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Netherlands limits freedom of religion for muslim citizens

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Then you should probably look at it with a bit more attention.

The newspiece does not at all mention or imply an opposition to Halal food in any way, shape or form.

Even the ban of face-covering clothing is limited

only for security reasons or “in specific situations where it is essential for people to be seen”,

A previous proposal did apply to public areas. This one does not.

And that, I might add, in a country that has only 100 to 500 wearers of Burqa.


You claim that you perceive such a decision as "nazi-like" is preposterous.
 

Servant_of_the_One1

Well-Known Member
Then you should probably look at it with a bit more attention.

The newspiece does not at all mention or imply an opposition to Halal food in any way, shape or form.

Even the ban of face-covering clothing is limited



A previous proposal did apply to public areas. This one does not.

And that, I might add, in a country that has only 100 to 500 wearers of Burqa.


You claim that you perceive such a decision as "nazi-like" is preposterous.



Cmon Dantas, the Netherlands were the first country to submit without any meaningful resistance against the Nazis. That shows they agreed with them.

And today we see Nazi ideology back in the politics of the Dutch. Wilders can rightfully be called Hitler of Holland, its just a matter of time before he grabs the power.


This partial ban on niqab has nothing to do with security and communication at all. They use these weak reasons to target muslims step by step.
 

Mycroft

Ministry of Serendipity
Quite contrarily, this is actually lifting a ban: a ban on the right of women to choose their own dress, a ban on the right women to disagree with the clerical male authority, and a ban on all citizens to not be able to look at one another in the face. If all citizens are equal before the law, then - rightly - we are also equal in the face of each other.

On the door of my bank, there is a sign politely asking all customers to take off any form of facial concealment before they enter. The notice doesn't bother to explain: anyone going in wearing any sort of mask would incur the right and proper presumption of guilt. That presumption should operate - equally - for everyone. Would you have any sort of dealings with a doctor or nurse whose face was covered? Or a tax inspector or customs official. What about a police officer? And why is it you never see such people wearing veils? Indeed...

The special demand to consider the niqab and burqa as an exemption applies only to women. And only to one religious practice. That, at once, tells you all you need to know: Society is being asked to abandon immemorial traditions of equality and openness in order to gratify one faith, on faith that has very questionable respect for women.

And what about the KKK? They are notorious for their wearing of a hood that covers the face and in their history have always upheld a protestant and Anglo-Saxon purity. Nobody can really deny the right of the KKK to take this faith-based view, which is protected by the first amendment of the US Constitution. At a rally they could even hide their faces. But they wouldn't be able to teach children whilst wearing it, wouldn't be able to enter the bank, or drive a bus, etc.

There are other objections to the veil - they have often been used by criminals both religious and common to conceal their identities. They have also been used to hide injuries inflicted upon abused women. It's not compatible with driving, due to its effect on the peripheral vision, which would remove it from the sphere of private decision making as it's a danger to others, as well as offence to the ordinary democratic civility that depends on phrases like 'nice to see you.'

Of course, in some muslim societies, women aren't allowed to drive anyway. But that just reinforces the second point here. All of the above would be valid if all Muslim women were as committed to wearing the veil as the KKK are to wearing the hood. But we have no assurances that the veil is purely a matter of choice. And, in fact, a huge amount of evidence goes the other way. A huge amount of evidence goes the other way. Mothers, wives, and daughters have been threatened with acid in the face, or honor-killing, or vicious beating, if they do not adopt the humiliating outer clothing that is mandated by their menfolk.

In many Muslim countries, the veiled look is illegal in government buildings, schools, and universities. So why should Europeans - and Americans - seeking to perhaps accommodate Muslim immigrants, adopt the standard of only the most backward and primitive Muslim states?

In the end, the right of women to show their faces easily trumps the right of t heir male relatives or imams to decide otherwise.
 
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Servant_of_the_One1

Well-Known Member
Lifting a ban? These women choose to wear Niqab without being forced on by anyone. They do this because of their love for Allah and his messenger pbuh.
 
Dutch cabinet approves partial ban on Islamic veil in public areas | World news | The Guardian


1) halal slaughtered ban
2) Partial niqab ban

It smells like nazi decisions to me.

This doesnt surprise me at all, cuz the Netherlands had always soft spot for nazism and hatred against minorities.

Is it better to be a religious minority in:
a) Holland
b) A Muslim country (any of them)

hmmmm, tough call that.

Why don't you start a thread about the injustices that Muslims force on minorities in Muslim countries? They tend to be a bit more significant than having to remove a face veil in a small number of locations.

Which Islamic country would you promote as being the best place to be a religious minority btw? We could compare it to Holland to see who is most like the Nazis.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Cmon Dantas, the Netherlands were the first country to submit without any meaningful resistance against the Nazis. That shows they agreed with them.

And today we see Nazi ideology back in the politics of the Dutch. Wilders can rightfully be called Hitler of Holland, its just a matter of time before he grabs the power.


This partial ban on niqab has nothing to do with security and communication at all. They use these weak reasons to target muslims step by step.

Excuse me? Do you mean to be funny or something?

I take offense at this gross misinfomation. You should be ashamed of spreading it. And you might want to learn a bit about this person.

Haj Amin al-Husseini - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
I find few threads to be more disgusting.

A number of years ago, my wife and I were privileged to participate in the Yom HaShoah commemoration in Amsterdam's Hollandsche Schouwburg Theatre. The weather was terrible and rain poured in on us as we sat huddled under our umbrellas. Many were old with more than a few in wheel chairs. These were the people who remembered. I will never forget watching them as they struggled to their feet as the organizers played a song commemorating the valiant efforts of those who risked everything.

Read the Wikipedia article on The Dutch Resistance and do not allow Holland's response to the invasion to be further slandered in such an ignorant and despicable manner.
 

jeager106

Learning more about Jehovah.
Premium Member
During world war 2 there were strong connections between the Muslim governments (as well as some of the Muslim people) and the Nazis. Muslim extremists were strong supporters of Hitler. Most Germans were either brainwashed or scared and that’s why so few did anything to fight or oppose Hitler. However many Muslim extremists VOLUNTARILY fought side by side with the Nazis until 1945 when it became clear the Nazis were going to lose the war. Many Soviet Muslims abandoned the red army to fight with Hitler. The Nazis and the Muslim extremists have very common ideologies and common enemies. They both hate Jews, they are both staunchly against communism, and they both wanted the British out of “Palestine”.

Above From:
The Muslim Nazi Connection | The Muslim Issue

There are many links about the Muslim Nazi cooperation before and during WWII.
Just do a Google search and become informed before you post such claims.
 

SkylarHunter

Active Member
Quite contrarily, this is actually lifting a ban: a ban on the right of women to choose their own dress, a ban on the right women to disagree with the clerical male authority, and a ban on all citizens to look at one another in the face. If all citizens are equal before the law, then - rightly - we are also equal in the face of each other.


In the end, the right of women to show their faces easily trumps the right of t heir male relatives or imams to decide otherwise.


I was going to say something like this but your answer is brilliant, no need to add to it.
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
Also, maybe there is some reference to halal meat in the newspiece, but I sure don't remember having seen it there.
Obviously, there is none, and I really don't think that he was suggesting otherwise. Rather, he was referencing a previous ban in an effort to suggest a pattern.

While researching this I came across the following ...
I'm convinced that there's a Les Mis punchline here somewhere,
 

GoodbyeDave

Well-Known Member
These women choose to wear Niqab without being forced on by anyone. They do this because of their love for Allah and his messenger pbuh.
There is nothing about veiling in the Quran.
Veiling is unknown in many Muslim communities.
Al Azhar University has issued a fatwa stating that veiling's an Arabian custom and nothing to do with Islam.

Your attitude is typical of many Muslims. When in our lands, you expect to retain your own customs, while those who visit Muslim countries are expected to abandon theirs. When I see non-Muslim worship allowed in Saudi Arabia and the death penalty for conversion from Islam abolished in all Muslim countries, then I might feel a little more sympathetic towards Muslims. But in the last analysis, if Muslims don't like living in Europe, the solution is simple: get out!
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
Dutch cabinet approves partial ban on Islamic veil in public areas | World news | The Guardian


1) halal slaughtered ban
2) Partial niqab ban

It smells like nazi decisions to me.

This doesnt surprise me at all, cuz the Netherlands had always soft spot for nazism and hatred against minorities.
Comparing this to the Nazis is tantamount to spitting in the face of Holocaust victims and survivors. This ban only applies to schools, hospitals, and public transportation, so it's not quite the same as outlawing Islam or putting Muslims into Ghettos, or, worse yet, concentration camps. That being said, I think they need to provide a lot more specifics as to why this is necessary before they start enforcing this ban. It seems like a bit of a stretch in regards to safety.
 
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