My socialistic faith

[Estro Felino]

This is a meditation, a rant about the final evaluation of Europe's political drift in this new decade. The twenties.
Socialism has deeply evolved. The twentieth century was the century where socialism had to develop and mature to be considered something new and up to date.

Unfortunately, since the nineties, socialism has been seen as an enemy to kill, by whom?
By the same élites who have always fought against social justice. Against the dream of guaranteeing prosperity and happiness for all social classes.
And this is done through a great willpower.
My desire of social justice is like a fire that restlessly pervades my soul: seeing injustice is intolerable.
And I am not speaking of Europe only. I want justice in all the countries of the world. In all continents.

But instead of evolving, Europe is more and more de-evolving. Regressing to the state of absolute power of certain élites. Which was unthinkable in the seventies and in the eighties (where there was still the EEC).
It was back then that those demons did anything to fight socialism and the desire of implementing social justice. With the Operation Condor in Latin America...and in Europe through the strategy of terror. State terrorism: the national intelligence agencies, pandered by Freemasonic delinquents, boycotted and terrorized political parties. Those seeking social justice.

I swear before God, and God is my witness that I will always expose the truth and I will always keep my socialistic flame alive.
And I am not old. They are old. When I am older, they will be dead and I will expose them.
The history books will be filled with their names.

 

[Valjean]

History see-saws between socialism and oligarchy. The "business cycle" of capitalism creates a series of booms and busts. When the bust is significantly disastrous, the people revolt and the government is forced to consider their needs. This generates a "socialist" period of prosperity. But the rich "economic royalists" always seem to claw their way back to dominance, recreating the hierarchy of rich and poor.

 

[Estro Felino]

History see-saws between socialism and oligarchy. The "business cycle" of capitalism creates a series of booms and busts. When the bust is significantly disastrous, the people revolt and the government is forced to consider their needs. This generates a "socialist" period of prosperity. But the rich "economic royalists" always seem to claw their way back to dominance, recreating the hierarchy of rich and poor.

I burst out crying reading your post because that's what happened, actually, in my country.
The socialists and communists fighting for social justice and putting those demons in their place, in the fifties and in the sixties.
And then, as silent and smooth as serpents, they slid into the all the most important institutions of the State, they dismantled the social State and the industrial system, they privatized trade unions.
And then the process was finished with that shameful document called Treaty of Maastricht in 1992.

 

[Altfish]

I burst out crying reading your post because that's what happened, actually, in my country.
The socialists and communists fighting for social justice and putting those demons in their place, in the fifties and in the sixties.
And then, as silent and smooth as serpents, they slid into the all the most important institutions of the State, they dismantled the social State and the industrial system, they privatized trade unions.
And then the process was finished with that shameful document called Treaty of Maastricht in 1992.

You are lucky that you don't live in the UK.
This anti-EU government is ripping up trade union laws, basic water quality is dropping like a stone, the public services are failing, their friends and backers are being awarded contracts and the government is failing to take responsibility.
There is plenty wrong with the EU but it is far superior to what the Uk is having to put up with.

 

[Estro Felino]

You are lucky that you don't live in the UK.
This anti-EU government is ripping up trade union laws, basic water quality is dropping like a stone, the public services are failing, their friends and backers are being awarded contracts and the government is failing to take responsibility.
There is plenty wrong with the EU but it is far superior to what the UK is having to put up with.

If the UK rejoins the EU, this will change nothing.
Because it's a problem of social justice. The right to a decent life for every social class, regardless of race, religion, etc...
The masters of the EU are the same as those of UK.

 

[Stevicus]

But instead of evolving, Europe is more and more de-evolving. Regressing to the state of absolute power of certain élites. Which was unthinkable in the seventies and in the eighties (where there was still the EEC).
It was back then that those demons did anything to fight socialism and the desire of implementing social justice. With the Operation Condor in Latin America...and in Europe through the strategy of terror. State terrorism: the national intelligence agencies, pandered by Freemasonic delinquents, boycotted and terrorized political parties. Those seeking social justice.

My impression is that it was far easier for the elite to keep the people under control back during the days of agrarian feudalism, before industrialism and even before the invention of the printing press. Population was low-density and scattered. Once industrialism came on the scene, cities started to grow, and the elites had much bigger herds of cattle to manage. Those who did it with a certain level of sophistication, finesse, and savvy were able to grow in power, wealth, and global influence, whereas those who continued to cling to their old ways or the old order were unable to keep up or adapt.

If you've ever seen the film Nicholas and Alexandra, there's a quote from Count Witte just after Russia entered WW1. I don't know if Witte actually said this (maybe poetic license), but it illustrates how the world turned out as a result of that war.

"None of you will be here when this war ends. Everything we fought for will be lost, everything we've loved will be broken. The victors will be as cursed as the defeated. The world will grow old, and men will wander about, lost in the ruins, and go mad. Tradition, restraint, virtue, they all go. I'm not mourning for myself, but for the people who will come after me, they will live without hope. And all they will have will be guilt, revenge, and terror. And the world will be full of fanatics and trivial fools."

One of the consequences of this is that it will likely become more and more difficult to appeal to the better angels of one's nature. There's a kind of nihilistic, amoral pall which pervades the culture, giving license to a predatory, malicious way of thinking.

There will always be some form of "elite," if we define that as those who influence and run whatever society they're in. It may be a monarch or a pope - or it might be a commissar or a pin-striped crime boss (who sometimes disguise themselves as CEOs, politicians, judges, etc.).

The only stipulation is that they have to do it right if they want the loyalty of the people. They can't rely on the old standby of "God meant me to rule, so you have to do what I say." They need to be more clever than that. If they screw up and wreck the economy or fail to meet the needs and expectations of the people, then they get replaced. Or they might be subsumed into some larger power or become subordinate to another nation's hegemony.

 

[Estro Felino]

My impression is that it was far easier for the elite to keep the people under control back during the days of agrarian feudalism, before industrialism and even before the invention of the printing press. Population was low-density and scattered. Once industrialism came on the scene, cities started to grow, and the elites had much bigger herds of cattle to manage. Those who did it with a certain level of sophistication, finesse, and savvy were able to grow in power, wealth, and global influence, whereas those who continued to cling to their old ways or the old order were unable to keep up or adapt.

If you've ever seen the film Nicholas and Alexandra, there's a quote from Count Witte just after Russia entered WW1. I don't know if Witte actually said this (maybe poetic license), but it illustrates how the world turned out as a result of that war.

"None of you will be here when this war ends. Everything we fought for will be lost, everything we've loved will be broken. The victors will be as cursed as the defeated. The world will grow old, and men will wander about, lost in the ruins, and go mad. Tradition, restraint, virtue, they all go. I'm not mourning for myself, but for the people who will come after me, they will live without hope. And all they will have will be guilt, revenge, and terror. And the world will be full of fanatics and trivial fools."

One of the consequences of this is that it will likely become more and more difficult to appeal to the better angels of one's nature. There's a kind of nihilistic, amoral pall which pervades the culture, giving license to a predatory, malicious way of thinking.

There will always be some form of "elite," if we define that as those who influence and run whatever society they're in. It may be a monarch or a pope - or it might be a commissar or a pin-striped crime boss (who sometimes disguise themselves as CEOs, politicians, judges, etc.).

The only stipulation is that they have to do it right if they want the loyalty of the people. They can't rely on the old standby of "God meant me to rule, so you have to do what I say." They need to be more clever than that. If they screw up and wreck the economy or fail to meet the needs and expectations of the people, then they get replaced. Or they might be subsumed into some larger power or become subordinate to another nation's hegemony.

The word élite comes from Latin and literally means "the electi". The chosen ones.
There are people who feel entitled. The chosen ones.
And that is unchristian, for we are all equal in the eyes of God.

It's all true. Count Witte was so right. After the Belle époque, ugliness, greed and predatoriness replaced beauty.

I believe that my generation is different, though.

 

[Sirona]

This anti-EU government is ripping up trade union laws, basic water quality is dropping like a stone, the public services are failing, their friends and backers are being awarded contracts and the government is failing to take responsibility.

German television produced a documentary based upon these very claims that the Brexit was originally planned by some super-rich to undermine the reach of European laws protecting workers and consumers, but at the time I didn't believe it. However, from what you say, there seems to be something to it. Boris Johnson's claim that 350 million pounds of NHS would be sent to the EU every week was a lie, and it certainly wasn't the only propaganda claim.

 

[Altfish]

If the UK rejoins the EU, this will change nothing.
Because it's a problem of social justice. The right to a decent life for every social class, regardless of race, religion, etc...
The masters of the EU are the same as those of UK.

No, the UK is ripping up EU social justice laws to feather their own nest

 

[Estro Felino]

No, the UK is ripping up EU social justice laws to feather their own nest

The EU is considered suitable by those British people who mean to exploit the Seigniorage banking of the euro.
This is the only kind of British people that are interested in the Eu

 

[Altfish]

The EU is liked only by greedy British who mean to exploit the Seigniorage banking of the euro.
This is the only kind of British people that are interested in the Eu

No, 66% now want to rejoin after they've seen what a shambles leaving has been

 

[Estro Felino]

German television produced a documentary based upon these very claims that the Brexit was originally planned by some super-rich to undermine the reach of European laws protecting workers and consumers, but at the time I didn't believe it. However, from what you say, there seems to be something to it. Boris Johnson's claim that 350 million pounds of NHS would be sent to the EU every week was a lie, and it certainly wasn't the only propaganda claim.

The thread is about socialism, though.
Not the EU.
Es tut mir leid, aber ich soll das unterstreichen.

 

[Valjean]

If the UK rejoins the EU, this will change nothing.
Because it's a problem of social justice. The right to a decent life for every social class, regardless of race, religion, etc...
The masters of the EU are the same as those of UK.

Government is a social contract organization. It's instituted by The People to promote the interests of The People. It's then hijacked by the rich and powerful to maintain their own power and social dominance -- at the expense of The People.

The people never see it coming. The small changes are made to seem reasonable, if they're noticed at all. They're promoted as beneficial or necessary to counter manufactured problems or threats. The People are induced to undermine their own interests -- frogs in a saucepan.

 

[icehorse]

So far on this thread there seems to be a lot of good insight into the cyclical nature of economies moving back and forth between socialism and oligarchy. A couple of thoughts:

- These days our weapons are such that "revolution" could mean extinction - yikes!
- I would say that "socialism" isn't black and white. There are many degrees of socialism, and I think it would be good to make distinctions.

So my rough idea of a sort of "optimum degree of socialism" would be something like:

- quality education that includes specialization and vocational.
- quality healthcare.
- sound infrastructure
- relatively stress-free retirement
- a modest defense budget
- a graduated tax system that isn't full of loopholes.
- safeguards against political corruption

 

[Valjean]

So my rough idea of a sort of "optimum degree of socialism" would be something like:

- quality education that includes specialization and vocational.
- quality healthcare.
- sound infrastructure
- relatively stress-free retirement
- a modest defense budget
- a graduated tax system that isn't full of loopholes.
- safeguards against political corruption

I like it -- but you need more than just quality, you need affordability and universal availability, as well.

 

[Estro Felino]

- quality education that includes specialization and vocational.
- quality healthcare.
- sound infrastructure
- relatively stress-free retirement
- a modest defense budget
- a graduated tax system that isn't full of loopholes.
- safeguards against political corruption

Socialism is something that originated in Europe. The word itself means to socialize economy. Making society the fulcrum of economy. And so it necessarily implies:

- quality education and quality university that are both free
- quality healthcare which is 100% free
- state-owned infrastructures (highways, railways, communications).
- a state-owned pension system
- a state-owned bank for industrial investments

 

[Valjean]

That would be common ownership of The Commons.

The commons used to be community shared pastureland. It's come to mean those goods and services used in common by the whole of society, eg: police and fire protection, infrastructure, courts, education, healthcare, clean food and water, &c.
The question of "how much socialism?" mostly involves what goods and services should be held in common vs which should be privatized and sold at profit.

 

[Estro Felino]

That would be common ownership of The Commons.

The commons used to be community shared pastureland. It's come to mean those goods and services used in common by the whole of society, eg: police and fire protection, infrastructure, courts, education, healthcare, clean food and water, &c.
The question of "how much socialism?" mostly involves what goods and services should be held in common vs which should be privatized and sold at profit.

I have seen that beautiful sense of community that kind of imitates the Amish communities of the East Coast, in countryside towns and villages, in several states like Dakota, Minnesota.
Small communities that are self-sufficient from the federal government.
Because they are all there for one another. Physicians, lawyers, employees.
That's beautiful.

 

[icehorse]

I like it -- but you need more than just quality, you need affordability and universal availability, as well.

As I recall, there's a lot of math to support the idea that if we stopped letting the .001% and profitable corporations get away with paying no taxes, we could easily afford this stuff.

 

[Valjean]

As I recall, there's a lot of math to support the idea that if we stopped letting the .001% and profitable corporations get away with paying no taxes, we could easily afford this stuff.

I agree. Other, much less affluent countries manage to pull it all off at half the cost, both through equitable taxation and socialism -- taking the profit out of services and delivering them at cost, as community owned or managed enterprises.