New York Times endorses Harris as ‘the only choice’ for president

[metis]

And if one believes we are all created as part of "God's plan", then why are there miscarriages and stillbirths? Why would God plan those?

I value life, but I don't feel the government should tell a woman what she must do with that which is inside her own body. To me, it's so ironic that so many who say they're "conservative" believe the government can mandate such an intimate law.

 

[anotherneil]

Why are you assuming they didn't think for themselves? You some sort of mind reader?

My mind reading capabilities have nothing to do with this.

It's merely a matter of logic and critical thinking skills - a person who thinks for themselves contrasts with a person who can be persuaded or dissuaded, such as by an endorsement.

Do you not possess any logic and critical thinking skills?

 

[metis]

It's merely a matter of logic and critical thinking skills - a person who thinks for themselves contrasts with a person who can be persuaded or dissuaded, such as by an endorsement.

If someone wants a recommendation from some source, what's the problem with that?

Do you not possess any logic and critical thinking skills?

Does insulting someone's intelligence and/or honesty get you off?

 

[fantome profane]

I tend to agree, but why is that different for abortion? Can an employer say you can't have an abortion to work here?

If abortion were contagious, sure.

 

[anotherneil]

If someone wants a recommendation from some source, what's the problem with that?

In this case, the recommendation cannot be counted on to be reliable or trustworthy.

Does insulting someone's intelligence and/or honesty get you off?

Are you implying that the answer to the question is a yes?

If you're not implying that the answer to the question is a yes, then this is not relevant at all to this thread (it's nothing but a purely personal question); my question is relevant because it's regarding what you had posted.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

Because fetuses and embryos are not "people". At least no one has ever demonstrated that they are. The problem is that the antiabortion people need a rational argument for how and why fetuses and embryos are people, but even then the bodily autonomy issue still exists. Morally if the state enforces a pregnancy on a woman they should also foot the entire bill.

Pro choice people need to define what a person is as well.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

If abortion were contagious, sure.

So your answer to my actual question is actually no?

 

[Kathryn]

I never said they don't work.

I tend to agree, but why is that different for abortion? Can an employer say you can't have an abortion to work here?

Sure, but we are talking about bodily autonomy and abortion. The problem is you want bodily autonomy for the mother who made a decision thar lead to a pregnancy, but not for the human life that made no decision to be created.

Every person I know who died from COVID had multiple vaccines. Hell, I had multiple vaccines! Till I got one and my head hurt for four solid days and my blood pressure has never returned to what it used to be.

 

[fantome profane]

So your answer to my actual question is actually no?

Actually your actual question was not an actual question.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Pro choice people need to define what a person is as well.

For them it is rather easy. I would be happy with the limitations of Roe v Wade.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Every person I know who died from COVID had multiple vaccines. Hell, I had multiple vaccines! Till I got one and my head hurt for four solid days and my blood pressure has never returned to what it used to be.

The one person that I know that died of Covid never had the vaccine. We both worked at the same place and we both may have caught it from the same person. It was pre-vaccine days. And that original version may have been a bit harsher. I got over my case rather quickly and she never did.

 

[Pogo]

I know. But vaccines have to do with bodily autonomy.

Yes in the case of vaccines, you can refuse any and all of them, you just may not be allowed to be in certain places due to your potential to cause others harm. You have bodily autonomy.

You can drink as much as you want, just not while driving a car. This is how society limits bodily autonomy dependent on your potential to cause harm to others who do not choose to be blotto.

Alternatively we have a situation where you are not allowed your choice in how to treat your body because of where you are.

This situation is not bodily autonomy because the government is denying you the choice to do or not do something that has no effect on anyone but yourself.
edit, @Subduction Zone beat me to it, shouldn't have gone and mowed my leaves.

 

[fantome profane]

Pro choice people need to define what a person is as well.

Not really. You just need to understand that a person does not have the right to use the body of another person.

 

[Pogo]

I never said they don't work.

I tend to agree, but why is that different for abortion? Can an employer say you can't have an abortion to work here?

Sure, but we are talking about bodily autonomy and abortion. The problem is you want bodily autonomy for the mother who made a decision thar lead to a pregnancy, but not for the human life that made no decision to be created.

Engaging in intercourse is not a automatically a conscious decision to become pregnant, in fact normally accepted behaviour that has unintended consequences such as having an accident while driving according to the rules does not make one liable for those unintended consequences, they are considered acts of God.

 

[Pogo]

Pro choice people need to define what a person is as well.

Legally, it is generally accepted to be a living breathing member of homo Sapiens.

 

[metis]

In this case, the recommendation cannot be counted on to be reliable or trustworthy.

And you're supposedly a non-biased judge of that?

 

[Kathryn]

The one person that I know that died of Covid never had the vaccine. We both worked at the same place and we both may have caught it from the same person. It was pre-vaccine days. And that original version may have been a bit harsher. I got over my case rather quickly and she never did.

Oh well. One person I know who died of COVID had had five vaccines, including one about a month before she passed away! She died in early 2022.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh well. One person I know who died of COVID had had five vaccines, including one about a month before she passed away! She died in early 2022.

And how old was she? Rather than looking at individual cases one has to look at large numbers of cases. People die for all sorts of reasons. But when we have numbers in the millions we can see whether or not vaccines are effective and those studies all support the vaccines.

With small studies it is very easy to form confirmation bias, where one takes a very small sample that agrees with one's beliefs. Using confirmation bias one can even "prove" that smoking is good for you. When you get studies up into the thousands those claims tend to fail.

 

[anotherneil]

And you're supposedly a non-biased judge of that?

Nope, I'm quite biased against conflicts of interest - but enough about me on a thread that isn't about me; what do you say we get back to the thread topic?

 

[Watchmen]

Unfortunately, the NYT got it wrong. Harris is not “the only choice.” There are actually third party candidates who are likely better than Harris (and, of course, Trump). Wouldn’t it be nice if a major publication came out and endorsed a third party! Send a message to the people…we don’t have to be stuck with the two options we have, both of which get more extreme with each passing year.