Most high school biology teachers don’t endorse evolution

[camanintx]

this is true, and in terms of evolution there already is evidence building that invalidates the 'common ancestor' aspect of evolution.

I must have missed it. Did they find a precambrian rabbit that I didn't hear about?

 

[waitasec]

the parants of some of the kids have the children so brainswashed they wont learn no matter how much or well you teach them.

this is a horrible issue in the bible belt states, it will take generations to get this illness wiped out.

i remember my science teacher taught evolution and i "challenged" her with my religious beliefs...
needless to say, i now understand because i realized i had limited knowledge. to think i thought i could challenged her is actually a humiliating reminder of my own ignorant arrogance...
something to avoid as much as possible.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Pegg...
I am surprised you are arguing these points...Your JW faith Is as clear on this issue, as they are on many other issues that most other Christian faiths find as unfounded.
We usually find that JW's back their claims with passages from their Bible, but stand firm on their own churches interpretation, and simply do not debate in the normal convention.

I do not quite understand why you have chosen to debate this, when your faith has a closed mind on this issue.

 

[Pegg]

Pegg...
I am surprised you are arguing these points...Your JW faith Is as clear on this issue, as they are on many other issues that most other Christian faiths find as unfounded.
We usually find that JW's back their claims with passages from their Bible, but stand firm on their own churches interpretation, and simply do not debate in the normal convention.

I do not quite understand why you have chosen to debate this, when your faith has a closed mind on this issue.

Yes we are clear on this issue, but i think its a misconception that we aren't willing to discuss the issue

we spend millions of combined hours every month in our ministry speaking about such things

 

[Ubjon]

Yes we are clear on this issue, but i think its a misconception that we aren't willing to discuss the issue

we spend millions of combined hours every month in our ministry speaking about such things

You discuss it but you do so on the basis that regardleess of the evidence for evolution your beliefs ultimately have precedence? This is part of the problem. There are religious people who are intellegent and understand the science but they are unable to set aside their religious beliefs even when its clear the science is the better explanation.

 

[jarofthoughts]

As a Science teacher I thought I should weigh in with my two cents on this.

When we were learning about dinosaurs (always a popular subject) I got a question from one of the Muslim pupils who asked me: "Did Adam and Eve live at the same time as the dinosaurs?"
To which I replied: "The question you are asking is a question of belief which would make it more fitting for the Religion class. This is a Science class and here we deal with things we know."

I then of course then went on to explain the massive time-gap between humans and the dinosaurs.

 

[DarkSun]

As a Science teacher I thought I should weigh in with my two cents on this.

When we were learning about dinosaurs (always a popular subject) I got a question from one of the Muslim pupils who asked me: "Did Adam and Eve live at the same time as the dinosaurs?"
To which I replied: "The question you are asking is a question of belief which would make it more fitting for the Religion class. This is a Science class and here we deal with things we know."

I then of course then went on to explain the massive time-gap between humans and the dinosaurs.

How did the Muslim student react? How old was he?

 

[Copernicus]

My father grew up with JW parents. He had to sneak books home and struggled constantly to educate himself. The excuse had been that he wouldn't need an education when the world ended. School learning was useless. After Armageddon failed to come on schedule during his childhood (the date came and went), his father began to relent a little, on the grounds that it was no longer clear when the angel Gabriel would appear in the heavens blowing on his horn. So my father did manage to get into college and earn a degree in chemistry. But he became a bitter apostate after that. So I am acutely aware of how religion can sometimes have severe negative effects on personal lives. But the human spirit can sometimes overcome the challenge of willful ignorance. Had I not been converted briefly to the JW religion as a 7-year-old, I might never have come to be an atheist, because it focused my attention on the huge difference between my mother's Christianity and that of my grandparents.

 

[jarofthoughts]

How did the Muslim student react? How old was he?

Fifth grade elementary school and he reached very well in fact, accepting that science and religion are two separate subjects.

I'm not sure that it has dawned on too many of them though that if science is right, then certain parts of the Quran/Bible cannot be literary true but we'll cross that road when we get there.

We have talked a lot in the religion classes about that everyone must choose for themselves what to believe, or indeed not to believe, and seeing as this is a multicultural school this is very important for them to understand.

The science part isn't much of an issue though, seeing as most of the pupils love science and many claim that it is the subject they like the most in school.

I know that my reply to him might seem harsh to some but there is in fact some deeper thought behind it. It was meant as a deterrent against "muddling the waters" if you will, and avoid bringing religion into the science class, something which inevitably would lead to conflict. And while I am not averse to conflict and robust discourse I do not think that I should spend my science classes telling fifth graders that the stuff they read in the Quran/Bible is faulty. They will figure that out by themselves soon enough, and then they will themselves have to choose which path to follow.

 

[Skwim]

Fifth grade elementary school and he reached very well in fact, accepting that science and religion are two separate subjects.

I'm not sure that it has dawned on too many of them though that if science is right, then certain parts of the Quran/Bible cannot be literary true but we'll cross that road when we get there.

We have talked a lot in the religion classes about that everyone must choose for themselves what to believe, or indeed not to believe, and seeing as this is a multicultural school this is very important for them to understand.

The science part isn't much of an issue though, seeing as most of the pupils love science and many claim that it is the subject they like the most in school.

I know that my reply to him might seem harsh to some but there is in fact some deeper thought behind it. It was meant as a deterrent against "muddling the waters" if you will, and avoid bringing religion into the science class, something which inevitably would lead to conflict. And while I am not averse to conflict and robust discourse I do not think that I should spend my science classes telling fifth graders that the stuff they read in the Quran/Bible is faulty. They will figure that out by themselves soon enough, and then they will themselves have to choose which path to follow.

Interesting, but I'm curious as to your school system. Do students in fifth grade go to separate classrooms (and teachers) for each subject? If so, at what grade does this begin? In the USA this doesn't happen in most schools until seventh grade.

 

[jarofthoughts]

Interesting, but I'm curious as to your school system. Do students in fifth grade go to separate classrooms (and teachers) for each subject? If so, at what grade does this begin? In the USA this doesn't happen in most schools until seventh grade.

No, they do not. Classes that do not require special equipment (IT, Science experiments, Library, Sports, etc.) take place in the same classroom all the way through elementary school. That is, the classroom itself might change a few times during those ten years, but the class has a classroom in which they have most if not all of their subjects.

 

[Copernicus]

No, they do not. Classes that do not require special equipment (IT, Science experiments, Library, Sports, etc.) take place in the same classroom all the way through elementary school. That is, the classroom itself might change a few times during those ten years, but the class has a classroom in which they have most if not all of their subjects.

Times have really changed. When I was in third grade (in Detroit), they started sending us to separate classes for half the day. I remember it well when I proudly told the science class that my father, a chemist, "worked in a lavatory". The teacher taught me a new vocabulary word that day.

 

[gnomon]

In another thread it was pointed out that 13% of high school biology teachers explicitly advocate creationism. Pretty bad. However, according to a Penn State study, while "28 percent consistently implement National Research Council recommendations calling for introduction of evidence that evolution occurred, and craft lesson plans with evolution as a unifying theme linking disparate topics in biology . . . about 60 percent, 'fail to explain the nature of scientific inquiry, undermine the authority of established experts, and legitimize creationist arguments.'”

To simplify:

Of high school biology teachers

13% teach creationism

60% legitimize creationist arguments

28% teach evolution
​

To avoid controversy the deplorable 60% use one of several different strategies, which include :

* Teaching evolutionary biology as if it applies only to molecular biology and failing to to explain evidence that one species gives rise to other species.

* Telling students they don't have to "believe" in evolution but they have to know it for tests.

* Telling students to make up their own minds -- even though scientists say that they are as certain of the validity of evolution as they are of other scientific principles taken as fact.
​

source

Is it any wonder kids in the United States are doing so poorly. Out of 41 countries that took part in the Programme for International Student Assessment, the USA ranked

28th in math
18th in reading
29th in problem solving
22nd in science
​

source

This is beyond shameful.

Checking the NCSE website there are currently six states with proposed amendments to teach the "controversy" regarding global warming and evolution in science and allowing for teachers to propose the debates regarding evolution without endorsing or interfering with religious beliefs.

In other words, the new wedge to push forward a BS religious view in science classes.

 

[Skwim]

Checking the NCSE website there are currently six states with proposed amendments to teach the "controversy" regarding global warming and evolution in science and allowing for teachers to propose the debates regarding evolution without endorsing or interfering with religious beliefs.

In other words, the new wedge to push forward a BS religious view in science classes.

Got a link?

 

[gnomon]

NCSE | National Center for Science Education - Defending the Teaching of Evolution in Public Schools.

Great website that monitors legislative activity and maintaining proper science standards in education.

Here's the latest case.
Antievolution legislation in Tennessee | NCSE

Of course, in some of the States they've monitored these come up every couple of years.

 

[Skwim]

NCSE | National Center for Science Education - Defending the Teaching of Evolution in Public Schools.

Great website that monitors legislative activity and maintaining proper science standards in education.

Here's the latest case.
Antievolution legislation in Tennessee | NCSE

Of course, in some of the States they've monitored these come up every couple of years.

 

[KnightOwl]

Saturday I provided the sound for Dr. Barbara Forrest's presentation at Sacramento's Darwin Day celebration. She worked on the Kitzmiller case and as she showed in her presentation, she is continuously involved in her home state of Louisiana in following what the I.D. people are doing to try to teach religion as science. They actually passed one of these "teach the controversy" bills in her state much to her chagrin. Fortunately, Americans United for Separation of Church and State will be right there ready to file suit if any religious teachings are offered up in a science class as a result. A couple of videos were taken and the organizing committee is trying to get one of them up on a website. If it does happen, I'll post a link here. It was a very eye opening presentation and she is an excellent public speaker.

 

[Luminous]

I think people are allowed to make up their own minds about gravity...and the existance of the color purple. this way, it will be easy to tell the smart ones from the dumb.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

Is it any wonder kids in the United States are doing so poorly. Out of 41 countries that took part in the Programme for International Student Assessment, the USA ranked

28th in math
18th in reading
29th in problem solving
22nd in science
​

source

This is beyond shameful.

I don't recall if it was the same study or not, but US kids are #1 in confidence, even though they don't have any basis for such confidence.
USA!! #1?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I don't recall if it was the same study or not, but US kids are #1 in confidence, even though they don't have any basis for such confidence.
USA!! #1?

Over confidence? ( we have all met those who think education is a waste of time)

The stats are interesting, if only because a well educated American is the equal educationally to any one anywhere.

America has never been strong on real equality of opportunity.
So many Americans can not be stupid... they are just badly educated.
This is a massive resource going to waste.

and it is the average Joe who suffers, along side the future prospects of America.