No Country for Illegal Immigrants

[Naturalist_Atheist]

I'm curious as to what you all have to say concerning America's illegal immigration crisis. Do you feel there is a crisis? Do you feel illegal immigrantation even causes a problem or do they help our country? How did we get into this situation? What steps, if any, would you take to correct the mess we find ourselves in now. Deportation, Amnesty, or something different?

I have strong views on this topic, but I would like to hold out a little longer, listen to some of your responses and then I will chime in when we have more company. :beach:

 

[Zephyr]

If we're going to even bother having borders, why the hell aren't we enforcing them properly?

 

[Naturalist_Atheist]

If we're going to even bother having borders, why the hell aren't we enforcing them properly?

I agree. But how would you handle the millions of illegals that are living in our country right now? Indeed some of them have been here for years.

 

[Mister_T]

Immigration in the U.S. needs to be more friendly to poorer countries: The fees are way to much and the amount of time it takes for your paperwork to be processed is beyond ridiculous. If you improve just those two things, you'll see the number of illegal immigrants drop significantly.

 

[Zephyr]

I agree. But how would you handle the millions of illegals that are living in our country right now? Indeed some of them have been here for years.

My ideal situation would be to break the United States up into many smaller folkish communities, but that ain't happening any time soon. As for what we should do now, secure our border first. If the border is actually secured I wouldn't even really mind amnesty all that much. Deporting people works fine as a temporary solution, but means nothing if we can't even hold our lines.

 

[3.14]

problem with illegals is there like roaches ones you have a couple you will be flooded with them in a couple years. only true solution would be to put the death penalty on illegaly residing in Amarika, but some human right peeps got a problem with that

 

[Heartfelt]

I think they have value but they should not be here illegally...when found they should be deported with a book on how to legally enter the U.S....the reason we got to this point is our economy has gotten so bad that illegals are doing jobs that most Americans don't want bothered with...and the rest is the employers that hire illegals in the first place to not have to pay an American a worth-while wage to do the job...they should be required to hire them from their country and be required to pay them health benefits and taxes should be gotten from the income generated...they should NOT be allowed any welfare/medical/government benefits unless they are actual citizens...and even some of those shouldn't be getting welfare because 'some',not all, are playing the system because they are just plain lazy.

 

[Quagmire]

You can't blame the immigrants themselves. Of course they're going to go where the opportunities are. And I think if people in mainstream America understood what some of these immigrants go through, and what they have to give up in order to be here, they'd realize, among other things, that deportation wouldn't do any good.

If you want to treat it as a problem, blame the employers. If there weren't a demand for the immigrants services they wouldn't be here.

 

[dawny0826]

I feel it's unacceptable for people to immigrate illegally. I don't believe that we should build walls around our borders but I feel we should totally deport those who are here illegally. The idiots who continue to offer jobs to illegal immigrants need to suffer tough penalties.

If you want to become an American, do so lawfully.

 

[dawny0826]

You can't blame the immigrants themselves. Of course they're going to go where the opportunities are. And I think if people in mainstream America understood what some of these immigrants go through, and what they have to give up in order to be here, they'd realize, among other things, that deportation wouldn't do any good.

If you want to treat it as a problem, blame the employers. If there weren't a demand for the immigrants services they wouldn't be here.

Then individuals who have LEGALLY immigrated to the U.S. and/or individuals who feel passionately about assisting with the transition of LEGAL immigration, need put their hard work and money to the test and work out a system that doesn't tax the American people.

 

[Mister_T]

You can't blame the immigrants themselves. Of course they're going to go where the opportunities are. And I think if people in mainstream America understood what some of these immigrants go through, and what they have to give up in order to be here, they'd realize, among other things, that deportation wouldn't do any good.

People don't realize that many illegal immigrants are simply waiting for their paperwork to be processed....a process which currently takes 8-10 years......a vast majority of them would be legal if only their paperwork was processed.

Many people also don't realize (or simply don't care) that these people are dirt poor, oppressed and don't know when their next meal is going to be. Waiting around 10 years when you could just risk crossing the border, doesn't sound like valid option. God forbid though, certain groups in America sympathize with people who are wanting to escape being poor and oppressed....that'd actually be something Jesus would do.

 

[Quagmire]

I feel it's unacceptable for people to immigrate illegally. I don't believe that we should build walls around our borders but I feel we should totally deport those who are here illegally. The idiots who continue to offer jobs to illegal immigrants need to suffer tough penalties.

If you want to become an American, do so lawfully.

The idea of forcing a group of people to run the guantlet of American Beurocracy is perhaps the cruelest suggestion yet.

 

[dawny0826]

I know good and well that many immigrants are dirt poor and seek to escape oppression and I wouldn't object to changes made to current laws and procedures to make the process easier but I believe a process should stay in place and individuals should follow these procedures.

Respectfully, if you don't have the time or ability (be it financial or otherwise) to legally follow the guidelines to become a citizen of the U.S., how can you expect to function as a responsible American citizen?

I certainly understand compassion and strive to act compassionately but there are negative consequences to American citizens when we allow illegal immigrant to continue residence.

 

[dawny0826]

The idea of forcing a group of people to run the guantlet of American Beurocracy is perhaps the cruelest suggestion yet.

Poohie.

 

[Quagmire]

People don't realize that many illegal immigrants are simply waiting for their paperwork to be processed....a process which currently takes 8-10 years......a vast majority of them would be legal if only their paperwork was processed.

Many people also don't realize (or simply don't care) that these people are dirt poor, oppressed and don't know when their next meal is going to be. Waiting around 10 years when you could just risk crossing the border, doesn't sound like valid option. God forbid though, certain groups in America sympathize with people who are wanting to escape being poor and oppressed....that'd actually be something Jesus would do.

Hunger has always been a much more persuasive motivator than any appeal to an abstract and debatable morality (especially to hungry people). :yes:

 

[dawny0826]

Hunger has always been a much more persuasive motivator than any appeal to an abstract and debatable morality (especially to hungry people). :yes:

Then why don't the same individuals, especially those who earned their citizenship and escaped hunger and oppression...give back...and LEGALLY cross borders to offer aid to people suffering from the same consequences?

 

[Mister_T]

I believe a process should stay in place and individuals should follow these procedures.

I believe so too. I just don't believe it should be as ludicrous as it is, currently.

Respectfully, if you don't have the time or ability (be it financial or otherwise) to legally follow the guidelines to become a citizen of the U.S., how can you expect to function as a responsible American citizen?

Please tell me what makes makes a "responsible American citizen." Following every law set in place without question?

If the guidelines are bogus (which I believe they are) I don't see why anyone should adhere to them. BTW, the guidelines weren't always this ludicrous. Immigration was a lot easier not too long ago.

 

[Luminous]

My ideal situation would be to break the United States up into many smaller folkish communities, but that ain't happening any time soon. As for what we should do now, secure our border first. If the border is actually secured I wouldn't even really mind amnesty all that much. Deporting people works fine as a temporary solution, but means nothing if we can't even hold our lines.

you would propose succesion. :tsk: i might have to report you...


----- i think that hatred against foreigners has to do with Nationalistic Colonial American Supremicist feelings.

 

[dawny0826]

I believe so too. I just don't believe it should be as ludicrous as it is, currently.

Please tell me what makes makes a "responsible American citizen." Following every law set in place without question?

If the guidelines are bogus (which I believe they are) I don't see any reason to respect them. BTW, the guidelines weren't always this ludicrous. Immigration was a lot easier not too long ago.

Explain to me in what ways it is ludicrous. I'm not arguing that it isn't but I'm curious what most offends you about the process.

At minimum, I would define a responsible citizen as one who is law abiding.

 

[Naturalist_Atheist]

If the decision were up to me. I would fine the crap out of American businesses that employ illegals. Something like $5,000 fine for every illegal head on your payroll. And maybe a $10,000 fine for second offenders. I think this would be much more effective than a silly wall along our boarders that illegals will clime over anyway.

I think if we can stop businesses from hiring illegals, we won't have to deport anyone. Without a means to make a living all the illegals walk right back accross the border to their home countries without us lifting a finger. Indeed we will make a little money off fining the illegal business practices.

I am all for fixing our immigration system. My main concern, however, is that it is as fair as possible. We need to decide how many immigrants we can take in a year. Then develope a way to take in people from all around the world. Allow a relative percentage from each country. Take into account that countries popullace.

My problem with the illegal immigrants who are living here is not a personal one. I understand they're trying to make a life for themselves, but everyone needs to realize poor people exist all over the world. Why shouldn't a Kenyan have the same chance to become an American as a Mexican?

There are people who have risked their lives to become an American, and now everyone's saying, "Hey, if you can break our laws and find a way in, we'll eventually grant you amnesty." To me this line of thinking is a blatant slap in the face for all those people all around the world, who are waiting their turn. Right now. Waiting their 8 or 10 years and sending in form after form as someone mentioned above. Not to mention all the Americans that had to sign up for the Veitnam conflict to recieve citizenship.

Anyway, I think this situation is easily fixed. If you eliminate the source of income for the illegals, they will leave on their own. Again, I agree that changes should be made to our immigration system, but that in no way justifies amnesty for law breakers.