. Through working with forces or compelling them or something else. Again I don't see any reason why healers or protectors can't do it for others as long as they know what they are doing, regardless if they have a sheet of paper saying they are allowed to. Having something telling you that you're certified doesn't make you certified. There are shamans and clerics that have done good things without having permission from some other authority.

 

[1137]

This is one of many definitions of magic and I don't deny that it causes change, but it depends on HOW you change it. Through working with forces or compelling them or something else. Again I don't see any reason why healers or protectors can't do it for others as long as they know what they are doing, regardless if they have a sheet of paper saying they are allowed to. Having something telling you that you're certified doesn't make you certified. There are shamans and clerics that have done good things without having permission from some other authority.

There needs to be some sort of process to determine if one "knows what they are doing". I mean, whose to say? And if there is a way to tell, why not just set up official testing? You know what happens when all you give your sick child is prayer? You go to prison. That's how it should be.

 

[Quintessence]

I think this is becoming more of a debate than is appropriate in a DIR, guys.

 

[1137]

You could make it same faith. It's a fairly debatable topic.