Newton's first law of motion not practical

[LegionOnomaMoi]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Newton's First Law of Motion states that a body at rest will remain at rest unless an outside force acts on it, and a body in motion at a constant velocity will remain in motion in a straight line unless acted upon by an outside force."

Newton was obviously referring to earth's orbiting motion, and the motionless Sun, the only two bodies he could relate with at the time. The outside force it would take to move the sun, and the outside force it would take to stop the earth's orbit will never be known.

[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]"Our belief or disbelief[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif] [/FONT]of a thing does not alter the nature[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif] [/FONT]of things” Tillotson[/FONT]


“[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]This moment is your life.” [/FONT]Omar Khayyam

Newton was a founder of the calculus, which didn't rest upon very secure grounds until at least Weierstrauss (to use the English spelling). Calculus, until Heisenberg's Matrix Mechanics (his formulation of quantum mechanics in terms of matrices despite the fact that he didn't know what matrices were; Born had to tell him and both of them were so confused they ignored Hilbert's advice and thus we had to wait until Schrödinger for his wavefunction mechanics).

Now, matrix/linear algebra is perhaps even more important to understanding modern physics than is the calculus.

Galilean relativity, which Newton adopted along with everybody else for centuries, was thrown out the window with Einstein's special relativity (and that's without his GTR). As a mechanics of the most elementary particles, it collapses altogether. Classical mechanics is nothing if but practical. That's why it's used. The most successful theories in the sciences, relativity and QM, conflict with Newtonian (and by extension classical) physics, but we continue to use Newton's equations because they are practical.

If you are going to criticize physics, don't do so using the descriptions that physicists use while ignoring the physics they use.

 

[Alt Thinker]

Newton didn't just create his theory, he could only relate with something he saw, and the only immovable body he could see was the sun, and the only movable body he could see was the moon and both were constant.

Back in Newton's day, the 17th century, very little was known about astronomy and everything else.

In the absence of accurate knowledge of astronomy, the sun would not appear to be immobile but to cross the sky every day, same with all other celestial objects. Are you perhaps confusing Newton’s Laws of Motion with his gravitational theory? That theory certainly involved the sun and the moon. Newton based his gravitational theory on Kepler’s Laws developed from detailed observation of the motions of the planets. The nature of the solar system was fairly advanced at that time. Newton’s Laws of Motion were a necessary pre-requisite for developing Newton’s gravitational theory.

 

[factseeker88]

Newton was a founder of the calculus, which didn't rest upon very secure grounds until at least Weierstrauss (to use the English spelling). Calculus, until Heisenberg's Matrix Mechanics (his formulation of quantum mechanics in terms of matrices despite the fact that he didn't know what matrices were; Born had to tell him and both of them were so confused they ignored Hilbert's advice and thus we had to wait until Schrödinger for his wavefunction mechanics).

Now, matrix/linear algebra is perhaps even more important to understanding modern physics than is the calculus.

Galilean relativity, which Newton adopted along with everybody else for centuries, was thrown out the window with Einstein's special relativity (and that's without his GTR). As a mechanics of the most elementary particles, it collapses altogether. Classical mechanics is nothing if but practical. That's why it's used. The most successful theories in the sciences, relativity and QM, conflict with Newtonian (and by extension classical) physics, but we continue to use Newton's equations because they are practical.

If you are going to criticize physics, don't do so using the descriptions that physicists use while ignoring the physics they use.

Prove it by demonstration for all to see and understand it, if not, it's theory or educated guessing.

:yes::yes::yes:

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]When we remember we are all mad, the mysteries disappear and life stands explained. Mark Twain[/FONT]


“[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence. The only consequence is WHAT WE DO.” John Ruskin (1819 - 1900) [/FONT]

 

[Alt Thinker]

Prove it by demonstration for all to see and understand it, if not, it's theory or educated guessing.

Prove what?

BTW in the hard sciences such as physics, a Theory is a well formed hypothesis that addresses all questions in its stated purview, provides answers better than any competing hypotheses, has a precise predictive mechanism, and has had enough of its predictions well confirmed by observation to be convincing to professionals in the field. 'Just' a theory is a misunderstanding of the nature of science.

 

[factseeker88]

Prove what?

BTW hard sciences such as physics, has a precise predictive mechanism, and has had enough of its predictions well confirmed by observation to be convincing to professionals in the field.

Hard science, precise predictive mechanism, confirmed by observation -- Is more like engineering design than unprovable theory.

:yes::yes::yes:

 

[Skwim]

From my mechanics course, we where taught that the Sun isnt what the solar system orbits. Rather, Newtonian mechanics leads to the conclusion that it, along with all the planets, orbits the solar systems center of mass (if I remember correctly). It just happens that the mass of the solar system is dominated by the sun, so the center of mass lies within the sun. Dont know if that was what Newton believed, though, but since it can be infered from his mechanics, it wouldnt surprise me.

You remember fairly correctly. Here is how the Sun moves around the solar system's barycenter,

[youtube]_IHXj8k2jqc[/youtube]
​

The barycenter is often outside the photosphere of the Sun, but never outside the Sun's corona

 

[Alt Thinker]

Hard science, precise predictive mechanism, confirmed by observation -- Is more like engineering design than unprovable theory.

This is how hypotheses become theories. This is how theories are proved. Hard work in the real world where only results matter.

And snide carping does not count for anything.

:no::no::no:

 

[Kerr]

You remember fairly correctly. Here is how the Sun moves around the solar system's barycenter,

[youtube]_IHXj8k2jqc[/youtube]
​

The barycenter is often outside the photosphere of the Sun, but never outside the Sun's corona

Ok, thanks . Havent checked it out in detail before, tbh.

 

[factseeker88]

If you are going to criticize physics, don't do so using the descriptions that physicists use while ignoring the physics they use.

My practical theories are are just as accurate as physics educated guesses, neither can be demonstrated or proven in any way.

 

[YmirGF]

My practical theories are are just as accurate as physics educated guesses, neither can be demonstrated or proven in any way.

Except you don't have legions of brilliant scientist on your side of this equation. Reality sucks, don't it?

 

[McBell]

Maybe so, but my original post was based on my actual experience, my employment, and had nothing to do with science.

That explains quite a bit...

 

[Thief]

A body at rest (or in motion) remains constant until and external force is applied.

Any objection?

 

[Awkward Fingers]

A body at rest (or in motion) remains constant until and external force is applied.

Any objection?

No objections on a macroscopic level at all.

In fact, even have an example to go with it!!
I was sitting here at work, doing paperwork and enjoying the sound of the wind outside.
I reached over and opened the window about half way, so I could get a better view of the trees, which were almost doubled over in half it seemed, the wind was so strong (had to open the window because they are heavily tinted.)

Well, all of a sudden, my stacks of papers, which WERE sitting nicely at rest on my desk next to the open window, were picked up by god and just thrown all around the room!!!

It was just one more reminder about how rude god is... *sigh*

 

[Thief]

always the Practical Joker!