My Problem With the "God Did It" Explanation for the Existence of the Universe

[McBell]

Okay...200 postings into it...and several people just won't fess up....

God did it!

So let us have a NEW God... and we will call Him....Science.
And we will bow to the intellect of His equations....
And we will honor His chosen prophets....
And we will worship Him in His laboratories...
And praise Him on our chalkboards.

And we will donate vast sums of money that we may split His atom.
And with this mighty sword we shall vanquish the oppressor....

And with Science shall we go forth and clone...and multiply....
And we shall dominate all things in His name.
And we shall partake of all of His creation without shame or regard...
And there will be no sin...

And we will partake of any seed....and manipulate that seed...
That it will serve us and feed us as we see fit....
though it might not keep us fit.

And He shall reveal to us His secrets of intellect...instilled...and installed...
In His gracious gift of the microchip...


And His Son...the Great Serpent.... the System.... shall watch over us
and protect us...
And our children shall wax over stupid and live in conformity...

And we shall not fear the Eternal Darkness of the grave...
For there is no life after death...no hope...not chance...

You are comical.
Guess you ran out of legitimate arguments?

 

[Thief]

You are comical.
Guess you ran out of legitimate arguments?

What.... the prince of sarcasm.... fails to see it's proper use?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

The ability to distinguish make-believe from reality is a fundamental requirement for being able to understand what is real.

Are you saying that my television isn't real?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

And since you cannot prove they do not exist, by default they have to exist!!

Why would you say that, I've seen them on TV before.

 

[Hawkins]

ROTFLMAO

really?
you are honestly comfortable with basing your whole belief system on "Well, you cannot prove it wrong" even though you have absolutely no way to prove it true?

Do you apply this "logic" to everything in your life, or just your religious beliefs?

While you are honestly comfortable with basing on your whole belief system on "Well, no proof means no truth"? It is a fallacy!!!!! The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.

Moreover, you are clueless about whether I've got the proof. You baselessly assume that I base my faith on emptyness, yet my faith is evidence based as well as faith-based. While yours is based on the absence of evidence.

Now answer this question as a test of faith,

Does soul exist afterlife?

Hint:
If your answer is "yes" - it is a religious answer
If your answer is "no: - it is also a religious answer
If your answer is "I don't knw", then your this answer is scientific, but if you keep your this anser till you die, you are nurd.

After answering the above question, try to answer the following,

Why do you have to base your faith on "the absence of evidence is the evidence of absence" which is known as a fallacy?

 

[McBell]

While you are honestly comfortable with basing on your whole belief system on "Well, no proof means no truth"? It is a fallacy!!!!! The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.

You assume to much.
But then that is expected when one replies with emotion...

Moreover, you are clueless about whether I've got the proof.

Really?
You have some undeniable empirical proof?

You baselessly assume that I base my faith on emptyness, yet my faith is evidence based as well as faith-based. While yours is based on the absence of evidence.

My what is based on lack of evidence?
Dude, you ain't making a lot of sense.

Now answer this question as a test of faith,

Does soul exist afterlife?

Hint:
If your answer is "yes" - it is a religious answer
If your answer is "no: - it is also a religious answer
If your answer is "I don't knw", then your this answer is scientific, but if you keep your this anser till you die, you are nurd.

Define soul.
Then show that it even exists.

After answering the above question, try to answer the following,

Why do you have to base your faith on "the absence of evidence is the evidence of absence" which is known as a fallacy?

I don't.
See the problem here is you jumped to a false conclusion based upon faulty assumptions.

But hey, go with what helps you to sleep at night.:yes:

 

[Father Heathen]

God is not complex.
God is an absolutely simple being.

This is the problem with religion - instead of trying to bring man up to god's level it tries to bring god down to man's level.

 

[fantome profane]

If your answer is "I don't knw", then your this answer is scientific, but if you keep your this anser till you die, you are nurd.

Is that a bad thing?

 

[painted wolf]

Wait... is there something wrong with being a "nurd"?
When did smart and eager to learn become a bad thing...?

wa:do

 

[Hawkins]

Wait... is there something wrong with being a "nurd"?
When did smart and eager to learn become a bad thing...?

wa:do

No not at all. But don't complain when things happen. I think to search for the truth is a kind of responsibility about one's own life. If you said that you give up that of responsibility...hmm. who cares..

 

[Hawkins]

You assume to much.
But then that is expected when one replies with emotion...

Strange, I tried to use your wording and tone in your previous post and you feel emotion in the reply! You assumed too much I think.

Really?
You have some undeniable empirical proof?

While I bet that you don't even know what empirical proof is! What empirical proof you are looking for? Could you define them?

I've got undeniable evidence. Yet the point is, even when I met with God face to face, I can't present you the so-called evidence. You still need faith to either believe or disbelieve. Because you will consider it as 'lacking proof or ...hm...empirical proof.

My what is based on lack of evidence?
Dude, you ain't making a lot of sense.

Of course it makes not much sense unless you start to realise that you actually requires faith for question I illustrated like "do you have an afterlife to live"?

Define soul.
Then show that it even exists.

That's another fallacy you've fallan for, were the stone age men able to define blackhole then show its existence? By your line of logic blackhole doesn't seem to exist in stone age.

Moreover, I don't know how convenient it is to simply ignore the fact that even the scientists won't (or can't ) draw the conclusion lightly that "Soul doesn't exist", with a small group of them actually are studying NDE.

I don't.
See the problem here is you jumped to a false conclusion based upon faulty mind.

Or perhaps true conclusion is rejected by a faulty reasoning by your mind.

But hey, go with what helps you to sleep at night.:yes:

What's that? Actually I slept quite well before I was turned into a Christian. Moreover, you sound if because one can sleep well such that truth can be ignored or ignorable! Continue to live in dreams if that's your decision.

 

[Hawkins]

Is that a bad thing?

Is that a bad to blind-fold yourself and rush into a traffic road, as long as you don't care then I suppose no one cares.

 

[Hawkins]

Get a clue!

As long as the following question is without an answer, religions will continue to exist. The only thing actually changes is that people start to lose their self-awareness to recognise what kind of faith they possess. And the question is,

Does afterlife exist, does soul exist?

If your answer is Yes, that represents your religion as your answer is religious. If on the other hand your answer is No, that also represents your religion as your answer is also a religious one.

The more scientific answer is "I don't know". Yet unfortunately, it's not an answer you can keep till you die. If you don't make a consent choice, your sub-consciousness will pick a "no" for you.

As for those whose answer is a 'yes', they have the self-awareness about what their own faith and religion is. As for those whose answer is a 'no', they don't even have that awareness to realise that they are religious.

Religions only change forms. People jump from one side of the fence to join another bandwagon of faith. That's it.

There will be less and less people believe in God as predicted. Only those who endure shall be saved.

 

[painted wolf]

No not at all. But don't complain when things happen. I think to search for the truth is a kind of responsibility about one's own life. If you said that you give up that of responsibility...hmm. who cares..

Truth can only be found by honest study and hard work.... "Nurd" stuff, I know.
Such a path is the most responsible one.

wa:do

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Are you saying that my television isn't real?

I feel sad for you if you think this is what I said.

 

[Sententia]

even when I met with God face to face

Which god did you meet? Face to Face? What did his/her or its face look like?

 

[McBell]

Strange, I tried to use your wording and tone in your previous post and you feel emotion in the reply! You assumed too much I think.

You really are in you own little world.

While I bet that you don't even know what empirical proof is! What empirical proof you are looking for? Could you define them?

Your attempt at belittlement is duly noted.
You should try harder.
I have children who could do better.

I've got undeniable evidence. Yet the point is, even when I met with God face to face, I can't present you the so-called evidence. You still need faith to either believe or disbelieve. Because you will consider it as 'lacking proof or ...hm...empirical proof.

Perhaps you are the one who needs to look up the definition of "undeniable".

Of course it makes not much sense unless you start to realise that you actually requires faith for question I illustrated like "do you have an afterlife to live"?

Yes, I have faith that you actually do know what you are talking about and merely worded it poorly.
Was I mistaken?

That's another fallacy you've fallan for, were the stone age men able to define blackhole then show its existence? By your line of logic blackhole doesn't seem to exist in stone age.

Interesting how you know so much about this thing you call "soul" yet are completely unable to define it.

Moreover, I don't know how convenient it is to simply ignore the fact that even the scientists won't (or can't ) draw the conclusion lightly that "Soul doesn't exist", with a small group of them actually are studying NDE.

What does this mysterious and elusive thing you call a "soul" have to do with Near Death Experiences?

Or perhaps true conclusion is rejected by a faulty reasoning by your mind.

That is possible.
Not very likely in this case, but possible.

But then, I am not the one who is dodging all the pertinent questions.
That would be you.

What's that? Actually I slept quite well before I was turned into a Christian. Moreover, you sound if because one can sleep well such that truth can be ignored or ignorable! Continue to live in dreams if that's your decision.

Ah.
See, now you are showing just how out of touch of reality you are.

 

[meogi]

While you are honestly comfortable with basing on your whole belief system on "Well, no proof means no truth"? It is a fallacy!!!!! The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.

Yes, in fact, it is. Rather, the overwhelming lack of evidence is evidence of absence.

Moreover, you are clueless about whether I've got the proof. You baselessly assume that I base my faith on emptyness, yet my faith is evidence based as well as faith-based. While yours is based on the absence of evidence.

Valid for you, not for the rest of us. Faith is, by definition, based upon belief.

Now answer this question as a test of faith,

Does soul exist afterlife?

Hint: Suggest a non-faith based entity (the soul).

Hint:
If your answer is "yes" - it is a religious answer
If your answer is "no: - it is also a religious answer
If your answer is "I don't knw", then your this answer is scientific, but if you keep your this anser till you die, you are nurd.

Answering a pointless question is pointless.

After answering the above question, try to answer the following,

Why do you have to base your faith on "the absence of evidence is the evidence of absence" which is known as a fallacy?

It's not as much of a fallacy as you think. I also don't base my faith on it. I base my faith on reality.

 

[Hawkins]

You really are in you own little world.

Gee, an assertion without any slide support for.

Your attempt at belittlement is duly noted.
You should try harder.
I have children who could do better.

Again, another assertion without any argument. The use of your children as a leverage is obvious, but that won't help much. Present your argument if you can. The use of "my children have better argument" won't help you much, that only shows your lack of an argument.

Perhaps you are the one who needs to look up the definition of "undeniable".

I'll give you a hint here. "Future" is the word. If you are willing to pay attention, prophecies are somehow future-related (so is science, if you'd like drill down). So you can't induce delusion into the future, which could make it "undeniable".

Yes, I have faith that you actually do know what you are talking about and merely worded it poorly.
Was I mistaken?

Interesting how you know so much about this thing you call "soul" yet are completely unable to define it.

So by your line of logic, because by far soul can not be concretely define, such that soul does not exist. So genius you've just proven that afterlife doesn't exist, which I am afraid not a single scientist will agree with.

See? You've fallen for the fallacy that "because something cannot be concretely defined such that it must not exist". Moreover, there are sane people here and there are talking about souls, if you think that they are talking something non-senses, you much be in your own little world. Keep on dreaming!

In stone age, humans couldn't even give a more scientific defintion on what fire is, they however used it on a daily basis. Humans have the capability to explore things which don't necessarily have a specific definition. They can reach a consensus for those things to be discussed around. 'while your line of logic like "Because people can't give a more specific definition about God such that God must not exist" is moot. Live with that or continue to live inside your little world!

What does this mysterious and elusive thing you call a "soul" have to do with Near Death Experiences?

So in your little world, soul has nothing to do with NDE?! Keep yourself in your own little world to deny how NDE is OBE is usually treated as similar things and that soul is implicitly concerned.

Ah.
See, now you are showing just how out of touch of reality you are.

Haha..I plainly showed you how this fits more to you. You are totally out of reality by turning a blind eye to the mass of discussion on souls and OBE and such. It seems that in your little world, no one ever heard of soul? :no: And whenever people talk about soul they must be talking about something nonsense. Gee.

 

[Hawkins]

Yes, in fact, it is. Rather, the overwhelming lack of evidence is evidence of absence.

Continue to live with that fallacy, I already pointed out that by your line of logic, blackhole shouldn't have existed in stone age due to the overwhelming lack of evidence to the stone age men.