Miracles

[PolyHedral]

All miracles in the Bible can be accomplished by technology that is feasible for us to create at some stage in the future.

I now invite you to refute this hypothesis.

However, since I need some reasoning, here's how to accomplish the ten plagues of Egypt with nanotechnology:

• Rivers of blood: The components of blood can be found inside the atmosphere, and inside any fish living in the Nile. (and possibly in the Nile itself) Assembling these components into a blood-like substance is relatively simple, especially if it can be done up-river, out of sight of any passersby.
• Frogs: A combination of cloning and growth-acceleration should produce this effect.
• Lice: Same as frogs.
• Flies: Ditto, creating cloning facilities as necessary.
• Disease: Even easier than the frogs/lice/flies, since any civilization advanced enough to have this nanotech will know their cellular biology well enough to create a made-to-order disease.
• Boils: Same as disease. You could even directly construct the boils if you wanted.
• Thunder and hail: Trickier. Might be achieved by fiddling with the temperatures of parts of the atmosphere around Egypt.
• Locusts: See flies/frogs/lice.
• Darkness: Atmosphere fiddling to create a continuous cloud blanket. Another possibility is a construction in geostationary orbit.
• Death of first born: Death and cell age will tell you who is first-born of whom. Death is trivial.

 

[Rakhel]

Okay so if we have the technology now to do this stuff, what did they use then?

 

[Michigan Atheist]

Okay so if we have the technology now to do this stuff, what did they use then?

They didn't use anything, they never happened, they were analogies for telling a story, nothing more. Miracles do not exist, they are at best coincidence, at worst they are merely superstition.

 

[Breathe]

Whilst I do not think it is likely that these events happened as written in the Bible, I like to keep an open mind on them.

I did a quick google and found this. It gives interesting naturalistic explanations for the plagues of Egypt, but there are probably other ones that may make more sense.

Biblical plagues really happened say scientists - Telegraph

The problem with the naturalistic explanations, is that they lose the whole point.
"And the whole point was that you didn't come out of Egypt by natural causes, you came out by the hand of God."

Source: Article

 

[Rakhel]

"it never happened" is a cheap cop out. come on. give a better agruement.

plagues of locusts, frogs and flies have happened in the near past, so to insinuate that the bible is lying is a fabrication within itself.

You want a better explanation for the plagues happening in the time they did? try a volcano. you might not get laughed at next time.

 

[Breathe]

You want a better explanation for the plagues happening in the time they did? try a volcano.

Nice suggestion.

Interestingly, it mentions volcanoes in the article I posted. I remember watching something that mentioned a volcano being one of the possible causes for the events.

 

[Rakhel]

I haven't read the article. It is one of the few things that makes it make sense.

 

[fallingblood]

Miracles may be able to be done by technology that we have today. However, that does not mean that miracles do not exist. More so, trying to explain away ancient "miracles" with modern technology doesn't work.

 

[PolyHedral]

Okay so if we have the technology now to do this stuff, what did they use then?

We don't have the tech to do it now, but we will at some point in the future. I'm basically asking whether there is something "divine" in the Bible that cannot be replicated by sufficiently advanced understanding.

More so, trying to explain away ancient "miracles" with modern technology doesn't work

Of course it doesn't. Trying to explain away ancient miracles with future technology does, though.

 

[BucephalusBB]

Humans get jalous so quickly..

 

[PolyHedral]

Humans get jalous so quickly..

Please elaborate.

 

[BucephalusBB]

Please elaborate.

Only in case of asuming God actually did those miracles, we humans apparently want to recreate all he did, ..jalous..

 

[Levite]

I confess that I seem to be missing the point of this thread. Granted that most, if not all, of the miracles mentioned in the Hebrew Bible could be recreated with technology (either current and actual, current and hypothetical, or hypothetical and possible within the next relatively short period of time), what difference would that make?

Are you arguing that such technologies were somehow available to people two, three or four thousand years ago? Or that the miracles were actually not miracles, but engineered by some other beings, perhaps space aliens? Or are you recommending that we replicate the effects of the miracles with technology in order to use them as weapons with some sort of distasteful symbolic meaning?

I really am not seeing why this hypothesis is relevant to anything.

 

[PolyHedral]

Or that the miracles were actually not miracles, but engineered by some other beings, perhaps space aliens?

My point is that there is no reason to attribute some unattainable "divine" quality to God, when all of his actions are replicable. It's entirely possible that "God" is the engineering of some alien being, or even time-travelling humans. Reports of God's power have been greatly exaggerated, perhaps.

 

[logician]

Just because an event has no current explanation, does not mean there isn't one, or that one is not forthcoming. By definition, miracles can't happen, because they defy physical laws.

 

[Levite]

My point is that there is no reason to attribute some unattainable "divine" quality to God, when all of his actions are replicable. It's entirely possible that "God" is the engineering of some alien being, or even time-travelling humans. Reports of God's power have been greatly exaggerated, perhaps.

Well, personally I find little inspiration or potential for spiritual elevation in that notion, but whatever works for you, I guess.

If one doesn't want to believe in God, nothing will change one's mind, and one will always find reasons not to have faith.

In any case, I won't argue the point, since it's just a matter of personal belief.

 

[Boethiah]

My point is that there is no reason to attribute some unattainable "divine" quality to God, when all of his actions are replicable. It's entirely possible that "God" is the engineering of some alien being, or even time-travelling humans. Reports of God's power have been greatly exaggerated, perhaps.

What do you plan on accomplishing here?

 

[Tathagata]

Technology cannot do miracles. When technology does it, it's simply advanced technology, NOT a miracle. Miracles happen when the laws of nature are suspended. Technology does not defy the laws of nature.

i.e. Man walks on water without technology. Miracle. Man walks on water with technology. Not a miracle.


.

 

[fallingblood]

Just because an event has no current explanation, does not mean there isn't one, or that one is not forthcoming. By definition, miracles can't happen, because they defy physical laws.

Incorrect. Miracles, by definition, are the least likely outcome of an event. That does not mean they can not happen.

 

[luvuyesua]

I would like to speak of beautiful miracles, that happened in 1531, in Mexico city during the time that the Christian Catholics ignorantly imposed their religion (Ill just call it inorant) Mother Mary appeared to a simple man that was named Juan Diego (indian name Cuahtlatcouac) and told him to go and tell the bishop that she wanted a temple built on the hill of Tepeyac. The bishop didnt want to believe him and said to bring proof. December 12, Mother Mary asked him to go to the bush up on the hill and pick all the roses (roses are dormant during winter but maybe technology) She told him to pick the roses and hold it in the ayate (sarpe type) and to not show it to anyone else but the bishop. He went and waited to see the bishop. when he finally was in front of the bishop he showed the roses and and let them fall on his table, the bishop fell to his knees because the image of Mother Mary exactly how Juan had seen her was imprinted on the ayate. well ofcourse temple was made as she wanted a temple where people would come and love Jesus, (but that is another story) Technology all through the years has tested with what they had and now have and still come up the same.
1, the paint is not of this earth
2. the eyes dialate the same in the darknes and light as ours do
3. it holds the temperature of 97.5
4. since it has the symbol of pregnancy, with a stethiscope you can here the heart beat at 180 per minute like the one of a baby in a womb.
5. an ayate only lasts well kept 35 years, and has recently been tested with acid on a tip and it reweaved itself.
6. my favorite. with technologies red laser beam they wanted to measure the thickness and to their surprise, found that the image, is point something (I can get exat #) seperated from the ayate it is huvering in front of the ayate, literally floating in the air
yes technology is great, it proved all that. technology has come from all parts of the world. many intelligent men came with the intention to disprove it. and would assume their hearts about it left different.

and this is a kick, not to long ago maybe less than 30yrs, a fanatic of some kind went in with a bomb and put in under the frame, where the ayate is, when it went off a Golden plated cross that was under it also bent forward as if to cover the bomb and nothing happened to the frame (coincidence maybe)

blessings during this chrisis to all