Megachurches

[logician]

What do the posters on RF think about the rise of the megachurch? Is it a spiritually identical way of obtaining religious nourishment contrasted to the traditional church setting? Does it turn religious worship into a cheap, commercially-run affair? Does it help to draw in people who might not have attended a church otherwise due to the stereotyped views of a church setting? What are your views?

BONUS QUESTION: Has anyone attended a service at a megachurch, or is a member of one of these churches, and wants to tell us about their experiences?

Don't like em, when the church lets out, they have to have police block traffic just so they can get out of the parking lot.

 

[Ringer]

I've been to one mega-church in Milwaukee a few years ago. Apparently, people equate mega-churches with a Benny Hinn services of faith healing and what not. The services I went to wasn't anything like it. In fact, it seemed pretty similar to the average sized church I attend on a weekly basis. I thought the message was very good, they didn't make a huge dealing about the offering, the music was very interesting and at that particular service they had a few foriegn musicians playing some worship songs. I know the biggest issue for me if I went to a mega-church would be feel as though I was connected. The church advertised a bunch of programs and groups and they encouraged people to take part in them. I'm not the type to jump into social groups so I doubt I would have done something like that even if I attended the church regularly (something I won't do if given the chance). It's probably many people's cup of tea but it isn't mine. At the same time, I dont' equate mega-churches with being evil. There are many signs of a healthy church as there are with a corrupt one. I'm not so sure size is a definite indication.

 

[Storm]

Both are houses of worship. I'm not entirely sure what you're getting at here, tbh.

And there's no rent or mortgage to pay? May I assume you meet in someone's house?

Well, he's our priest. He leads the preaching and rituals. He's also our big bank o' knowledge. He also makes some *****in' mead.

Does he commit his full time to this, or hold down another job?

A true man of god would not expect money for preaching.

Just preaching? No. But ministers devote their entire lives to their congregations, at the expense of holding down another job. They deserve to be compensated.

Also, buying big churches and such is wasteful. Church member's homes, or hell, the great outdoors are much better alternatives.

For small congregations, sure. But what about large ones, like mine? we regularly have 500 people at services (2 services during the school year) and I've heard we have about 800 kids in RE.

As for the great outdoors, we're in the Pac NW. The great outdoors is rather miserable 9 months of the year.

 

[Zephyr]

And there's no rent or mortgage to pay? May I assume you meet in someone's house?

Correct. There's no rent or mortgage to pay beyond what would have been paid anyways. When we meet indoors, it is at a home.

Does he commit his full time to this, or hold down another job?

He sells beer for a living. Not gonna lie, he makes a damn good stout.

Just preaching? No. But ministers devote their entire lives to their congregations, at the expense of holding down another job. They deserve to be compensated.

They shouldn't though. If a minister can't support himself without donations, he should find a job.

For small congregations, sure. But what about large ones, like mine? we regularly have 500 people at services (2 services during the school year) and I've heard we have about 800 kids in RE.

That's ridiculous. Far too large. I can't even imagine being in a service with more than 50 people.

As for the great outdoors, we're in the Pac NW. The great outdoors is rather miserable 9 months of the year.

So am I. Western WA, south sound. Our rain isn't miserable, it's awesome.

 

[Storm]

That's ridiculous. Far too large. I can't even imagine being in a service with more than 50 people.

Fine, don't come. But respect my choice in return.

 

[Zephyr]

Fine, don't come. But respect my choice in return.

Feel free. I was just saying that a congregation that size would feel just far too large for me. If big groups work for you, more power to ya

 

[Ringer]

Feel free. I was just saying that a congregation that size would feel just far too large for me. If big groups work for you, more power to ya

You probably would have enjoyed the underground church when Christianity was just getting started.

 

[Zephyr]

You probably would have enjoyed the underground church when Christianity was just getting started.

I honestly don't know a whole lot about early Christianity, but I've heard that a lot of plain people hold services in member's homes, which I can certainly relate to and support. You really feel the importance of community when your congregation is that closely-knit.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I think they are the biggest disgrace of Christianity. Expecting and demanding a certain amount of tithes, spending on there selves instead of the poor, and a gaudy setting, at least in the Bible I have, is not at all what Jesus taught.

 

[blackout]

I really don't care what people do anymore.

If they want to support a psudo religious country club...
it's not my business.

I was an out of church christian for a couple years
before leaving christianity for good.
During those years it really bothered me as a christian
that people spent ANY money on mortgages for church buildings.
We all have homes, no? Yards? Parks.... etc etc...

But as I say, I really couldn't care less anymore what people do or don't do with their money,
or their religion.... AS LONG AS they are NOT trying to "legislate" their religious rules to Law.
Keep your thing private... pay for it yourself... and I really don't care.

 

[Copernicus]

I think that the megachurches are a reflection of radical shifts in religious (particularly Protestant Christian) belief. The doctrinal differences that separated the traditional Christian denominations have been eroding.

As an American citizen, I really resent megachurches because they are a serious drain on local taxpayer-funded services such as police, garbage pickup, fire departments, etc. I wish that they could be zoned away from residential areas, where they would cause less congestion and traffic pollution.

 

[keithnurse]

Small churches that meet in homes or parks or whereever are not immune to problems. Sometimes they degenerate into gossip clubs or debate clubs or become inwardly focused "cliques" thinking only about their own wants with no concern for the world. Of course, all of this can happen in any size group. I am just saying "don't idealize small house churches".

 

[rojse]

An article on the radio recently discussed the rise of megachurches catering for Islam. Does anyone know about Islamic megachurches (or have had experiences in them) and would like to share?

 

[gnomon]

What do the posters on RF think about the rise of the megachurch? Is it a spiritually identical way of obtaining religious nourishment contrasted to the traditional church setting? Does it turn religious worship into a cheap, commercially-run affair? Does it help to draw in people who might not have attended a church otherwise due to the stereotyped views of a church setting? What are your views?

BONUS QUESTION: Has anyone attended a service at a megachurch, or is a member of one of these churches, and wants to tell us about their experiences?

A megachurch is no more or less spiritual than a solitary monk, a guru on the mountain, some pagans doing pagan things.........anyone.

 

[Smoke]

Does it turn religious worship into a cheap, commercially-run affair?

No. In order to have a megachurch, you have to accept marketing as evangelism and commerce as religion first. Only then can you have a megachurch.

Joel Osteen, whom I find rather likable, makes no bones about running his church as a family business. At least he's honest about it. Franklin Graham notes that "Just being the son of Billy Graham won't get me into heaven." It will, however, get him to be President of the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association, which sponsored his father's "Crusades" and sponsors Franklin's "Festivals" and Franklin's son Will's "Celebrations".

Because that's the way it works. They have mortgages and ministers to pay, before you even get to charity.

Everybody knows they have expenses; the question is whether such expenditures are necessary or desirable.

The local Quaker meeting meets in a private school. They pay a fee, but nothing like what they'd pay for a mortgage and upkeep on a building. They have no plans to buy land or construct a meetinghouse, being content with the present arrangement. Having no clergy, they obviously don't have any paid clergy. What are they missing?

I see that others have interpreted this as being about the Priest's wages. What about the services that this priest performs for his parishoners?

What about them? Are they separate from his service to God? Is it proper to sell such services?

Just preaching? No. But ministers devote their entire lives to their congregations, at the expense of holding down another job.

Do they, as part of this total dedication, remain unmarried and childless? Is it possible to be dedicated to your congregation while bringing up children, but not while holding a job? Why?

Are the paid staff the only people who are devoted to the congregation?

The Mormons don't pay their bishops or stake presidents. Do you think this makes them less effective? Do Mormon congregations suffer from this arrangement?

I don't necessarily object to paid clergy. When I was a Christian, my priest supported himself and his family by working as a public school teacher. It made for a very full day, every day. It wasn't always easy for him. I can see the advantages in having a paid clergy; I just object to the idea that a paid clergy and a mortgage are necessary operating expenses -- not to mention the fact that some clergy are paid very well indeed. I know a number of Christian clergy who make in excess of $100,000 a year, and I'm sure there are megachurch pastors for whom 100 grand is peanuts.

 

[Storm]

Everybody knows they have expenses; the question is whether such expenditures are necessary or desirable.

Necessary, no. Desirable depends on the congregation. My church just opened a day shelter for the homeless in our facilities. If we met in a school, as you suggest, it wouldn't have happened.

I'm not saying our way is the only way, Smoke. Just that it's legitimate.

 

[Charity]

The size of the church should not change the intent of the heart.

It all just depends on ones preference.....

 

[Smoke]

I'm not saying our way is the only way, Smoke. Just that it's legitimate.

And I'm not saying it's never legitimate. Just that it bears thinking about.

 

[Falvlun]

I had a couple of friends and acquaintances who attended various megachurches. Rather than getting lost in the crowd, it seemed the opposite happened. Their lives completely revolved around the church: small groups, services, prayer groups, youth groups, etc. Not to mention, some form of service was heavily encouraged, ie, leading a group, being involved in the music or technical production, working in the nursury, etc etc. There was something to do nearly every night a week, and I know some of them felt pretty guilty if they couldn't make something.

I'm sure many Christians see this and think "wow, that's how we should be living our lives", but it seemed a bit overwhelming and suffocating from my point of view.

 

[Storm]

And I'm not saying it's never legitimate. Just that it bears thinking about.

You say that like you think I haven't.